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How would the NYT react if Joe Biden gave an excuse this lame?

May 17, 2009 8:33 pm ET by Jamison Foser

Here's Maureen Dowd's explanation for how her column came to contain a 42 word passage -- commas and all -- lifted without attribution from Josh Marshall:

I didn't read his blog last week, and didn't have any idea he had made that point until you informed me just now.


i was talking to a friend of mine Friday about what I was writing who suggested I make this point, expressing it in a cogent -- and I assumed spontaneous -- way and I wanted to weave the idea into my column.

but, clearly, my friend must have read josh marshall without mentioning that to me.

Here's what Marshall wrote:

More and more the timeline is raising the question of why, if the torture was to prevent terrorist attacks, it seemed to happen mainly during the period when we were looking for what was essentially political information to justify the invasion of Iraq.

And here's what appeared in the New York Times under Maureen Dowd's byline:

More and more the timeline is raising the question of why, if the torture was to prevent terrorist attacks, it seemed to happen mainly during the period when the Bush crowd was looking for what was essentially political information to justify the invasion of Iraq.

So, does it seem even remotely plausible that Maureen Dowd had a conversation with a friend in which the friend repeated 42 words written by Josh Marshall, and that Dowd later typed those 42 words perfectly, with the commas in the same place, from memory?  Of course it doesn't.  (And by the way: Even if you take Dowd's explanation at face value -- which you probably shouldn't -- she still has some explaining to do.  Because based on Dowd's story, she didn't "weave" her friend's "idea" into her column; she passed her friend's thoughts off as her own, lifting them word-for-word.)

So how do you think Maureen Dowd would react if, say, Joe Biden ripped off a few dozen of someone else's words, then offered up an excuse this lame?  Or if Al Gore did?

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    • Author by jonwisby (May 17, 2009 9:20 pm ET)
         
      I saw this earlier on another site. I believe in coincidence; but, this falls well outside the bounds of coincidence.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by mybrotherskeeper (May 18, 2009 1:58 pm ET)
           
        A May 18 correction gives full credit to Josh Marshall, whose comments now apppear in quotes, and notes Dowd's failure to give proper attribution.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by LuvLuLu (May 20, 2009 8:27 am ET)
             
          Yes, once she was informed that her friend had copied Josh Marshall without attribution, Mo fixed it.
          Report Abuse
    • Author by seeryer (May 17, 2009 9:28 pm ET)
      4  
      It seems to me someone else writes her columns, or at least she did not write this one. That, to me, is the most interesting aspect of this situation. Because if someone puts their byline on a column that person knows they would be held to account for what is contained in it. Presumably Dowd would know that she couldn't just get away with throwing in "Bush crowd" for "we" with the NYT and online audience her coulmns attract. Many, I assume also visit TPM daily. Someone stabbed her in the back or she is more dumb than she sounds on Meet the Press. Which is pretty dumb by the way, so it isn't like the bar is very high as it is. Either way is not good. It is time she gets the boot anyway? How about Boehlert to the NYT?
      Report Abuse
      • Author by seeryer (May 17, 2009 9:29 pm ET)
        3  
        Or Foser:-)
        Report Abuse
      • Author by DesertVet91 (May 17, 2009 11:15 pm ET)
           
        Seeryer said it better than I could have.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by carlileb5935 (May 18, 2009 1:36 am ET)
        1  
        Yup, Modo has a ghost writer. What she does is she has someone else work up the spine of her columns, then she juices it up with gags and one-liners.

        Sadly, this kind of thing happens all the time (trust me on this-- I'm a copy editor.) You'd be surprised how few people write all of their own material-- or the amount of editing that goes into things. Real surprised.

        It's journalism's (and academia's) dirty little secret. And-- like the atrocious Doris Kearns Goodwin (a true phony) Modo got caught.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by dexteritas0071418 (May 18, 2009 10:47 am ET)
           
        I didn't read this before I wrote my own post, in which I made some of the same points...plagarism!!!!!

        j/k, good post.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by LuvLuLu (May 17, 2009 11:17 pm ET)
      3 2
      I expect what she meant by her comment that she and her friend were having a conversation was that they were doing it via email, and the friend 'made this point' by copying what Josh Marshall had said without telling Maureen Dowd that it was a direct copy of what Josh had typed.

      It doesn't make it right, and her excuse/apology sucked, but I am not sure it's a big deal since it was likely her friend's fault for using someone else's published words as her own. I don't think there's an issue if Maureen Dowd uses her friend's unpublished words in an email if she thinks the phraseology is sound and fits the need.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by carlileb5935 (May 18, 2009 1:42 am ET)
        2 1
        Are you kidding? It's called plagiarism ! And who would cite copy verbatim as their own, to anyone, by email or whatever? You wouldn't do that-- you'd link to the copy, or cut and paste it.

        Which is exactly what happened. Modo should get officially suspended for this-- it violates every paper's handbook-- and Marshall should talk to some lawyers. He might make money off of it-- he at least should make a big deal of it behind the scenes.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by LuvLuLu (May 20, 2009 8:29 am ET)
          1  
          What a jerk you are on a regular basis.

          Copying a friend's comment, a non-copywrited sentence, is not plagiarism. Get a clue.

          It doesn't violate any paper's handbook. Not a single one.
          Report Abuse
        • Author by LuvLuLu (May 20, 2009 8:33 am ET)
             
          And, in fact, if you read Mo's comment above, she says that the friend wanted her to make this exact point, and she thought the friend said it quite well, so she used her words. The friend WANTED her to do this, if you believe Mo's story.

          It make sense, and your personal attacks and outraged behavior are, as usual, way over the top. Thanks for the troll rating for me expressing my original opinion in a very polite way. There was nothing about my post that was worthy of a down rating.
          Report Abuse
    • Author by solon (May 18, 2009 10:05 am ET)
         
      Very unethical. Who does Mo think she is Ann Coulter?
      Report Abuse
    • Author by dexteritas0071418 (May 18, 2009 10:46 am ET)
        1
      1. Plagarism. It was such an obvious lift from a very recent publishing, that it seems Dowd likely has a ghostwriter or some sort of writer/editor working on the columns she's putting her name on.

      That being said, I fail to see how this is conservative misinformation at all; the point of the passage that was plagarized does nothing but hurt the conservative/GOP side on this issue. To me, it smacks of taking an opportunity to stick it in to an editorial columnist (and a mostly liberal one) who has the audacity to criticize and poke fun at progressive/dem leaders from time to time.

      MMfA can't seriously be a general media watchdog...because it's partisan and biased. Stick to the conservative misinformation.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by seeryer (May 18, 2009 5:15 pm ET)
           
        MMFA is a conservative media watchdog. County Fair blog appears to highlight media mistakes and errors as they occur with most emphasis on conservative errors. This particular refference has more to do with the power of liberal blogs and TPM in particular. And how careless a columnist at the most prestigous newspaper in America has become. Dowd is an unserious narcissist who gets labled liberal but we don't want her. Dowd is considered a liberal because Bush was president for 8 years. Her only ideology is MoDowdism.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by Meremark (May 18, 2009 11:14 am ET)
         
      "I was talking to a friend of mine" is (vapid) celebrity-speak for 'I have a ghost-writer.'

      Who gets the palest figure of The Big Bucks.

      Former Alaska senator Ted Stevens was ... asked about how progress on his memoirs is going, Stevens replied, “It’s a hell of task.” However, Stevens may be open to working with a ghostwriter, telling the Washington Post, “Well, I don’t know that I’m writing it.


      ... and he didn't know he was building an opulent sarcophagal Permafrost Palace, either.

      Report Abuse

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