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"Fertile Ground": White Nationalists Organize Within Tea Party

August 03, 2011 11:26 am ET by David Holthouse

Addressing a rally in April 2011, white nationalist lawyer William Johnson lamented the media scrutiny he drew with his recent failed campaign for a judgeship in California.

White nationalist lawyer William Johnson at San Juan Capistrano rally

"Ron Paul endorsed me for Superior Court judge, and I was on my way," Johnson said. "No sooner than I'd put my hat in the ring than ... it came out that Johnson is a white nationalist, that Johnson wants to create a separate white ethno-state, that Johnson supports the 14 words of [white power domestic terrorist] David Lane, that 'We must secure the existence of our people and a future for white children,' and the media went wild with all of that, and Ron Paul withdrew his endorsement of me...because he did not believe in a separate white ethno-state and he didn't know that I did." 

A white ethno-state? The 14 words?

Johnson sounded like he was at a neo-Nazi conference,  as in 1986 when he addressed the Aryan Nations World Congress. But the banner hanging over the stage was not a Swastika flag. It read: "Tax Day Tea Party."

The April 16 rally in San Juan Capistrano, California, corresponded with more than 100 Tea Party rallies scheduled across the country for that Saturday. It was promoted on the website of Tea Party.org, also known as 1776 Tea Party, one of six well-established Tea Party umbrella groups. Its true organizers, however, were from American Third Position, or A3P, a white nationalist political party founded by racist skinheads. A3P did not respond to repeated inquiries for this article. Neither did 1776 Tea Party.

Since April 2010, A3P members have organized, co-sponsored or freely distributed literature at no fewer than 10 Tea Party rallies in six states, including Augusta, Georgia; Harrison, Arkansas; Baton Rogue, Louisiana and throughout California, where A3P was founded in May 2009 by Freedom 14, a racist skinhead crew seeking to establish a more respectable-seeming political front group.

Although it would be unfair to characterize the Tea Party movement on the whole as white nationalist, it's clear that large gatherings of angry, conservative, predominately white Americans are viewed with relish by groups like A3P.

"The Tea Parties are fertile ground for our activists," said A3P Pennsylvania Chairman Steve Smith. "Tea Party supporters and the A3P share much common ground with regard to our political agendas."

The A3P official position on race in America is clear: "If current demographic trends persist, European-Americans will become a minority in America in only a few decades time. The American Third Position will not allow this to happen."

Johnson, the national chairman of A3P, has previously called for deporting all non-whites, regardless of citizenship.This includes anyone with any "ascertainable trace of Negro blood" or more than one-eighth "non-European or non-white blood."  A3P directors include white nationalist radio host James Edwards and California State University, Long Beach, professor of psychology Kevin MacDonald, who according to the Southern Poverty Law Center, a leading authority on hate groups, is "the neo-Nazi movement's favorite academic" because he theorizes that Jews are "genetically driven to destroy Western society."

At least two of the Tea Party rallies where A3P has distributed white nationalist literature were organized by local chapters of Tea Party Patriots, the largest Tea Party group in the country.

Tea Party Patriots co-founder and national chairman Mark Meckler told Media Matters that it's "numerically impossible" for his group to have representatives monitoring every rally sponsored by Tea Party Patriots.

"As a national umbrella organization with over 3,500 chapters, we obviously don't have folks from the national organization at every rally to monitor literature distribution," said Meckler.

Meckler said he was unaware of A3P or its presence at Tea Party rallies until contacted by Media Matters. "We would absolutely ban any white nationalist group from our organization if we found them to be trying to get involved," he said. "We have a 100 percent zero tolerance policy towards this type of group. This type of activity has no place in the legitimate Tea Party movement. They [A3P] are hiding behind a Tea Party banner. Thanks for bringing this to our attention. We'll be on the lookout."

Tea Party leaders have been on warning about racism in their ranks since last July, when the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People adopted a resolution calling on Tea Party leaders to  condemn "racist elements" within the Tea Party movement and reject bigotry in their ranks.

"We take no issue with the Tea Party movement. We believe in freedom of assembly and people raising their voices in a democracy," NAACP President Benjamin Todd Jealous said in a written statement at the time. "What we take issue with is the Tea Party's continued tolerance for bigotry and bigoted statements."

"The time has come for them to accept the responsibility that comes with influence and make clear there is no place for racism & anti-Semitism, homophobia and other forms of bigotry in their movement."

Right-wing reaction was typical. On Fox News, conservative political commentator Andrea Tantaros called the resolution a "ploy to get blacks angry, to get them out to vote. It's class warfare, it's race warfare."

Sarah Palin posted to her Facebook page: "I am saddened by the NAACP's claim that patriotic Americans who stand up for the United States of America's Constitutional rights are somehow 'racists.' The charge that Tea Party Americans judge people by the color of their skin is false, appalling, and is a regressive and diversionary tactic to change the subject at hand."

Ten days before the NAACP passed the anti-bigotry resolution, an A3P "super activist" team openly distributed A3P literature at a Tea Party rally in Morristown, New Jersey that drew roughly 600 attendees. "Everyone accepted our literature and we received enthusiastic responses from most takers," read a bulletin posted to the A3P website. "Needless to say, [the Tea Party rally was] almost exclusively comprised of our people varying only by age, socio-economic status and temperament. ... It is crucial that we network at...implicitly white activities such as Tea Parties and Euro festivals to bring the message of hope to our people."

Since the NAACP resolution was passed, A3P teams have continued to distribute literature at Tea Party rallies, most recently documented on April 16.  On that date, at the same time the A3P-organized Tea Party rally in San Juan Capistrano, California, was preparing to get underway, A3P members in New Jersey handed out white nationalist pamphlets at the Tax Day Tea Party rally, once again in Morristown. [A3P has active chapters in 14 states, but is particularly strong in New Jersey, where in the summer of 2010 it absorbed the League of American Patriots, a white power group known for distributing racist pamphlets and requiring its members to be heterosexuals of "complete European American ancestry," according to the SPLC.]

The glossy color pamphlets A3P distributes at Tea Party rallies are subtle to a degree. They do not depict hate group symbols or quote the 14 words, and their language is careful. One pamphlet, "American Jobs For American Workers," pledges to "Fight Crime and Restore Confidence."

"The PC madness that binds the hands of law enforcement will be scrapped, and the police will be allowed to do their job," it reads. The same pamphlet explains that A3P will "expel illegal aliens" to protect "our people."

"It isn't right and it isn't fair that, while millions of Americans face unemployment or the prospect of unemployment, millions of foreign peoples are brought into our land against our will," it reads. "It amplifies the problem, and our people deserve better." Variations on this rhetorical sleight-of-hand using economic anxiety to promote white nationalist ideology are the main thrust of A3P's participation in Tea Party branded rallies, whether in distributed literature or polemics from the stage.

At the April 16 rally in San Juan Capistrano, Johnson was preceded at the podium by prominent Holocaust denier Mark Weber, director of the Institute for Historical Review. "Ladies and gentlemen, we're here because we're angry, we're upset and we're outraged at what's happened to our country," Weber said. "Our country has been transformed demographically and culturally during the past 50 years in a way that most of us never approved, never subscribed to.... As bad as the economic crisis is and has been for the past two years, and as bad as the problems are in Washington and in Sacramento about the budget, those pale in significance to the greater, deeper problems culturally and demographically in our society."

Later in his speech, Weber celebrated the Tea Party movement. "We're here along with people who are meeting with rallies all over California and all over the country," he said.

He swiftly returned to attacking demographic change.

Political leaders "lie and deceive our people," Weber said. "Most of all they tell us this foolish lie, over and over, that 'diversity is our strength.' ... It's an effort to tell us all that we should not only accept but embrace our own dispossession as a people and as a country."

A3P's table next to Council of Conservative Citizens' table

The A3P literature booth at the rally was located next to a booth maintained by the Council of Conservative Citizens. CCC opposes all efforts to "to mix the races of mankind" and has referred to African-Americans as a "retrograde species of humanity."

Musical entertainment came in the form of right-wing country singer Traven Tucker, best known for his blood-and-soil anthem "Ordinary Man." Its lyrics are to the point:

I got a rebel flag and a pickup truck/12-gauge shotgun I keep for luck/And I don't like what I see.

I'm a peaceful man, but you cross the line/Tell you now I don't mind you dyin'/For my freedom to be free

Take a good look into these eyes/It wouldn't be prudent or wise/To spend another minute on my land.

[...]

Well, I got an ideal and a little hope/Get a really tall tree and a short piece of rope/I'd say that'd do just fine/So I better see you get up on your feet/And I better see you run to hit that street/Get off before I change my mind.

You don't think I can change the world/Well I don't think you understand/Don't you ever underestimate me-- I'm no average, I'm extraordinary man.

Expand All Expand 1st Level Collapse All Add Comment
    • Author by Imbecile (August 03, 2011 11:43 am ET)
      44 5
      What was that the teabaggers were saying about their movement having nothing to do with race again?
      Report Abuse
      • Author by Andy Kreiss (August 03, 2011 6:00 pm ET)
        16 4
        These are obviously liberal plants. Or aberrations that have nothing to do with the true Tea party. Or photoshopped, or revisionist history... or something, anything to allow the teabaggers to remain in their deep state of denial.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by 4teepee (August 04, 2011 3:48 pm ET)
        4 6
        The Tea Party crowd was already a hangout for racist supporters of Zionist expansionism and Israel's ethnic cleansing of the indigenous Palestinian people. Sarah Palin is a case in point.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by hoopvillain (August 04, 2011 8:00 pm ET)
        5 2
        They lied.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by m.welker (August 03, 2011 11:47 am ET)
      13 2
      Traven Trucker. What a poet.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by montanabuddha (August 03, 2011 11:59 am ET)
      11 2
      Nothing new to me.

      Here is a link and another
      Report Abuse
      • Author by montanabuddha (August 03, 2011 12:56 pm ET)
        9 1
        This one seals the DEAL.

        Unbelievable
        Report Abuse
        • Author by chazmanr (August 03, 2011 2:13 pm ET)
          11 1
          Gee, thanks for putting me in a good mood. That was disgusting. Do these people even listen to themselves? The guy basically said, "We are not racists and bigots, but here is why we hate brown people."
          Report Abuse
        • Author by raddave43 (August 03, 2011 4:03 pm ET)
          6 1
          This one is even better.
          Report Abuse
        • Author by Andy Kreiss (August 03, 2011 6:35 pm ET)
          7 2
          Notice something here? Sort of related to Boswell's comment below, about the teabaggers thinking they're fooling people... this item has been up for over seven hours, and no wingnuts commenting yet.

          They just pretend certain things don't exist if they ignore them.

          If any right wingers do decide to comment here, you know it's going to be something really crazy.
          Report Abuse
        • Author by Palindumbandsimple (August 05, 2011 1:21 am ET)
             
          "..Am i racist cuz i hate N!!gers? ..."lol

          The best prt of what he said was when he said something like......." the uneducated liberals" This guy. Calling people like me uneducated.....lol REally. REALLY. That guy.

          That guy is why i hate white people. How can anyone whos objective say the tea party is not full of racists. Of course not all of them are racist. But if you look objectively you have to say most of them are.

          But more importantly, I think its been proven who the uneducated folks in this country are. Don't the studies all say people who watch fox news are the most misinformed ??
          Report Abuse
    • Author by ScienceBuff (August 03, 2011 12:01 pm ET)
      19 3
      "The Tea Parties are fertile ground for our activists," said A3P Pennsylvania Chairman Steve Smith. "Tea Party supporters and the A3P share much common ground with regard to our political agendas."
      Says a lot, doesn't it?
      Report Abuse
      • Author by tbone (August 03, 2011 12:21 pm ET)
        17 2
        Jim: "What did you expect? 'Welcome, Sonny'? 'Make yourself at home'? 'Marry my daughter'? You've got to remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know. Morons."
        Report Abuse
    • Author by Spooky Dooooooooood (August 03, 2011 12:10 pm ET)
      8 1
      OH for cryin' out loud! You gotta be kiddin me! I did not see that one coming!!! NO, seriously!
      Report Abuse
    • Author by heehee..santorum (August 03, 2011 12:19 pm ET)
      12 2
      Whodathunkit? It is like a Tea Party within a Tea Party, no? And to be just as cataclysmic sounding as Glenn Beck, only with a slightly larger probability of actually occurring, within that core Freakshow of true believers is the Zombie who will be tweaked enough to cause harm. I may be a simpleton, but read ONE days postings at The Blaze, and the law of averages says one of these lunies MEANS IT.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by ponymeup (August 04, 2011 5:08 pm ET)
        5 3
        You aren't being paranoid pal. I got cold hard cash that says you are 100% accurate. These clowns might, just might have organized a small block party by themselves, but the Koch's, Aryans, separatists, etc. saw a fertile unseeded field just waiting to be tilled and worked. And great soil it turned out to be. Looks like a couple of bumper crops of nuts comin' are way and quickly. What Obama is going through as POTUS is downright sick. However it is nothing but a 2011 version of the old south 100 years ago. Tell me you CAN'T picture Mitch McConnel as a plantation owner who is teaching the other "negros" a public lesson to "tow the line". The rest of the world is looking t America as a bunch of biggoted idiots right now. We are starting to make Nazis look tame. I am sick to call myself American. SICK!
        Report Abuse
        • Author by heehee..santorum (August 04, 2011 7:16 pm ET)
          3 1
          Beck all along struck me as VERY influenced by television. Sometimes he talks about a show or movie like it was reality. I don't know if he believes his own sh!t or if it is just a paycheck, but they are coming out of the woodwork on the Blaze. He will eventually be asked to account for cultivating the anger and fear, I don't think he cares.
          Report Abuse
    • Author by Proud Lefty (August 03, 2011 12:26 pm ET)
         
      File this under, "Not Surprised".
      Report Abuse
    • Author by uncle.billy (August 03, 2011 12:26 pm ET)
      7 2
      Keep your day job pal, you're no David Allan Coe...
      Report Abuse
    • Author by Egbert Souse (August 03, 2011 12:31 pm ET)
      15 2

      Steve Smith: NFL player Harry Hamilton has 'anti-white' agenda
      July 21, 2011
      American Voice - A3P

      Pennsylvania A3P Chair Steve Smith writes in The [Wilkes-Barre, PA] Times Leader:

      "Recently, former NFL player Harry Hamilton, who happens to be black, announced his intention to run for Luzerne County [PA] judge. He cited the lack of diversity in the county courthouse as what sparked his potential candidacy.

      We need to be perfectly clear that when people such as Hamilton call for more diversity, they are being anti-white. If the courthouse were 100 percent black, would he see the need for more diversity? Would Hamilton be disappointed that there were no white court officials? I highly doubt it.

      Leftist liberals love to repeat this slogan: 'Diversity is our strength.' Does that mean to them that companies, schools and governments that are 100 percent white are weak? That sure sounds anti-white to me."

      [A3P:] Ouch! What an excellent letter!


      Steve Smith, who happens to be white, is a "patriotic Americans who stand up for the United States of America's Constitutional rights." Steve will be appearing in the September issue of Skinhead Quarterly - Fall Fashion Preview.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by wookie (August 03, 2011 1:24 pm ET)
        10 1
        If the courthouse were 100 percent black, would he see the need for more diversity?


        It's amazing that that kind of simplistic and stupid rhetoric is so effective.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by Conchobhar (August 03, 2011 4:44 pm ET)
          10 1
          When my family moved to the D.C. area in 1953, the Washington Redskins were owned by a virulent racist named George Preston Marshall, who wouldn't have a black man on his team. Appropriately enough his team was the league doormat. A successful season was being able to brag that they'd held Jimmy Brown to under 100 yards in each of the two games with Cleveland. Forget wins; that was terra incognita.

          So, yeah, Steve, that 100% white team was definitely weak. And your logic is nonexistent. When you cut yourself off from 40 to 60% of the talent pool, you can't help but weaken yourself.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by Brabantio (August 04, 2011 12:16 am ET)
            4 1
            That post will forever make my memories of Doug Williams' performance in the Super Bowl all the better.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by Conchobhar (August 04, 2011 10:53 am ET)
              3 1
              Oh, yeah. I thought that was a beautiful irony...loved it.
              Report Abuse
            • Author by pilotshark (August 04, 2011 11:47 am ET)
              3 1
              and the MVP

              Doug were you going now

              I am going to Disney land!

              smiling that was a great moment.
              Report Abuse
    • Author by Egbert Souse (August 03, 2011 12:36 pm ET)
      7 2

      Expanding A3P Absorbs Another Hate Group
      Posted: July 29, 2011
      Southern Poverty Law Center
      Report Abuse
    • Author by pete592 (August 03, 2011 1:01 pm ET)
      9 2
      Revealing, but not surprising.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by beDecent (August 03, 2011 1:09 pm ET)
      15 3
      This is why they freak out when you call out the racist overtones of the Tea Party; they want to keep this dirty little secret just that: a secret.

      If the Tea Party were truly motivated by taxes alone, they would keep out of social politics. But they don't. They are very vocal about their view for American culture, and it doesn't include immigrants, gays, liberals, feminists, intellects, etc.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by Boswell (August 03, 2011 1:51 pm ET)
        8 2
        they like to think they are being subtle and fooling everyone else. it would almost funny if they were not so violently stupid.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by Andy Kreiss (August 03, 2011 6:12 pm ET)
          6 3
          I know what you mean, it's not really funny, but I do get some laughs a the new-style racists, the ones who think that, as long as they don't scream " I am a racist!", anybody who notices their code words and covert racism is just imagining things ( or playing the race card, or "the real racist")

          I guess the silver lining to it is that, on at least one issue, right wingers at least are aware enough to realize that their ideas are not accepted by society at large. The fact that most of them are careful not to be too blatant with their racism shows that at least they're capable of eventually learning something.

          What I do find funny is how anonymous posters at websites try so hard to deny the racist roots of so much wingnuttery. I keep myself in a couple of email loops with right wing acquaintances, just to see what they're up to. It's mostly the same old crap, taxes, immigration, "political correctness", and a very big helping of racism.

          And the right wingers who post here and at other sites ( aside from the few honest and proud racists) are in lockstep with all of these propaganda emails, on every topic, except for the racist stuff. Somehow, that part of the program doesn't appeal to them.

          I guess they think that's plausible.
          Report Abuse
    • Author by beDecent (August 03, 2011 1:11 pm ET)
      8 2
      Also, those lyrics are just one example as to why country sucks. "Get a really tall tree and a short piece of rope"? Nice, real nice.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by heehee..santorum (August 03, 2011 4:06 pm ET)
      8 3
      First Priority For Stereotypical Race Hater In this Battle: Ask yourself if Willie Johnson is a good cracker handle.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by whatIthink (August 03, 2011 9:16 pm ET)
      7 2
      It's been well documented that from the very begining of the teabaggers, Stormfront has seen it and used as a prime recruitment group.

      To the teabaggers, next time you cry about not being racist and that the left is just as, if not more, racist, point to one liberal group that white power groups use as recruiting grounds.

      Let's go to a rally

      Finding rescruits

      Of course, you'll never hear the teabaggers denouncing groups like Stormfront

      Report Abuse
      • Author by Brabantio (August 04, 2011 12:34 am ET)
        7 3
        It's been well documented that from the very begining of the teabaggers, Stormfront has seen it and used as a prime recruitment group.
        Well, of course. This is one of those things that has a definite "X factor" of racism. It may not be borne of it, entirely, but there's clearly racism involved.

        And I think a big part of the reason for this is that there really is no definitive and sensible cause for the Tea Parties. It's just generalized protest. If you focus on an issue, then it's easy to weed out the people that are there for other reasons. "Those people don't belong here." But when you're just whining about Obama being in office, it's very hard to tell whether this guy or that guy is complaining based on blind partisanship, issues, or skin color.

        The question is; is this lack of ideological self-policing simply convenient for racists, or part of the design? Personally, I wouldn't have a hard time predicting that aimless rancor against a black President would probably bring around some people who are not particularly fond of black people in general. Maybe that's just me.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by Andy Kreiss (August 04, 2011 1:42 am ET)
          10 3
          Interesting question. The Teabaggers like to whine that nobody can prove that everybody in the tea party is racist, or that racism is a major driving factor in the phony movement. They don't seem to understand how obvious it is.

          And this item has been up for 14 hours now, 100% wingnut-free. More deafening silence. You know a lot of them have clicked on this article, then just stuck their fingers in their ears, closed their eyes and chanted " Lalalalalalala I can't see this!".
          Report Abuse
          • Author by montanabuddha (August 04, 2011 4:39 pm ET)
            4 3
            Over 24hrs and hardly a drive-by thumbs downer.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by Andy Kreiss (August 06, 2011 9:56 am ET)
              4  
              Ah, we have a taker. poprox is going with a straw man, and the " Yeah, but communists are bad like racists !" angle.

              Like I said above, if any wingnuts showed up, it would be to post something crazy.
              Report Abuse
          • Author by poproxx77 (August 04, 2011 5:46 pm ET)
            3 8
            Its obvious that everyone in the Tea PArty is racist. Thereyou go again making assumptions with no basis in reality.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by dazednamused (August 04, 2011 7:58 pm ET)
              5 3
              Everyone? Nope. But where do racists go when they want to engage in a lil' politickin' ... hmmmmmmm, I wonder ...
              Report Abuse
            • Author by whatIthink (August 05, 2011 7:10 am ET)
              6 3
              No, moron, that's the lie you teabaggers tell yourselves: "liberals say we're all racists". No one is saying of the sort. What is being said is that you have blatant racists among you, yet say and do nothing about it except make excuses or lame counter arguments. See the difference?
              Report Abuse
            • Author by kabniel (August 06, 2011 3:20 am ET)
              4  
              pox

              The logical fallcy here is of course the strawman argument. Cough up the person sho said that everyone in the teaparty is racist or admit you are pitiful
              Report Abuse
              • Author by Andy Kreiss (August 06, 2011 10:01 am ET)
                4  
                I'll admit, the way I wrote this may have been a little confusing;

                The Teabaggers like to whine that nobody can prove that everybody in the tea party is racist, or that racism is a major driving factor in the phony movement. They don't seem to understand how obvious it is.


                What I meant was that they seem to think that one needs to prove that every teabagger is racist, otherwise they think it's a fact that there's no racism behind it.

                I didn't mean it's obvious that every teabagger is racist, I meant it's obvious that there's a lot of racism in the tea party,and their defense tactic is transparent.
                Report Abuse
    • Author by FNC Liberal (August 04, 2011 4:16 am ET)
      5 2
      How many members of A3P watch Fox News Channel? Or listen to Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Neal Boortz or other conservative talkers?

      Someone needs to videotape these rallies.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by cst (August 04, 2011 9:19 am ET)
      4 4
      This thread has a noticible lack of counter-arguements. Not even a drive-by thumbsdowner!
      Report Abuse
    • Author by o rly (August 04, 2011 10:48 am ET)
      5 2
      If you can stomach it, go to Stormfront. There is a tea party forum. The white racists are very upfront about the tea party being an ideal recruiting ground for other white racists. So it's not just liberals who say the tea party is racist, it's the white nationalists.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by wareagle (August 04, 2011 1:55 pm ET)
      6 10
      This title reminds me of the Marxists, Socialists, and Communists that hide in the Democratic Party. LOL


      Report Abuse
      • Author by NotSure8 (August 04, 2011 2:59 pm ET)
           
        MMfA showed their evidence, where's yours?
        Report Abuse
      • Author by Old_Benjamin (August 04, 2011 4:00 pm ET)
        7 5
        Really? Then you are quite stupid.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by dazednamused (August 04, 2011 8:03 pm ET)
          7 3
          I love how morons like Hannity have implanted this notion in his viewers' heads that Marxism and Socialism are code words for totalitarian communism, which is a bastardization of the two.

          Pure Marxism: The workers control the means of production.
          Pure Socialism: The greatest good for the greatest number of people.

          Ummmm, check and check on my resume. Dolts! All of you!
          Report Abuse
          • Author by poproxx77 (August 05, 2011 11:56 am ET)
            2 7
            dazednamused is an appropriate description of your logic.
            Report Abuse
          • Author by poproxx77 (August 05, 2011 1:43 pm ET)
            2 6
            The line between communism and progressivism is blurry at best. Your characterization of the difference between "pure marxism" and "pure socialism" is a cognitive attempt at dilluting the truth. Pure Capitalism: The greatest good for the greatest number of people. It has the same exact definition, in terms that you set. The purpose of capitalism is maximize the distribution of goods and sevices through market forces. Socialism is to fairly (not maximize) distribute goods and services through centralized government. They both have the same goal though, the greatest good for the greatest number of people. One is based on free enterprise and one is based on central planning.

            Trying to distinguish between pure marxism and pure socialism with silly contrived definitions proves who is the real dolt.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by peace4all (August 05, 2011 3:20 pm ET)
              3 2
              capitalism is a failed idealogy. it has failed everytime it has been tried. the robber barons of the 19th century failed, it failed again after 1929. and it failed again in 2008. how many times does it have to fail before you try something else?
              Report Abuse
            • Author by kabniel (August 06, 2011 3:26 am ET)
              3 2
              pox

              You are a LIAR. You are very stupid and very brainwashed but mostly you are a LIAR.

              Pure capitalism NEVER had as its goal the greatest good for the greatest number of people. NEVER. Pure capitalism is a way to protect priveledge and amass the greatest wealth possible among the already wealthy. That is the OBVIOUS goal of capitalism.

              Your every post proves that YOU are indeed the dolt
              Report Abuse
      • Author by poproxx77 (August 04, 2011 5:40 pm ET)
        3 8
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wkw7n9Qagu8
        Report Abuse
        • Author by ScienceBuff (August 04, 2011 10:36 pm ET)
          9 3
          So you think people who favor a socialistic economic system are equivalent to white separatists? Does their demonstrating equate to white supremacists recruiting from teabaggers? Can you see how weak your effort at defense is?
          Report Abuse
          • Author by poproxx77 (August 05, 2011 12:58 pm ET)
            3 5
            Delusional much? If you don't see the communist recruiting going on its only because you don't want to. If you think communism is any better than white separatist racists then your state of delusion scary.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by ScienceBuff (August 05, 2011 1:59 pm ET)
              4 1
              So, you honestly do see an equivalence between a group that favors a certain economic system and groups that want to relegate huge numbers of Americans to second class status or even have them fully removed from the country. Don't bother trying to get that moral compass repaired. It's broken beyond all hope.
              Report Abuse
              • Author by poproxx77 (August 05, 2011 2:28 pm ET)
                1 6
                Is that what communism/socialism is to you, a "certain economic system"? You should read YOUR "Bible" more closely. Don't bother getting your reality meter checked its obviously broken and you don't want to fix it.
                Report Abuse
                • Author by ScienceBuff (August 05, 2011 2:31 pm ET)
                  5 1
                  Communism and socialism are different and, yes, they are economic systems. And they are both very different from American liberalism. What do you think they are? And what is this "bible" you imagine me consulting?
                  Report Abuse
                  • Author by Vesus (August 05, 2011 3:43 pm ET)
                    4 1
                    In his world, everyone who isn't a tea party faux-conservative keeps a copy of the Communist Manifesto next to their pillow while dreaming about some socialist utopia.

                    I guess life is easier when you see everything as black and white, good and bad.
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                    • Author by poproxx77 (August 05, 2011 4:07 pm ET)
                      1 5
                      Print perfect MMFA response. Keep it up, fake it till you make it.
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                  • Author by poproxx77 (August 05, 2011 4:17 pm ET)
                    1 6
                    ScienceBuff-Obviously you didn't watch the video, because there were communists and socialists minging and recruiting at the rally.

                    The only difference between socialism and communism is that socialist suffer the delusion that central planning can coincide with capitalism. It doesn't work, capitalism can't support socialism, its playing out accross the western world right now.

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                    • Author by communista (August 05, 2011 10:57 pm ET)
                         
                      the vid only said it was a "liberal" rally and made no mention of which party organized it, so in your mind liberal=democrat. also tell norway and sweden that capitalism is incompatible with socialism.
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                    • Author by kabniel (August 06, 2011 3:34 am ET)
                      3 1
                      pox

                      You are too stupid to try to tell us anything about reality. Mixed economies have worked quite well in Europe, Japan, for several decades. Capitalism in its pure form will eat itself everytime. Communism is naive in its thinking that those who get the centralized power will then relinquish it. Either one would work FINE if people were perfect were never greed for wealth or power.

                      What is necessary is to not deify the system. To be ready to regulate and make adjustments to the systems to compensate for the fact people are imperfect. When you deify the system and put IT above the needs of the people it is supposed to serve that is where the problem comes in

                      In short when people become as stupid and as brainwashed as YOU are, that is where the trouble starts.

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                    • Author by ScienceBuff (August 06, 2011 10:24 am ET)
                      6  
                      I watched the video. I've seen it before when one of you clowns posted it under the illusion that it's significant. So what? I'm still amazed that you think people who favor a fringe economic system (and it is just economics) are somehow equivalent to groups who want to relegate millions of Americans to second class status or even favor removing them from the country. And it is significant that they have found success recruiting at teabagger events, the fact that you're trying to divert attention from.
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                • Author by kabniel (August 06, 2011 3:29 am ET)
                  2 1
                  pox

                  My GOD your stupidity has become epic in its scope. Of COURSE communism and socialism are economic systems as is capitalism.

                  That you think communism is ever mentioned in the bible makes your delusions simply laughable. Read Acts sometime. How the apostles handled their money. It reads like a socialist tract.

                  Please tell us some more about reality meters that is hilarious. You are far too stupid to even recognize reality.
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      • Author by Boswell (August 04, 2011 7:26 pm ET)
        4 3
        sadly you can't define those terms and just parrot them from your talking points sheet
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      • Author by kabniel (August 06, 2011 3:22 am ET)
        2  
        wareagle

        Then you are either stunningly stupid or you are a LIAR. I am sure it amuses you to be reminded of the imaginary people you are so afraid of you cower under your bed
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    • Author by ponymeup (August 04, 2011 4:55 pm ET)
      6 3
      I for one am shocked! I can't believe all this time that the Vanilla Ice Cream of political parties I so believed in is racist. Why just last week we had a negro as one of our security forces at our last Kla..... I mean group meetings. Shocked I tell you! I bet the commie lefties try and blow this one out of proportion too. Looks like someone pulled on the wrong string in that knitted sweater that Uncle Koch gave him.
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      • Author by ahorton (August 05, 2011 11:40 am ET)
          1
        My wife takes offense to being called a "Negro." She happens to be a Proud unhyphenated American who happens to be a Black Woman and a TEA Partier!
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    • Author by blk-in-alabam (August 05, 2011 11:21 am ET)
      3 2
      Hopefully big shots in the media business who are Jewish,and have used promoting racism as a business model, will see the light.The KKK nazis,and radical Islam,and various hateful sub groups are on the same team.
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    • Author by ahorton (August 05, 2011 11:32 am ET)
        1
      Really? Unbelievable.... As TEA Partiers, me and my wife are appalled at both this site and A3P. This site is indicative of the kind of hate speach that resides on both extremes of the political spectrum. Your references here to school yard name calling is paramount to the fact that you don't have a political vision and, in fact, engage in name-calling due to a lack of a response to YOUR political frustrations. Anything to incite passionate rage are what this site and A3P are all about! Why don't the "Alinsky Radicals" on this site just go engage the A3P yourselves and get it over with! The "Alinsky Radical" is no differnet than the "White-Power Radical!" You both don't have a clue what political discourse is about! We are (in Lloyd Marcus' words) Proud unhyphenated Americans that believe in the American Dream! BTW, I'm a white man and my wife is a black woman with a biracial child and we take offense to both this site, KKK, Black-Panthers, A3P, and any other hate-mongering group that only finds refuge in this Country!
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    • Author by kindgsl (August 05, 2011 2:45 pm ET)
        1
      Hey dudes, the Tea Party was my idea.

      Thanks for this story about it, it is very good reporting. I wanted to add a comment about the debt tizzy that they blew all out of proportion, at the one hour point in this linked radio show there is a remarkable revelation,

      Is there a Revolution Coming in October?
      http://www.blogtalkradio.com/your-world-news/2011/08/04/is-there-a-revolution-coming-in-october

      If we had single payer health care, we would have no debt.

      I think Dr. Margaret Flowers is just terrific and should run for president. The interview starts about 30 minutes into the show. The subject is the October 6 protest, she is an organizer.

      I plan to be there and can't wait to meet Dr. Margaret Flowers in person, she sounds terrific! I think maybe she should run for president.
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