Conservative Media Declare That Solar Power "Doesn't Work"
September 02, 2011 12:30 pm ET by Jill Fitzsimmons & Jocelyn Fong
When Solyndra, a California based solar panel manufacturer, announced this week that it will file for bankruptcy, conservative media outlets immediately cheered the loss as evidence that solar power doesn't work. That couldn't be further from the truth.
In fact, solar energy was the fastest growing industry in the United States last year. And as Climate Progress reported, "America is a net exporter of solar products ... to the tune of $1.8 billion."
Arizona-based First Solar is currently building its second U.S. factory, which will "roughly double the solar-panel maker's U.S. production capacity," according to the Wall Street Journal. The company is also investing in several large solar farms.
The Institute of Electrical and Electronic Engineers announced in June that solar panels, which have great potential for increases in efficiency, could become most cost-effective electricity source within a decade, even challenging fossil fuels. The International Energy Agency also recently said solar generators, including both solar photovoltaic and solar-thermal plants, may produce most of the world's electricity within 50 years.
Despite all this, conservative media claim solar power isn't worth pursuing.
Last night on Fox Business, Chris Horner of the Competitive Enterprise Institute claimed that the solar companies "are not responding to demand - they are providing something that doesn't work."
Fox's Neil Cavuto hosted Steve Milloy twice this week to blast the solar industry. Milloy said that "the solar industry is leading the country ... right down the toilet." He went on to claim that:
STEVE MILLOY: Half the time solar panels don't even work. Half the time they do work they produce expensive electricity. This is just lose, lose, lose, for America. We can't do it here.
[...]
MILLOY: Solar panels don't make economic sense anywhere. They are strictly a luxury item.
The next evening Milloy called Solyndra "the poster child for the disaster of green jobs and clean energy."
Meanwhile, Rush Limbaugh said he didn't understand why Solyndra had to shut down because "the sun is still there":
RUSH LIMBAUGH: [T]he prime ingredient for a solar company is still there... the sun! The sun is still there. It may be behind clouds, but it's still there. Wait a minute now, don't just let this go! This is crucial! Solar power comes from the sun; the sun is still there. And yet this company shuts down because of global economic conditions? The sun is still putting out as much as it ever did. Just like in Las Vegas. And yet they can't harness it. It's there every day. Doesn't cost anything - it's just there.
As for Solyndra, experts reportedly said "a consolidation of the industry was inevitable":
Experts said that solar energy was still among the most promising of all of the alternative energy sources, but they added that due diligence was necessary to pick the best companies. Some said a consolidation of the industry was inevitable.
"There used to be 50 car companies in this country, but very few survived," said Bill Bathe, chief executive of U.S. Energy Services, a Minneapolis energy management company. "For consumers, this is an exciting time, but for investors, this is still a very high-risk stage. You may hit a home run or be part of the experiment that delivers no payout."
U.S. companies are feeling the pressure from Chinese solar manufacturers, who have helped push down prices by 42 percent this year.
The New York Times reported that "much of China's clean energy success lies in aggressive government policies that help this crucial export industry in ways most other governments do not," including "heavily subsidized land and loans." Those subsidies are part of a comprehensive policy agenda set by the Chinese government, which "sends clear signals to investors," according to a Brookings Institution report:
Critical to China's success is its articulation of a comprehensive and long-term state clean energy build out policy that sends clear signals to investors. Through its 12th Five Year Plan, China has identified "new energy" as one among seven "strategic emerging industries" and will invest $760 billion over the next 10 years in this sector alone. A range of complementary policies will guide these investment decisions, including the Renewable Energy Law, national demand-side management regulations, and pilot carbon taxes, among others. China has swiftly made itself a clean energy power, in large part by ensuring the availability of copious, affordable capital at a time it has been short in the United States.
And the Deutche Bank Climate Change Advisors said in a recent report that there's a lot more the U.S. could do to create a policy framework that encourages clean energy investment:
Countries with more 'TLC' - transparency, longevity and certainty - in their climate policy frameworks will attract more investment and will build new, clean industries, technologies and jobs faster than their policy lagging counterparts. This is particularly evident in countries such as Germany and China, who have emerged as global leaders in low carbon technologies and investment in recent years. In stark contrast, a politically divided US Congress and vast budget deficit has resulted in very little significant regulation at the Federal level, with substantial implications for emerging clean technology industries in the US. This climate policy inertia has existed for some time in the US now, with activity on this front largely taking place at the state level. We have long argued that the states must continue to press ahead with climate legislation, but a negative effect of this trend is a patchwork of inconsistent state policies. The net effect is that while Congress stumbles, the US stands to fall behind.
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IMHO
UTOPIA
Every time you see a political event sponsored by these traitors, it's covered in American flags. Destroy your homeland for profit - how patriotic.
"For what doth it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his own soul?"
Sorry, I forget that they are actually soulless hypocrites who expertly manipulate the simple Evangelical sheeple.
The truth is that fossil fuels will become harder and harder to refine the farther we go into the future. The more we innovate and conserve now, the easier the transition will be in the future.
Without innovation the future could be more Mad Max than Utopia.
Sadly, on alternative energy, we're about 30 years behind the curve. President Carter had some good ideas on this, and Reagan nixed it all for SDI and other foolish things. Every president since at least Nixon has said that we need to establish an independent and self sufficient energy supply, but only Carter did much about it. I'm hoping Obama will do more, especially considering how much money China is pumping into their green energy sector.
Despite the attempts through oppressive regulations, oil companies provide a product that we demand, quickly, efficiently and relatively low cost. They do that by providing good paying jobs as well.
Most local gas stations probably have never been touted by the president as the jobs of the future and sunk millions of taxpayer dollars just so me can get slushies, whether we want them or not!
That is just not true. I have have been unable to find on eclosed gas station in my community that has reopned as a gas station. In my community most former gas stations are now either closed or "Minute" Markets, etc. Just on one seven block stretch of one downtown street there is an Auto Battery joints, used car lot, and two boarded up stations and two open stations. Second, I didnt tout them as jobs of the future just as examples that just because a business goes out of business, that doesnt necessarily mean that kind of business "doesnt work".
"Despite the attempts through oppressive regulations, oil companies provide a product that we demand, quickly, efficiently and relatively low cost. They do that by providing good paying jobs as well."
Name those "oppressive regulations". Do you mean by "oppressive regulations" billions of dollars in federal subsidies?
"...efficiently and relatively low cost." Did you really use this phrase in reference to gasoline prices in the United States?
"...just so me can get slushies," You are illiterate to boot.
And muffie is nice enough to volunteer, to proudly announce that she's going for it hook, line and sinker.
It never stops amazing me. I could almost excuse somebody who lived out in a holler with noting but an am radio for information, the ignorance could be understandable if a person had no other source of info but Rush.
But when they come here, expose themselves to facts and reality, and they still don't get it, that is a lot of effort being put into being stupid.
It's like they know where the teacher's answer book is, they're looking right at it, and they still fail the quiz.
But again, remember that it has nothing to do with the industry they're a part of, but that particular company's business model.
You'll probably find what Media Matters just pointed out...consolidation in the industry.
But that won't stop your wingnut pals from spreading lies, will it?
It's way past time we fix this trade balance problem... Start nailing these imports with taxes.
But, Wal-Mart and similar lobbyists will kill it before it even begins.
Just like in the past.
Then we can actually compete with China's manufacturing costs.
Of those businesses that go bankrupt, how many receive such financial support from the taxpayer and props from the president before they tank?
Really, this is about an industry tanking, not just the individual business because these products can't replicate the value found in other energy sources, those are cheaper and more productive for the economy as a whole.
" It's a fact...", " Everybody knows...", " Nobody can deny...", and " To be honest...", any time you see these words from a right winger, you know whatever comes next is going to be garbage.
Probably quite a lot of them actually. Look at the Dell manufacturing facility that was built in North Carolina not too long ago. Now? It's closed, and that portion of the business went under. They received many tax breaks from the State and the Federal Government to build that place. Does that mean the computer business is kaput? Nope.
It's really not, because if it were, then the entire solar industry would be bankrupt, and it's not, as cited by the MMFA article that apparently, you forgot to read.
How do you think it started off for say, the oil industry? They had to develop, and they've had the benefit of many years of development to grow into the strong and profitable businesses that they've become. A lot of oil companies went bankrupt along the way, and through the years, and a lot of oil companies CONSOLIDATED and are profitting immensely now.
How, or why would you think it would be different for an industry that is relatively new, and growing? Solar industry is trying to figure out their tech, make their tech better, and cheaper, and get more of it sold. Plus, oil ain't gonna last forever chief. The more green technologies we can get into place and improve, will reduce the use of oil that we need now. Which will then, of course, get cheaper, and more productive.
An illustrative example I'll give you. Back in the 80's, VCRS were expensive and gigantic. Now, if you can actually find one, you can get a new VCR for very little money and the technology is better and far more advanced.
Same thing will happen for solar.
Oil worked, granted over time, because it provided and provides a product, that we need efficiently and at a low cost. Much of the government works to prevent that from happening now. Forcing solar, wind and other sources of energy on the public is detrimental to an economy's growth. With the government so heavily involved in energy it's like telling us that we can only use beta instead of vhs in tape recording. It wastes money and at this time in history economically, its counter productive to bringing private job growth that we need.
When someone invents the pure solar panel that meets an expressed or possible need of the public for cheaper, safe and efficient energy, I'll be all for it. Gates created that with Microsoft all on his own. Forcing the market as this shows, usually meets with failure.
Oil worked...because it provided and provides a product, that we need efficiently and at a low cost.
Yep, low cost with polluted air and polluted oceans with the added bonus of reliance on Middle Eastern sheiks.
Why do you hate American ingenuity so much? Why do you love oppressive Middle Eastern despots so much?
Or creating jobs with drilling in Alaska, or the gulf or retrieving more natural gas from off shore in NC or in shale in the northeast?
And really, where is industry creating smog and air pollution in the US? If you lived in the 60's then you knew what pollution was, yet you still deny the fact that we use more fossil fuels and with technology, pollute much less.
and the reason we pollute less is BECAUSE of government regulation. surely not because the oil companies got responsible.
Ah just found it it defiantly does not go under the Aquifer.
source
I hope the people in Nebraska and other affected states will realize what this pipeline will mean in terms of pollution, eminent domain, and destruction of habitat.
It's obvious that the pipeline is designed to ship the oil overseas. Just as the LNG project proposed are designed to do. They aren't interested in us having energy independence--they want to export the oil and natural gas and make a pile of money.
source
I'm also not sure what the point is with the pipeline running over , as opposed to under, the aquifer. Is gravity yet another scientific "theory" **scoff scoff** that the trogs are tossing out as debunked ?
All increased drilling will do is spoil the environment and increase oil company profits when they sell to the Chinese.
The caller asked Rush how he felt about all of the corporations who don't pay taxes ( given his criticism of that half of the country who don't pay any taxes).
Rush conceded one company, I think he mentioned an oil company whose subsidies ( not subsidies, but tax breaks, for our wingnut friends) canceled out their taxes. But, he said he was unaware of any others.
The caller was prepared, and rattled off 5 or ten corporations . All Lispy had to do was say, again, that he was unaware of this, and imply that the caller was wrong
Rush knows his sucklings, like muffie and highliter, won't take the initiative to research the topic.
Of course, the safe bet is that Lispy is aware of the facts and was lying. But if he really is unaware of that, he's an ignorant buffoon.
There are really only two choices. Liar or Idiot. And this is the source that muffie and highliter use as their primary source.
Which explains a lot of this comment thread.
Um, Microsoft stole what Apple paid for, and it came from Xerox.
How on Earth would putting more energy sources on the market be detrimental to an economy's growth?
He keeps saying that these things are being forced into the market. They're not being forced by anyone.
It's the fundamentalist brain on parade.
As far as drying up, we seem to be finding more oil and natural gas fields all the time, much of it here in the US.
But government wants to keep us from accessing it.
There are already oil and natural gas fields that the oil companies are sitting on and not developing. Why don't you realize this?
So NO tax breaks for oil and gas companies?
are you prepared to pay $10 a gallon for gas?
Nice graph here
You know we have reached peak oil, we have used up 50% of all oil on the planet in 100 years and demand is 10 times what it was 60 years ago so we have about 20 years of oil left assuming no further increase in demand.
Again, you're discounting that it is a low cost. Now. It wasn't always low cost. Again, due to development and consolidation of oil companies over the years, with infrastructures now in place to support said industries, but that took a very long time to build. Solar isn't going to have that same infrastructure for a long time. And let's not forget, oil companies are still being subsidized by the Federal Government even though they're making record profits quarter after quarter. Why do they still get our money when they don't need it?
If this were true, wouldn't oil companies be lacking in profit? Well, they're not.
Where is solar being forced onto anyone? And how could a potentially highly profitable business harm the economy again? Please, explain that one.
See, you kind of contradict yourself here. You're talking as if these green companies are Government owned. They're not. They're privately owned. How is giving loans to private companies that are producing these things stifling private growth and jobs again? You do realize that when a private company uses Government money (which happens a lot) they will produce product and jobs right? Such as some of these solar companies, heck, even the one that went bankrupt provided jobs for over a 1000 people (which are sadly gone now).
These are the products that are being developed now. The public, again, has a call for this type of energy. For every little bit of energy that can be produced by solar, or wind for that matter, that is less oil products being burned to create energy, less uranium being used to produce energy, less coal being used to produce energy.
Gates didn't do it all on his own. He had investors in his business. The Government, in the case of this one company, was an investor, and like some businesses, sometimes they don't work. Nobody is FORCING the market as you keep saying. They're working to break into the market.
After the BP spill in the Gulf of Mexico, it's safe to say that the oil industry is UNDER regulated.
I'd be willing to bet they pay less in taxes than they receive in subsidies from the federal government. Got any actual numbers, mmfvl?
Not as much tax as they should be paying wish i could off shore my wages and only pay 3% tax.
No actually that is just how stupid and brainwashed you are. When capitalism is allowed to just function without being regulated it eats itself every time. THAT is what happened during the great depression, the S&L debacle, and the current economic meltdown. The truth is you are too brainwashed to even BEGIN to understand economics
Speaking of oil companies, didn't "chuckle-nuts" Bush start an oil company (Arbusto, (shrub) or something like that) and run that into bankruptcy. Using the same logic as mmfvl, Bush collapsed the oil industry.
I guess that's where he got the experience to almost do the same thing to the country.
I think I hit the thread too late, but I backed you up on that stalled bills post: http://mediamatters.org/blog/201108310015#1462391
It's up to 372 bills passed by the House and stalled in the Senate.
BTW, this picture is of the preexisting rustic "farm" house that was used as a photo-op prop. The real home is made out of Leuders Limestone which has amazing natural insulation properties.
You aren't able to read very well, are you?
From the article that you didn't read:
Arizona-based First Solar is currently building its second U.S. factory, which will "roughly double the solar-panel maker's U.S. production capacity," according to the Wall Street Journal. The company is also investing in several large solar farms.
Again, if they can produce it,deliver it and replace use of our natural resources like oil, coal and natural gas, then I'll sign on. In the meantime, let's drill here in the US, provide good jobs, economic growth and have a return to prosperity.
Right?
As others have said, you do realize that all of the things you mentioned are heavily subsidized by the Federal Government. Right?
We ARE drilling here in the US. Oil production in the US currently is at its highest levels in history.
Just so you know, mmfvl, solar IS a natural resource. Also, drilling here in the U.S. will add exactly zero extra petroleum to our national supply because wherever it is drilled, it is sold on the world market.
Petroleum is a dead technology. Should've died forty years ago, during the first OPEC induced shortage. THAT should have been our clue that depending on foreign oil is bad for national security and our national economy.
You are just too stupid and too brainwashed to understand economics in ANY way. PUBLIC investment created the internet, there would BE no personal computer industry without early subsidies and the government being the buyer of last resort. The aircraft industry would not EXIST if government hadnt protected, subsidized and bought their products in the early stages. Those industries are not incredibly profitable. The electronic industry itself was created when Bell Labs made the basic discoveries that made it posbbile and they had a cost plus contract and monopoly for service which is a form of public subsidy.
Public cost is at the bottom of virtually every industry in America. You are too stupid to know anything about what you spew
How can you possibly be this stupid? Did you see the part where the US EXPORTS 1.8 billion in solar panels? Why do you ask stupid questions that only prove you have no idea what you are talking about and too stupid to understand what you read?
If people as stupid as you ran the world the human race would go extinct. So we should ignore the fact that cheaper oil is running out until it DOES run out, until we are fighting world ending wars out of the last hundred thousand barrels of oil and it is too LATE to transition to other energy sources? Seriously. HOW can you be this stupid?
They did things like renting a forklift for 3 months rather than just buying a new one for almost the same price as the rental one for 3 months.
Well in the end, they bonus'd and salaried themselves right out of business. Business was doing just fine otherwise. I worked IT, I could see everything, and their paychecks were absolutely ridiculous for the work they did. (one of the brothers of the owner was a "Stock inventory manager", making 110k a year plus bonus and he came in maybe 3 days a week for a couple hours... on a good week. Some weeks he never even showed up.
I can't help but think this kind of greed and idiocy is the exact cause of MANY business failures in this country.
Those kinds of companies are doomed to fail outright, let's not extend their lives with taxpayer money.
It didn't say that. We actually pointed out to you that the oil industry is heavily subsidized by government money. This is not an opinion.
johnsta's point was that many businesses are poorly run and fail because of it--and just because one solar company failed doesn't mean that the solar industry is failing.
Please work on reading comprehension.
http://transitionvoice.com/2011/05/top-5-myths-about-subsidies-to-oil-companies/
I'd like to know how using the US military in foreign countries to directly protect the interests of private oil companies isn't a direct subsidy.
And, as others have pointed out, tax breaks ARE subsidies. From a NY Times article:The point is that oil companies don't have to pay MANY of what are normal costs of doing business. Whether or not they receive direct payments, the taxpayers pay those costs so that the oil companies don't have to. That's a subsidy under any rational definition of it.
So then you are unclear on the definition of the word subsidy?
All of them arent. Notice the Arizona company is building a new plant that is a far cry from all of them going bankrupt. Why are you such a LIAR?
ONE business went bankrupt. It has no more relation to the ultimate change to a solar energy based system than did the ONE (faulty) "scientific" paper had to the demise of the entire body of climate change science.
Jesus.
For the typical Rush Limbuagh/Glen Beck/Sean Hannity/etc. everyday listener, it is based upon dislike for certain cultural groups and uses stereotypes that associate these groups with particular energy sources. It goes like this: "Renewable Energy = Hippies. We don't like hippies. Therefore we don't like renewable energy"
We can't simply say they [those who sympathize with Rush, Hannity, etc] don't like it because of the subsidies it receives, as these same people support nuclear energy wholeheartedly despite the fact that nuclear energy is a pure product of government-funded R&D during WWII and the Cold War. Not to mention that it is not competitive with fossil fuels to build new plants.
They like military might and emotional stories about wildcatters and coal miners owing their soul to the company store. They don't like "hippies" who may question the establishment and Jimmy Carter suggesting that Americans turn down the heat a put on a sweater. Everything follows from that.
It was a good technology 30 years ago, and it still is a good technology.
This is one business that went bankrupt, not an entire industry.
*fingers in ears*
La la la! I can't HEAR you!
Notice that the initial construction costs were covered by the power company in return for an agreement to purchase additional power through them, a good angle on the investment problem that the naysayers keep whining about.
As to the other wingnut whine ( We don't like those ugly thing!), the carports are kinda cool-looking.
I might be bordered to the south by Newport Beach ( think The OC or Real housewives of Orange County) and the yachting types to the north ( think Thurston Howell III), but even if they're being displaced by furriner millionaires, a lot of the older families here are just the descendents of roughnecks and oil hands.
Just Okies with surfboard racks instead of gun racks.
No true many people live totally 'off grid' and live perfectly normal lives using the same appliances as everyone else.
You need to google more...
Wherein muffie believes she has proved solar energy doesn't work and global warming is a hoax. A wingnut science two-fer !
You just don't get it.
back in the day when you went to walmart there were huge signs that said 'made in the USA'. now its 'nothing is made in the USA!'....
As far as Milloy's idiocy -- seriously? "America -- we can't do it here" is apparently the new face of patriotism. I never thought I'd live to see the day when pessimism and naysaying about our capabilities as a nation would be equated with patriotism.
HERE is the TRUTH about the COZY CORRUPT relationship between Solyndra and obama which is being investigated!
Read all about it, STOP YOUR WHINING, GROW UP, AND FACE THE TRUTH LIKE AN ADULT: http://bit.ly/qiMWEg
Hawaii tourism doesn't even work! http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20110901-715436.html
such idots
Venture Capitalists invested $1.1 billion in Solyndra in addition to federal funding. I will bet NOBODY on FauxNoise mentioned that for-profit venture capitalists lost money, too.
You had to read the San Jose Mercury News to find it.
Note how the emphasis of the story is on the DOE and taxpayer share of $535 million?
I drive by the Solyndra facility a few times a month on my way to meetings with investors. I can assure you it galls me they blew through $1.6 billion and can't compete. (My startup will change the world of medicine with $10 million.) But I also worked in China a while back and know the Chinese are investing a lot more than $1.6 billion to own the solar market.
Argonaut Ventures
U.S. Venture Partners
CMEA Ventures
Redpoint Ventures
RockPort Capital Partners
On the Japanese Youtube site and there are many uploades of Dr Kodama's impassioned and expert testimony in Japanese about the nuclear fallout from the Fukushima nuclear disaster.Dr Kodama is a medical doctor specialized in cancer treatment and a leading authority on the effects of radiation on people's health at the University of Tokyo.
My guestimate is that collectively the number in Japanese is getting up to 1,000,000 views and still growing. The one with the largest number of views is 549,659 and can be seen here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9sTLQSZfwo&feature=related
If all you good folk here in Tokyo Japan, America and around the world who are in support of the truth and concerned about the health of the good people of the Fukushima area and Touhoku disaster region can kindly share on your social networks maybe we can get this English version to go over 1,000,000 and even more viral too. This will help put world pressure and support for fast, effective healthy solutions to this ongoing disaster that threatens so many adults and children now and in the future. Dr Kodama is a medical doctor specialized in cancer treatment and a leading authority on the effects of radiation on people's health at the University of Tokyo. Spread his words please, for the sake of us all in Japan and our children's children too. Thank you
English version: (click ‘cc’ on the video panel for English translation)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlf4gOvzxYc
Andrew Grimes
Tokyo Counseling Services
http://tokyocounseling.com
http://tokyocounseling.com/english
Could be they just didn't set up the proper business model. The tanking of one eatery is not the end of the industry.