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Will the media address Bernstein's charges of "misleading," "factually off-base" Clinton coverage?

May 31, 2007 8:06 pm ET

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In his upcoming book, A Woman in Charge: The Life of Hillary Rodham Clinton (Knopf, June 2007), Carl Bernstein repeatedly criticizes the media's coverage of the Clinton presidency as, at various times, "overzealous," "misleading," "factually off-base," and a "free-for-all" that lacked "restraint." Given the widespread media coverage that Bernstein's book has, and will undoubtedly, receive, will the media address Bernstein's claims?

On Page 233 of an advance copy of A Woman in Charge obtained by Media Matters for America, Bernstein notes that the Clintons "complained bitterly" that they had been "victimized" by "an overzealous press." Bernstein writes that "[t]here is little question that they were treated more harshly, and often pursued with different standards and more relentlessly -- during virtually the whole of their occupancy of the White House -- than any president and his wife of the twentieth century." Bernstein faults the media -- specifically The New York Times and The Washington Post -- for their reporting on the Whitewater controversy, which he writes was based on "assumptions" and "assertions" that "were often contextually misleading, exaggerated in significance, and sometimes factually off-base." From A Woman in Charge:

Later, the Clintons, seared and scarred by the press and opposition party for their own ethical lapses, complained bitterly that from their first days in office they had been singled out and judged by harsher standards than any of their predecessors, and victimized by a consortium of enemies and an overzealous press. There is little question that they were treated more harshly, and often pursued with different standards and more relentlessly -- during virtually the whole of their occupancy of the White House -- than any president and his wife of the twentieth century. Moreover, the underlying assumptions of some of the basic charges and assertions that fueled the unceasing investigation -- most notably those related to the so-called Whitewater matter, beginning with a series of stories in the New York Times and others covering similar ground in the Washington Post -- were often contextually misleading, exaggerated in significance, and sometimes factually off-base.

On Pages 205-206, Bernstein notes that the media consistently repeated a specific quote from Sen. Clinton (D-NY) without providing the full context, "as evidence of radical feminist disdain for traditional values." According to Bernstein:

The next morning, Hillary and Bill were at the Busy Bee Coffee Shop in Chicago, working the breakfast crowd, when a group of reporters walked in. They began asking him about Hillary's job at the Rose Law Firm -- whether there were inherent conflicts of interest in being a partner of a law firm that did business with the state. Hillary was behind him, drinking coffee from a Styrofoam cup. When one of the journalists asked if it was okay to speak directly to her, Bill said, "Sure. Ask her anything you want." NBC News correspondent Andrea Mitchell asked the first lady of Arkansas whether it was ethical for a governor's wife to work in a law firm whose clients did business with state agencies. Hillary had been waiting for such a question. "I suppose I could have stayed home, baked cookies, and had teas," she said memorably. Later, that quotation often stood alone in the press, seemingly indicating only her contempt for housewives, absent her words that followed: "The work that I've done as a professional, as a public advocate, has been aimed in part to assure that women can make the choices that they should make -- whether it's a full-time career, full-time motherhood, some combination, depending on what stage of life they are at -- and I think that is still difficult for people to understand right now, that it is a generational change."

The abbreviated version, in sound bite form, permeated TV and radio news for days, and columnists cited her remarks as evidence of radical feminist disdain for traditional values. William Safire wrote in the New York Times that Bill had a "Hillary problem," and called her words the "second outbreak of foot-in-mouth disease," the first one being her Tammy Wynette remark.

Bernstein lays specific blame at the feet of then-New York Times investigative reporter Jeff Gerth -- co-author of the soon-to-be-released book Her Way: The Hopes and Ambitions of Hillary Rodham Clinton (Little, Brown & Co., June 2007) -- for omitting a key fact in the initial Whitewater story. Gerth's article, which appeared in the March 8, 1992, edition of the Times concerned a 1978 real estate deal involving the Clintons. From Pages 204-205 of A Woman in Charge:

On March 8, the New York Times published a story on its front page headlined, "Clintons Joined S&L Operator in an Ozark Real Estate Venture." The Clintons had known for at least a month that reporter Jeff Gerth had been looking into their 1978 land deal with Susan and James McDougal, a fifty-fifty partnership in which the two couples had bought land along the White River in Arkansas in hopes of dividing it into forty-two lots and selling them for vacation homes. Bill and Hillary had resigned themselves to seeing the land deal as an unfortunate venture in which they had lost money. The Times saw something sinister: conflicts of interest and insider deals to line Hillary's and Bill's pockets. Susan Thomases -- officially in charge of the campaign's scheduling but, in fact, Hillary's political deputy and troubleshooter -- and the campaign's counsel had met with Gerth the week before Super Tuesday, desperately trying to persuade him to run the story after the primaries that day. Thomases told Gerth that there were documents that would vindicate the Clintons -- but, for the moment at least, they were missing. This added to the brew of suspicion, and rather than delay publication, the suggestion that records may have been removed was now part of the story. Gerth's story reported that the Rose Law Firm had performed legal work for [James B.] McDougal's savings and loan company while Bill was attorney general and governor -- but the Times failed to note that McDougal was not yet in the S&L business when the Clintons bought the land.

Bernstein offers further detail on Gerth's story in a footnote on Page 353:

Jeff Gerth's original Whitewater story in the New York Times, on March 8, 1992, had raised the obvious conflict of interest questions, including whether the governor should have been a partner in a land deal with someone whose business was regulated by the state -- though in fact McDougal had not been in the S&L business when the Whitewater partnership was formed -- and whether it was proper for Hillary to have been paid legal fees for the work she did for Madison Guaranty. The story also said that the Clintons had "improperly" deducted about $5,000 on their personal tax returns in 1984 and 1985 "for interest paid on a portion of at least $30,000 in bank loan payments" that had actually been paid from a business account in the name of their Whitewater partnership with the McDougals. It was the kind of accounting error often made innocently, and sometimes not. The deductions saved the Clintons perhaps $1,000 in taxes, but since the error had occurred more than three years before the story ran, "Internal Revenue Service regulations [did] not require the Clintons to pay."

Meanwhile, the Clinton campaign had been able to challenge the perception that Bill and Hillary had done something wrong in relation to their Whitewater investment by releasing an independent audit that showed they had ultimately lost about $69,000 on the deal.

In the second paragraph of his 1992 Times article, Gerth mentioned that Clinton and McDougal entered into the real estate deal in 1978, and in the 16th paragraph that McDougal "bought control of a small savings and loan association" after he "left government in 1979." But, as Bernstein notes, nowhere in the article did Gerth point out that McDougal was not "in the S&L business when the Whitewater partnership was formed." Indeed (in addition to the false headline), the lead sentence suggested the opposite: "Bill Clinton and his wife were business partners with the owner of a failing savings and loan association that was subject to state regulation early in his tenure as Governor of Arkansas, records show."

Bernstein also criticizes The Washington Post's Whitewater coverage, specifically that of staff writer Susan Schmidt. On Page 351, Bernstein notes that "Whitewater had reappeared in the news in a major way on October 31 [1993] in the form of a story by Washington Post reporter Susan Schmidt." Bernstein goes on to write: "Schmidt's initial story (as opposed to some of her later ones, based uncritically on leaks from the office of Independent Counsel Ken Starr) was real news."

On Page 349, Bernstein offers his take on the "overblown" Whitewater story and writes that even Gerth himself did not believe Whitewater deserved to be the subject of a years-long independent counsel investigation:

In truth, the "Whitewater story" became overblown almost from the moment the New York Times first wrote about it, during the campaign, in a series of articles and editorials that were increasingly long on innuendo, short on context, and in some important ways unfair to the Clintons. The Clintons' response was not straightforward, and served only to create more suspicion. The initial Times story was a model of restraint compared with the coverage of "Whitewater" that followed in the press free-for-all during the next eight years.

Mark Fabiani, the presidential lawyer entrusted by Hillary with the rapid press-response capability for the White House in 1995 and 1996, understood the entire nature of Whitewater as well as anyone in the administration. Fabiani said he was told by Jeff Gerth, the Times reporter who wrote the first Whitewater story, that Gerth believed it was a good "campaign story" that "never deserved to be the subject of years of long independent counsel work."

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    • Author by NotThatGeorge (May 31, 2007 8:15 pm ET)
         

      This article by Media Matters should be bookmarked by all of us to use in the future to document the unfair treatment of the Clintons.

      Good job Media Matters.

      Report Abuse
    • Author by pearlene_scott1602 (May 31, 2007 8:32 pm ET)
         

      Finally.

      It's still happening today. People are still blaming the Clinton's for 9/11.

       

      Report Abuse
      • Author by EvilRepublicansnow (May 31, 2007 9:00 pm ET)
           

        As long as the media has the GOP Machine the Clintons will be blamed for everything. 

        Report Abuse
      • Author by redking75687 (May 31, 2007 9:27 pm ET)
           

        Well, one must admit that Clinton's Middle-Eastern policy did contribute to the animosity felt by many in that region against the USA. One only has to speak of the 1 million dead Iraqis from 1992-2000, killed by Clinton's refusal to allow Iraq to buy even the most basic of medical supplies from abroad.

        The sad part of American political life is that so many people cannot see the thread of common policy running thru the seperate administrations and congresses. There's a bi-partisan effort at work here, run by power brokers and big lobby groups behind the scenes. Whether the White House or Congress is Dem or Repub does not matter. The Master Plan continues, no matter who's in charge of implementing it.

        Report Abuse
        • Author by NotThatGeorge (June 01, 2007 12:03 am ET)
             

          Those sanctions you continually harp on kept Iraq from getting more WMD's.

          There were prices that were paid by innocent Iraqi's to keep Saddam tightly controlled.

          You are not being truthful when you claim that those sanctions were a major factor in creating terrorists around the world,and I don't believe there's any proof that those sanctions and their effects had any impact on the people who planned 9/11. You strive to criticize Democrats, and allege that they're no better than Republicans, and this is one of the fraudulent ways you do it.

          Your partisan nature blinds you to reality, RedKing.

          Report Abuse
          • Author by oscar the grouch (June 01, 2007 11:23 am ET)
               

            In defense of RedKing, not a partisan by any means if you have read the posts over time. For you to completely exonerate WJC over this is really showing partisanship.

            Report Abuse
            • Author by juliajayne (June 01, 2007 12:56 pm ET)
                 

              Redking is very partisan. He's partisan to the Green party. And he's like Mikey - he hates everybody (except Ralph Nader). And his continuing meme of statements like "there is no difference between Gore and Bush" is politically infantile. He offers no solutions, just severe criticisms of everyone but Ralph Nader. He won't acknowledge the fact that Ralphie has not built a party base on the local level and can not compete because of this. People like him are the reason there isn't more support of the Green party. They are elitist and won't join Democrats on areas of agreement when they could actually support something worthwhile. These people are whiners who are more interested in throwing stones than actually doing something. Build the part base and then you can talk, Redking.

              Report Abuse
              • Author by tommy (June 01, 2007 1:34 pm ET)
                   

                Although I disagree with Redking on most things, I do respect and admire his committement to his principles.  He is not partisan as in some blind loyalty to a major political party, as many are.  He sticks by what he believes in and is not afraid to speak his mind about how he views the powerful political parties.

                Your characterization of him is unfair.

                Report Abuse
                • Author by juliajayne (June 01, 2007 4:34 pm ET)
                     

                  Nope. Not unfair. Look up the word partisan. And anybody saying Gore is the same as Bush does indeed hold a politically infantile view regardless of party power brokers. He does his cause no good by saying such things and I'm not afraid to tell him as much.   

                  Report Abuse
                  • Author by redking75687 (June 02, 2007 10:40 am ET)
                       

                    Awww, I insult your idol Gore, the great environmentalist who voted for mountaintop-removal mining and didn't complain about the use of depleted uranium by the military or the spraying of toxic chemcials all over the Colombian landscape by the US or all those dead children his buddies Clinton and Netanyahu made. Instead he has someone write a book for him about nature and shows up at some Earth Day events. Wow, real commitment there!

                    Frankly, I'm not sorry at all about laying into the REAL Al Gore, who is NOT what the media sells him as. He is NOT a progressive, liberal or environmentalist. He is a PHONY and is guilty of war crimes in several situations. It's not my fault you bought into the Al Gore myth and don't know the truth about him. I guess you haven't been reading the liberal press, as I do.

                    Report Abuse
        • Author by laserpotato (June 01, 2007 11:03 am ET)
             

          Redking, did you name yourself after Ultraman monster Red King or am I just being even more of a geek than usual?

          Report Abuse
          • Author by redking75687 (June 02, 2007 10:32 am ET)
               

            Actually, it's from my favorite footballer, Eric "the King" Cantona, jersey #7, who played for Manchester United, the Red Devils....hence RedKing7. The rest of the numbers got stuck in there by the site when I registered.

            Report Abuse
        • Author by captfoster2 (June 01, 2007 5:02 pm ET)
             

          Red,

          You said: "Well, one must admit that Clinton's Middle-Eastern policy did contribute to the animosity felt by many in that region against the USA."

          Perhaps but I would tend to believe that the USA invasion of a country that did nothing to us first and had ZERO to do with 9/11 made things 20 times worse for us there than anything Clinton might have done!

          Report Abuse
          • Author by redking75687 (June 02, 2007 10:49 am ET)
               

            It's all part of a long-term policy. We support Israeli racism and their opression of three million Palestinians. We build up a massive military presence in the Persian Gulf, started during Reagan. We layed seige to Iraq for thirteen years and then invade them.

            Any arab living thru all this would get the feeling that the US is out to get them, don't you think? As I said, it's a bi-partisan policy, mainly driven by Israeli money and PR behind the scenes. Both parties are FIRMLY committed to that policy.

            Terrorism is a political thing, with political causes. We know what those causes are. But the parties in power refuse to admit this and will continue to pursue the policies that generate animosity against us. They're excited in that they can use this "war on terror" to do whatever they want, even putting the final bullets into the Consitution, which they've been using as target practice for a long, long time. Simple put, with Dems and Repubs, we're screwed.

            Report Abuse
      • Author by newsdaysnightmare (June 01, 2007 8:33 am ET)
           

        Maybe if they would have done something the first time we were attacked we would not be in this predicament in the first place.  The disgraced former president didn't even visit the site after the bombing.  BUT lets mock Bush because it took him a week to visit the Katrina victims.  Bill was too busy looking to get his knob polished than to help his country!

        Report Abuse
        • Author by flimflam421 (June 01, 2007 11:00 am ET)
             

          I was wondering, as I read this article, how long it would take for someone to say, "but Bill Clinton had oral sex (!) in the White House!"

          I was guessing it would take about thirty minutes.

          Twelve hours.  You guys are disappointingly slow.

          Report Abuse
    • Author by sluggo (May 31, 2007 9:28 pm ET)
         

      The media are not in the direct pay of the Republican party (at least most are not), but reflect a pervasive lack of standards and values. They pretend they are in the news business and expect to be treated as such (to be trusted to make true statements, to be a source for objective information, etc). 

      However, they (by their own actions) demonstrate that they are in the "entertainment" business with the goal of selling stuff. You don't sell stuff by soberly telling the truth; you do so by "grabbing viewers" and "commanding attention". Too often, this is done by lying, distorting facts, and ensuring that there is "drama" rather than truth.

      Their goal is to fool the listening or viewing public so they can sell more stuff, but I suspect that more than a few have ended up also fooling themselves into thinking they are really "newspeople".

       

      Report Abuse
    • Author by JuiceD (May 31, 2007 9:43 pm ET)
         

      " Bernstein writes that "[t]here is little question that they were treated more harshly, and often pursued with different standards and more relentlessly -- during virtually the whole of their occupancy of the White House -- than any president and his wife of the twentieth century."

      ***

      I believe the press was hoping for another "Watergate" type scandal to sink their teeth into. Almost every alleged scandal that revolved around the Clintons at that time seemed to be labeled by the media with a "gate" in it's title. Monicagate, Travelgate, Whitewatergate, Troopergate.

      Did I forget any?

      Report Abuse
      • Author by steeve (June 01, 2007 6:52 pm ET)
           

        The press wants to sink their teeth into another Whitewater?

        There's this Bush guy committing an impeachable crime every hour...

        ...just a suggestion.

        Report Abuse
    • Author by proudconservative (May 31, 2007 10:02 pm ET)
         

      Media Matters new slogan...'All Clinton protecting, All the time'.  Keep up the good work George S.!

      Report Abuse
      • Author by NotThatGeorge (June 01, 2007 12:07 am ET)
           

        The rightwingers continuing slogan....

        Unfairly smear and attack the strengths of the liberal Democrats, since given a level playing field, we cannot come close to beating them!

        Hillary keeps getting attacked, and so does Media Matters, because the rightwingers know that Hillary is their toughest opponent and because they know that Media Matters is a great weapon against the rightwing disinformation machine!

        Report Abuse
        • Author by Taz (June 01, 2007 9:49 am ET)
             

          the rightwingers know that Hillary is their toughest opponent

          Yes that's what the Right are counting on for the Left to believe. Hillary can't win a general election and the Right knows it. You fools are falling right into their trap. You better hope Gore gets into the race.

          Report Abuse
          • Author by steve expat (June 01, 2007 11:01 am ET)
               

            Hillary Clinton is the only Democratic candidate that has a chance to lose against the sad crop of Republicans.  This is because there are just too many people (mostly on the right, but add some of us on the left) who will not vote for Clinton under any circumstances.  Any other candidate running will absolutley trounce the Republicans. 

            Report Abuse
            • Author by bingvangorden (June 01, 2007 12:21 pm ET)
                 

              If your on the left and you don't vote for Clinton if she becomes the nominee you are cutting your nose off despite your face. I'm a liberal and no fan of either Clinton but letting another Republican idiot into the White House is simply not in our nation's interests. Hillary can be persuaded to return to the left if we make her. If Mitt or Rudolph get in there, there is no chance. We will continue to slide into the new world order, we'll be using Ameros in lieu of the dollar and the poor will outnumber the middle class. Put down the Nader/LaDuke sign and face it. We have a two party system and it aint going to change on the national level anytime soon.

              Report Abuse
              • Author by steve expat (June 01, 2007 2:40 pm ET)
                   

                It's quite simple.  We were out there protesting the war and Hillary Clinton shat on us and voted for it, despite our saying upfront that we would never vote for a candidate who voted for that war.  Then we were guilted into voting for John "I'm going to fight a smarter war" Kerry.  I'm not doing it again.  If there are no consequences to a cowardly politician when they take the easy way out and vote for a war, then they will just continue to do so.  Hillary will never get my vote and I frankly don't give a crap anymore what the consequences are.  If you don't like my attitude, don't nominate her or write off the votes of people like me.  That's certainly what Hillary has decided to do.

                Report Abuse
                • Author by redking75687 (June 02, 2007 11:08 am ET)
                     

                  Amen, brother. Now if we can only get everyone to vote their consciences, this would be a far better nation.

                  Report Abuse
          • Author by NotThatGeorge (June 03, 2007 1:02 am ET)
               

            The next time I take advice from a rightwinger about how I should live my political life will be the last time I do so.

            I am not a Hillary supporter, and I have said, on this site, that I think Hillary's negatives are really high, and I wish she had been cognizant of that fact, and had chosen to not run.

            None of that changes the fact that the right is scared to death of her, and she is their biggest challenge, and that's why they're unfairly smearing her over and over again.

            Report Abuse
        • Author by ehull (June 01, 2007 6:44 pm ET)
             

           That's why liberal dems are a minority in this country and libs in general have always been a minority.

            We may elect a democrat, but this country won't elect a far left liberal anytime soon. 

          Report Abuse
          • Author by solon (June 02, 2007 9:15 am ET)
               

            There are more Dems than Republicans in the country and the largest bloc of Democrats are self professed liberals. Conservatives are also a minority, most Americans consider themselves to be moderate. You MAY be right and you may not be right. Kerry came very close to being elected president and he is pretty liberal. I dont see a Dennis Kucinich winning anytime soon but Obama is pretty liberal and he has a good shot at being president. When are you guys going to learn that just because you WISH it were true that doesnt MAKE it true>

            Report Abuse
            • Author by redking75687 (June 02, 2007 11:03 am ET)
                 

              Neither Kerry or Obama are liberals. Both are corporatists, both are fans of Israel, both are two-faced liars who talk one thing and vote another...except Kerry, he declines to vote more than any other Senator...worst attendance record of the bunch.

              Gotta go Green, man. We got to start the revolution. It's a very weak and disorganized party right now, but we need to support them. They are the only alternative against this fascist Duopoly of the Dems and Repubs. The more good liberal minds we get into the party, the better it will get.

              Report Abuse
              • Author by solon (June 02, 2007 8:34 pm ET)
                   

                I AM a Green have been for years. Look I agree with you a whole lot but you really get annoyingly strident. You dont have to be as liberal as I am to be a liberal. Kerry IS fairly liberal. Liberals are not like conservatives we dont agree lockstep on all the issues. Look at Kerrys voting record he is consistantly liberal though you are right not on all issues. He took on the BCCI bank when neither Dems NOR the GOP wanted to do anything about them because they were a cash cow for both parties. Give the man a break. Continue to demand ideological purity from liberals and you will be in a very small party.

                Report Abuse
                • Author by NotThatGeorge (June 03, 2007 1:06 am ET)
                     

                  RedKing's too partisan to be fair-minded.

                  He claims Republicans and Democrats are the same, and they're not.

                  He claims that many Democrats are not liberal, or claims that most of their candidates are right-wing! They're not right-wing, and there are many liberal Democrats.

                  Report Abuse
      • Author by solon (June 02, 2007 9:10 am ET)
           

        New conservative slogan. All ignorance all the time.

        Report Abuse
    • Author by tex (June 01, 2007 5:21 am ET)
         

      1. The rightwing "mainstream" media continue to lie, distort, and smear with their targets being Democrats in general and the Clintons in particular.

      2. The MISINFORMATION contained in these lies, distortions, and smears are factually rebutted daily by MMFA, in ways that are highly embarrassing to the Rightwing Media ... because they cannot defend their rightwing bias when countered by the FACTS.

      3. It is a FACT that the Clintons were the MOST INVESTIGATED first couple in our history (including Nixon and Reagan), and that tremendously more money and time was spent by the Clintons' rightwing foes trying to "get" them. It is a FACT that after all that money (estimated over $600 Million) and all that high-dollar legal time (incalculable) invested by the rightwing, all they managed to "uncover" was some oral sex (which wasn't even illegal!). Of course, the GOP impeached anyway, and the GOP FAILED MISERABLY.

      4. Without MMFA, WHO would be pointing out the corruption and craven tactics of the "media"? Answer: almost NOBODY. Therefore, the rightwing will do anything possible to destroy and/or discredit MMFA. Luckily for America, the Rightwing Smear Machine no longer has power or credibility. Anymore, they are pissing directly into the wind, and are wearing the result. Embarrassing. 

      Report Abuse
      • Author by NotThatGeorge (June 03, 2007 1:10 am ET)
           

        They attack their opponent's strengths.

        They attack Media Matters.

        They attack the good posters here.

        They attack the strongest Democratic candidates, and attack those candidate's strengths, like John Kerry's military record, or John Edwards' record on helping the poor. Why do you think they're all over that haircut? Because they need to attack his strength, which is having empathy for the less well-to-do, and for being an advocate for them. They cannot fight him on a level playing field, so they distort his record, and unfairly smear his character.

        Hopefully the Democratic leadership knows that they attack strengths, and therefore they will publicize both those strengths and debunk the false attacks against them!

        Report Abuse
    • Author by newsdaysnightmare (June 01, 2007 8:27 am ET)
         

      What a crock?  Has anybody asked Hillary when the frist time she had sex with Bill was?  They asked Mitt that question!  Why not Clinton?  Ohhhhh the biased left wing media so blind!

       

      Report Abuse
      • Author by monknj80 (June 01, 2007 8:48 am ET)
           

        Since It seems a bit over your head:

        "3. It is a FACT that the Clintons were the MOST INVESTIGATED first couple in our history (including Nixon and Reagan), and that tremendously more money and time was spent by the Clintons' rightwing foes trying to "get" them. It is a FACT that after all that money (estimated over $600 Million) and all that high-dollar legal time (incalculable) invested by the rightwing, all they managed to "uncover" was some oral sex (which wasn't even illegal!). Of course, the GOP impeached anyway, and the GOP FAILED MISERABLY."

        TEX

         

        Get over it dude. If that's all you have to prove the "Left wing Media", you got a little more work to do.

        Report Abuse
        • Author by tex (June 01, 2007 1:25 pm ET)
             

          MON:

          There is nothing to "get over", dude. The historical record, the efforts to smear the Clintons with false allegations, the extensive investigations with subpeonas and requiring oath testimony (which Bushies have mostly avoided, being convicted of crime whenever Oath Testimony is called for), the complete WASHOUT in trying to find any substance to a host of phony "scandals" ... all are factual and documented. NOTHING to Whitewater, NOTHING to "Chinese Contributions", NOTHING to Monica, NOTHING to Arlington Cemetery, NOTHING, NOTHING, NOTHING.

          So, what's there to "get over", unless of course you refer to a double standard whereby Dems are given the third degree every waking moment, while GOPers should always get a pass? Double Standards cannot be "got over", the scrutiny can and should be identical.

          If BUSH had received ONE TENTH of the investigative scrutiny which was leveled at the Clintons, he would have been successfully impeached YEARS ago. And that is exactly why the Bush Administration is the most arrogant, and least accountable, administration in history. They cannot stand the LEAST scrutiny. (Good God, they even fought against having an investigation into 9/11!) 

          Report Abuse
          • Author by snoopy (June 01, 2007 3:12 pm ET)
               

            Tex,

            re-read what Monk wrote, it wasn't directed at you. He used your post to re-point out the liberal media lie to the newbie.

            Report Abuse
          • Author by redking75687 (June 02, 2007 11:13 am ET)
               

            But they didn't investigate Clinton for any of his REAL crimes. Chemical warfare against South American civilians, denial of medical supplies to Iraqi civilians, the intentional bombing of civilian targets in several nations, and illegal bombings of Serbia, Iraq, and Sudan.

            They went after his sex life and financial dealings, but not his violations of the Geneva Conventions and Nuremburg Charter. I wonder why.

            Report Abuse
      • Author by dave_chicago (June 01, 2007 10:21 am ET)
           

        ---"Has anybody asked Hillary when the frist time she had sex with Bill was? They asked Mitt that question!"---

        Romney was not asked that question.

        He was asked by Mike Wallace if he had premarital sex, in context with what Romney had been talking about:

        -"Wallace didn’t simply blurt out the question. It came after Romney’s explanation he had known his wife since they were high school sweethearts and feared he might lose her to another man while he was completing his two-year Mormon missionary service in France and she attended Brigham Young University in Utah.

        “You get all these Mormons out there with strict prohibition against premarital sex,” said Romney. “They’re young and they’re attractive, the hormones work very well and people decide it’s time to get married.”

        “Did you have premarital sex with Ann?” Wallace asked softly, in a scene where she was sitting nearby, listening to the question off camera."-

        [link to www.tonawanda-news.com]

        Report Abuse
        • Author by oscar the grouch (June 01, 2007 11:25 am ET)
             

          Did the question have to be asked at all, based on Romney's comments? No. But Wallace asked it anyway. So similar questions should be fair game for all the candidates, R and D.

          Report Abuse
          • Author by dave_chicago (June 01, 2007 11:47 am ET)
               

            The point of my post was to refute the assertion, by the previous poster, that Romney was asked "when he first had sex". He wasn't asked that question. And the question he WAS asked had relevant context to it.

            Whether the question put to Romney was appropriate or not (I don't really think it was) is another matter. But it hardly even begins to rise to the level of what the Clintons were, and still are, being subject to.

            Report Abuse
            • Author by ehull (June 01, 2007 6:49 pm ET)
                 

               there was NO relative context to ask that question. It was stupid and offensive and Wallace, old man or not, deserved a smack in the face for asking it.

                And just because he was asked doesn't mean the Clintons should be asked similar question, or Obama or any other candidate. This personal stuff couldn't be LESS important. 

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              • Author by solon (June 02, 2007 11:57 pm ET)
                   

                Well I am in between on this. I think the case can be made that there is context for the question, especially considering the media's obsession with all things trivial and/or sex related. Having said that I think the question was way out of bounds. Far to obnoxious for ANY reason other than him campaigning on a platform opposing pre-marital sex. So I agree with you that no one should be asked such a question and consider the context excuse a bit thin.

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          • Author by NotThatGeorge (June 03, 2007 1:14 am ET)
               

            Like I said to you yesterday, given the prefacing comments by a Democrat, like Romney made, I'd have no problem with similar questions asked of a Democrat.

            Unlike many rightwingers here, I'm not a hypocrite!

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      • Author by juliajayne (June 01, 2007 12:45 pm ET)
           

        Nightmare is just using distraction as a technique since he could not respond appropriately to Tex's intelligent post. 

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      • Author by NotThatGeorge (June 03, 2007 1:12 am ET)
           

        This has already been explained, countless times.

        Mitt was asked about it after he brought it up himself!

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    • Author by snoopy (June 01, 2007 10:06 am ET)
         

      Short answer? There's a better chance that they'll do a dan rather on lou dobbs for his repeated lies about leprosy on the rise because of illegal mexicans. In reichwing land, you have to be pro democrat to get canned for things like that.

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      • Author by snoopy (June 01, 2007 12:36 pm ET)
           

        How Lou Dobbs handles his Dan Rather moment:

        LOU DOBBS: And “The New York Times” criticizing me, accusing me of mistakes of fact of two years ago and four years ago. Tonight we’ll set the record straight. We’ll tell you who’s really telling the truth and who the commies are and who the fascists are, who have the temerity to attack me.

        But no, if we say the same thing back to them it's childish name calling!

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    • Author by bingvangorden (June 01, 2007 12:29 pm ET)
         

      The short answer to Media Matters question is, no. It sells to bash the Clintons. Meat head conservatives lap it up. As Tex and many other posters have presented. The evidence of the main stream media's bias towards the Clintons is overwhelming. From one investigation to another, from Whitewater to Monica, the GOP exposed themselves as a party of petty politics and lust for power. The media has not scrutinized Bush to the extent they did the Clintons and continue to. So sadly I don't expect the media to correct itself any time soon. It also makes the assertion that there is a liberal media bias as being absolutely devoid of reason. If there had been, the Republicans would have been exposed as the hypocritical wing nuts they were.

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    • Author by mary59 (June 01, 2007 2:49 pm ET)
         

      The Green party would seem to be the natural place for progressives tired of politics as usual.  But as an earlier poster said, too many "Greens" in line with Ralph Nader are so self righteous that they can't work with people who have different viewpoints.  The country will change slowly over time as the overall understanding of the populace evolves.  This will involve imperfect people who move at a glacial pace but move in a positive overall direction.

      In this respect as others have said here, I'd vote for Hillary if she became the Democratic nominee.  (I'd rather vote for Edwards)

      The media bias against the Clintons is extraordinary.  We need less bogus hype over nothing and more exploration of how policy affects people.

       

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      • Author by conleytgwinn (June 01, 2007 3:33 pm ET)
           

        The difficulty, and the fear, that accompany your hope that the "overall understanding of the populace [will] evolve(s)" is that evidence is compelling that the overall understanding of the populace has DEvolved catastrophically. Once there was discourse - inflamed, angry, hateful, even fatal (Burr/Hamilton) - but exchange of ideas between partisans of one or another notion of how to run things. Now, there is only the propaganda machine of the Repugnants, abetted by their alignment with the corporate Media; and knowledge of what the policies are, what the implications of the policies might be, knowledge even of the factual situ to which we hope to apply the policies - is preempted by the latest "Hollywood" scandal.

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      • Author by redking75687 (June 02, 2007 11:22 am ET)
           

        Why does everyone complain we Greens refuse to cooperate with other viewpoints? Are we supposed to compromise with fascism, corporatism, war crimes, evil? Being a Green means opposing all that stuff. Why are we the ones expected to compromise with the bad guys? One thing I have learned from watching lots and lots of Doctor Who is that you NEVER compromise with evil....if you do make deals with it, it will stab you in the back first chance it gets. Evil tries to manipulate to it's advantage in all situations. Compromise just opens up opportunities for it to do so.

        One resists evil and never colloborates, for to do so makes one evil as well.

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        • Author by steve k (June 02, 2007 4:53 pm ET)
             

          In many ways you (and the Greens in general) are the mirror image of the right-wing maniacs you rail against, Redking. Like them, you can't imagine that you might have a single thing to learn from people who don't think exactly as you do. You sneer at the Bible, calling it a bunch of bloody-minded fairytales, yet you proudly claim Doctor Who as the source of your life lessons. You share the Manichean worldview of the neocons: that you're morally superior to everyone else, and everyone who isn't exactly like you is absolute evil and must be destroyed.

          As they do, you believe that leadership consists of commanding people to do what you want them to do, and expecting them to do it without protest or question. The idea that a leader might have to listen to everyone's concerns and do his best to reach a decision that takes all of them into account is completely foreign to you.

          Really the only difference between you and the right-wing nuts is that they're willing to work to change the system to their liking, while you're content to lecture others on how they should behave and whine about how nobody sees things your way.

          You once commented that you felt like the only adult in a country full of children. I've never heard anything more condescending on this board. If that's the level of respect you accord others' views, then you shouldn't be surprised when they simply shut you out.

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    • Author by kevin1007 (June 01, 2007 6:34 pm ET)
         

      "Carl Bernstein writes that "[t]here is little question that [the Clintons] were treated more harshly, and often pursued with different standards and more relentlessly -- during virtually the whole of their occupancy of the White House -- than any president and his wife of the twentieth century."

      Note that the "twentieth century" does not include the Bush presidency. Some of the most unfair and most harsh treatment of a president by the media, including the corpulent Bernstein, has been directed at Bush 43.

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      • Author by solon (June 02, 2007 9:20 am ET)
           

        You are flat out delusional. Bush is treated with kid gloves. He lied over and over and wasnt called on it. It took a MONTH for the press to say anything about the Downing street memo. Bush deserves 10 times the bad press he gets. A lying, arrogant, ignorant creature he gets pass after pass from the press.

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    • Author by lamberthml5354 (June 02, 2007 9:58 am ET)
         

       But so far the media have not mentioned that Berstein defends the Clintons at all but focus on her personality.

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    • Author by misterb (June 03, 2007 4:19 pm ET)
         

      AS LONG AS THE media is owned by right wing republicans the media will continue to spew right wing lies. The public media has now become as much a propaganda tool of the right as was the media under Nazi Germany or the media under the Soviet State. I suspect that the downturn in viewership, small but measureable, of the national news programs is a product of viewer revulsion.

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