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NY Times suggests hypocrisy in Reid's entirely consistent actions

July 17, 2007 2:28 pm ET
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41 Comments

A July 17 New York Times article asserted that Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid's (D-NV) plan to, in the Times' words, "keep the Senate in session through the night on Tuesday in an effort to highlight Republican resistance to allowing a simple majority vote on a plan to withdraw troops from Iraq" has caused "some eye-rolling" because "Democrats said they were determined to protect the rights of the minority" during a 2003 showdown over judicial nominations. The article then quoted Sen. John Warner (R-VA) extolling the "old rules" of the Senate that allow the minority party to filibuster. But, contrary to the article's suggestion, Reid has done nothing to change or bend those "old rules" or to undermine the right of the minority party to filibuster legislative actions it opposes. Indeed, reporter Carl Hulse gave no explanation for his suggestion that Reid's decision to force Republicans to carry out an actual filibuster of the withdrawal plan -- rather than simply allowing them to block the measure through a cloture vote -- is somehow inconsistent with the Democrats' efforts to protect the rights of the minority party in 2003.

From the July 17 Times article:

It was a role reversal from the last such all-night session in November 2003. Senate Republicans kept the Senate open to complain about the Democrats' refusal to allow up-or-down votes on Mr. Bush's judicial nominees. Republicans did not record an immediate victory. But they say the judicial marathon eventually helped to weaken Democratic resistance and pin the label of obstructionist on Senator Tom Daschle of South Dakota, the Democratic leader, who was unseated by voters the next year.

During the judicial battle, Democrats said they were determined to protect the rights of the minority, so there was some eye-rolling Monday as Mr. Reid announced his plan.

"These are old rules that date back, I might say with some sense of pride, to Thomas Jefferson," said Senator John W. Warner, Republican of Virginia.

By asserting that "[d]uring the judicial battle, Democrats said they were determined to protect the rights of the minority, so there was some eye-rolling Monday as Mr. Reid announced his plan" before quoting Sen. Warner's assertion that "[t]hese are old rules," the Times suggested that Reid and Democrats were taking steps similar to those taken in 2003, when Republicans publicly floated the idea of changing Senate rules to eliminate the filibuster in the case of judicial nominations. Reid and the Democrats have made no such proposal.

On June 25, 2003, The Washington Post reported on the GOP plan to prevent Democrats from filibustering:

With Democrats conspicuously absent, a Senate committee's Republican majority approved a GOP leadership proposal yesterday to curb filibusters aimed at blocking President Bush's judicial nominations.

But the proposal faces formidable obstacles in the Senate, where Democrats, with the likely support of some Republicans, appear to have enough votes to keep it from taking effect. Proposed last month by Majority Leader Bill Frist (R-Tenn.) and approved yesterday, 10 to 0, by the Rules and Administration Committee, the measure would prevent senators from indefinitely delaying a vote on any presidential nomination.

It normally takes 60 votes in the 100-member Senate to stop a filibuster and bring a nomination to a vote. Under Frist's proposal, the number would decline in successive roll calls: from 60 to 57, then 54 and eventually to a simple majority of 51. The process could take as little as two weeks.

Frist's move was prompted by fury among Republican colleagues over Democrats' filibusters to prevent confirmation votes on the federal appeals court nominations of Miguel Estrada and Priscilla R. Owen and threats of filibusters against at least two others. His proposal gathered steam as speculation increased that one or more Supreme Court justices might retire at the end of the court's term this month, opening the way for Bush to fill his first vacancy on the high court.

Reid's July 16 statement announcing his intention to force an overnight Republican filibuster asserted that Democrats sought not to end the filibuster, but to draw attention to it. From Reid's statement:

All Senators will be welcome to speak their mind. Those of us who are ready to end the war will make our case to the American people. Those who support the status quo are welcome to equal floor time to make their case. Let the American people hear the arguments. Let them see their elected representatives engaging in a full, open and honest debate. Let them hear why Republicans are obstructing us on this amendment.

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    • Author by conleytgwinn (July 17, 2007 2:38 pm ET)
         

      Of course Reid's actions are consistent with his words.

      Of course the Repugnants and the corporate Media claim otherwise. They, after all, lie for pleasure and profit.

      Report Abuse
      • Author by Dem02020 (July 17, 2007 3:34 pm ET)
           

        I'm not sure why so many "media" reports are characterizing what's happening as being the work of Senate Democrats.

        The carl hulse NYTimes piece being typical, with it's headline "Democrats Plan to Keep Senate in Session All Night for Iraq Vote".

        When a cloture motion is filed, and voted on... and when 41 U.S. Senators (a minority, as are the Republicans in this case) vote NO on cloture... then it is they, the minority, refusing to invoke cloture...they are insisting the matter continue to be debated.

        In essence, to vote NO on cloture (NO to bringing the measure to the floor for a vote), is to 'filibuster'; is to keep debating.

        Senate Democrats are just giving those who vote NO on cloture what it is they want: To be dealt with, to be heard, to keep debating.

        And as far as voting NO on cloture, why should they do that?

        If they wish to vote NO on S.Amdt.2087 ("Reduction and Transition of U.S. Forces in Iraq"), they can do that... they can vote No on that... why not vote YEA on cloture?

        George W. Bush is going to veto it anyway, so why should Republican Senators stand in the way, shielding the president from exercising his veto?

        It's George W. Bush's invasion and occupation of Iraq; it's his lies that impelled all this death and expense... it won't come to an end should the Senate pass this cloture motion.

        The president will veto the measure... there will be no "Reduction and Transition of U.S. Forces in Iraq" as a result, should the Senate pass cloture, and present the matter to George W. Bush.

        Let it happen... pass the ball to George W. Bush (to veto).

        It's his baby, let him suckle it... why should these Republican Senators be acting as his wet nurse in this matter.

        Report Abuse
        • Author by snoopy (July 17, 2007 4:26 pm ET)
             

          I almost agreed with you about passing it to Bush, then I thought to myself that if they did, and Bush subsequently vetoed, that there might be enough republican defections by then to sustain a veto override. Leading me to believe that republicans aren't coddling bush, they just don't trust their own to toe the line anymore.

          Report Abuse
          • Author by Dem02020 (July 17, 2007 4:46 pm ET)
               

            It's their train wreck anyway; they could jump off now or ride it to collision... either way, it's a train wreck.

            And the longer they (Senate Republicans) take in realizing what we all know:

            That there is no National Security purpose being served, by sacrificing the American People's Sons and Daughters in Iraq

            ...the longer they take to be in accord with us on this, the more U.S. Troops they get killed in the process.

            It's a train wreck... time to wake up, and do the right thing.

            Report Abuse
    • Author by ChristianDemocrat (July 17, 2007 2:40 pm ET)
         

      I don't think...we ARE all bozos on this bus.  G*% damn it, get over it!  Get our people out of Iraq lest it become the 30 year British experience in Palestine.

      Report Abuse
    • Author by eweston8542983 (July 17, 2007 2:46 pm ET)
         

      Despite obstructionist tactics. The Senate voted on 274 items in the last six months. This is versis 279 votes in all of 2006. In a possible inversion we may see if the GOP Senators can put their mouth were their money is.

      Report Abuse
      • Author by monknj80 (July 17, 2007 2:52 pm ET)
           

        THank you for pointing that out. I am sick of this meme that the current congress isn't doing anythng despite the obstruction and virtually surpassing theGOP congress inthe first few months alone. That being said the DNC could still grow more of a spine for my liking.

         

        Stop issuing subpoenas and then throwing a hissy fit when the administration doesn't comply. Do something with some bite to it. Hold the bastards in contempt and fight it out in the courts. I'm sick of this holding backby the DNC. At least show some balls when your getting vetoed. 

        Report Abuse
        • Author by tommy (July 17, 2007 3:09 pm ET)
             

          Monk,

          You make some good points about the spineless Congress, perhaps if they grew some their poll ratings would be higher than Bush's right now.

          Report Abuse
          • Author by monknj80 (July 17, 2007 3:13 pm ET)
               

            I'm on their side, but they need to show me more. I understand they face some tough odds, but if they know the Right side of the aile is going to fight them tooth and nail they need to do the same thing. The Dems are trying to play it quasi-bipartisan and the reps are staying diehard for the most part.

            Report Abuse
            • Author by bittermarv (July 17, 2007 3:22 pm ET)
                 

              I'm with ya.  I'm still smarting over the way Democrats rolled over on the Iraq funding bill.

              Report Abuse
              • Author by tman418 (July 17, 2007 4:33 pm ET)
                   

                Well hey, for what it's worth, the Democrats raised the minimum wage with the war spending bill.

                Report Abuse
                • Author by roundhouse (July 17, 2007 5:45 pm ET)
                     

                  That they did, and it's worth the mention.

                  I don't know why it has taken them so long to figure out that they have the majority and they have overwhelming public support on issue after issue. From stem cell research, to Iraq, to healthcare, to gay rights and on and on.

                  We're not like Republicans. We're responsible and active liberals, if the Dems get out of line we'll reel them in, they work for us. There should be no holding back right now.

                  Report Abuse
          • Author by loonz (July 17, 2007 3:21 pm ET)
               

            Congress will get my approval once they start drafting articles of impeachment for both Cheney and Bush.

            Report Abuse
          • Author by DorisRussell (July 17, 2007 3:24 pm ET)
               

            I could not agree with you more. Congress is spineless and that is exactly why they are less popular than even Bush who is the worst failure America has ever seen. Our entire government is a failure and the media needs to report it like that. 

            Report Abuse
            • Author by redking75687 (July 17, 2007 7:06 pm ET)
                 

              They're too busy schmoozing with them and trying to glom onto the fame and power. Don't expect crawling bootlickers to suddenly grow a conscience.

              Report Abuse
        • Author by ChristianDemocrat (July 17, 2007 3:13 pm ET)
             

          the DNC could still grow more of a spine for my liking

          I agree.  Even Reid's plan I'd like to see taken further, i.e., the rest of the week rather than just one night.  At least his call is a good step in the right direction...and well within the letter and spirit of the rules and not hypocritical at all.

          Report Abuse
          • Author by monknj80 (July 17, 2007 3:21 pm ET)
               

            See that's my point exactly. This all night thingy would be a good start, but the gop will just filibuster it and that would be the ed of it. That being said if the GOP should filibuster the debate, they do look increasingly weak.

            Report Abuse
        • Author by pointybongo9213 (July 17, 2007 3:14 pm ET)
             

          The wheels are turning, though it sure seems slow to most of us. Leahy & Conyers know what they're doing: building an airtight case, and making sure all the t's are crossed & the i's dotted. I'm guessing that they have a lot more information at their disposal than they're letting on... I sure hope so. 

          In the meantime, momentum for impeachment is building steadily. Over half the US population support Cheney's removal now. 

          Report Abuse
      • Author by bittermarv (July 17, 2007 3:20 pm ET)
           

        The Senate voted on 274 items in the last six months. This is versis 279 votes in all of 2006.

        Amazing what you can accomplish when you work more than two days of the week. 

        Report Abuse
    • Author by Harlequin (July 17, 2007 3:53 pm ET)
         

      Many feel demoralized because they feel the Democratic Party hasn't done enough to end this criminal enterprise of Bush.

      Our concerns have been heard and we have given weakened the control of Rupublicans in the Legislative Branch.

      But do not lose site of the fact that Bush also know the People have had it with his polly want a cracker speeches.

      So of all people whom does Bush invite to the White House for consultation. None other than Kissinger. Henry gave Bush the same memo he gave Nixon.

      The issue of troop withdrawl was being voiced back then as it is being voiced now. Kissinger's advice to President Nixon famously characterized withdrawals from Vietnam as "salted peanuts" to which the American people would become addicted.

      Should it be no surprise that Bush took Kissinger's advice to heart while ignoring the will of the People. Bush then proceeded to escalate the numbers of troops it's Deja Vu again.

      The Republicans without rhyme or reason also seeks to continue this criminal action of war crimes and attacks against an innocent nation via the act of filibustering.

      Report Abuse
      • Author by cann0nba11 (July 17, 2007 5:51 pm ET)
           

        Just like Kennedy and McCain took advice from La Raza when crafting the failed Immigration bill.

        Bush is a dolt, but Reid is even worse.

        I wonder if he had premarital sex... after all, he's a Mormon too.  

        Report Abuse
    • Author by eweston8542983 (July 17, 2007 6:27 pm ET)
         

      Victims of abstenence schooling are averaging 50% sucess(?) rate. How does that compare to the Moreman population?

      Shrub set the bar pretty high. Some examples of how Reid surpasses him would probably be pretty hysterical. We could all use a laugh or share one CANNoNBA11. 

      Report Abuse
    • Author by eweston8542983 (July 17, 2007 7:12 pm ET)
         

      Should be Mormon, sorry.

      Report Abuse
    • Author by redking75687 (July 17, 2007 7:15 pm ET)
         

      According to the Democrats plan for "withdrawal", "some" troops are to remain in Iraq to "fight terrorism", "train the Iraqi military", and "protect assets and personnel". So we will continue to occupy Iraq, blow up the natives and blame it on insurgents, back a puppet regime noone likes and that has no power, attack it's "enemies" and train it's death squads, and keep forces to protect US-bought oil fields and other corporate "interests".

      Uhm, isn't that what's happening right now? Is anyone but me noticing that the Dems are offering us EXACTLY THE SAME THING as the Repubs?

       

      Report Abuse
      • Author by oldmarine (July 17, 2007 10:44 pm ET)
           

        Of course they are.  If they really thought the polls showed overwhelmingly that the public wanted us to quit Iraq regardless of the consequences, we'd have been out of there in February.  Fact is, the congressional Democrats, in spite of their political rhetoric, know the American people don't really want to see us defeated in Iraq.  They have no solution other than the Republican-like tactics you cite.

        Report Abuse
        • Author by solon (July 18, 2007 4:22 am ET)
             

          The American public is tired of warmongers pushing the lets get as many Americans killed as possible in Iraq. EVERY recent poll shows the public wants us out of Iraq.

          Report Abuse
        • Author by bittermarv (July 18, 2007 3:12 pm ET)
             

          know the American people don't really want to see us defeated in Iraq.

          Too late. 

          Report Abuse
        • Author by redking75687 (July 18, 2007 8:03 pm ET)
             

          No, the Dems are offering no change in policy because the Israel Lobby is paying them huge amounts of money to keep US forces killing arabs in the name of the Jewish supremacist movement called "zionism". It's war for, of, and by RACISM.

          Report Abuse
    • Author by eweston8542983 (July 17, 2007 7:36 pm ET)
         

      There's been so little media coverage on a withdrawl. Those sneaky Dems, where were they hiding it?  Details, whats your source?

      Report Abuse
    • Author by eweston8542983 (July 17, 2007 10:27 pm ET)
         

      Kay, Red King I my have run across what your talking about on Talking Points something or other. Don't think all the details have been hashed out yet though.

      Report Abuse
    • Author by Klaybow (July 18, 2007 7:13 am ET)
         

      A lot of talk but no action from all sides.  Yet again, there will be nothing accomplished.

      Report Abuse
    • Author by sambo (July 18, 2007 9:46 am ET)
         

      NY TIMES SUGGEST HYPOCRISY...

       if you believe any political assertions coming from the NYTs or the other

      4 associates is a good indication you are not getting the truth. only what the bush administration and AIPAC wants said 

      Report Abuse
      • Author by olivelawyers (July 18, 2007 11:06 am ET)
           

        Glad to see this back on thread, though with the war being the most important issue out there it's easy to get sidetracked.

        Reid is forcing this for two reasons: the specific bill is important; and, the Republican threat to renew Gingrich's Clinton policy of obstructing everything the Democratic members propose has to be dealt with any way possible. It is hardly hypocritical to distinguish between protecting the rights of the minority with respect to a bona fide view on controversial legislation; it is another to protect the government from being totally shut down. It happened once before and many of the same people who did it then are still there. While Clinton exposed it and got reelected in part as a result of it, Reid cannot afford to let this gather more momentum, for the sake of the anti-war effort and every other issue facing the nation.

        Report Abuse
    • Author by mary59 (July 18, 2007 3:43 pm ET)
         

      Frankly I think too many arm chair quarterbacks here and elsewhere think it's a cakewalk to get things done in the Senate.  Let's face it:  a lot of the electorate voted in the Republicans who are using Senate rules to filibuster this bill as well as others.   Lieberman is a dem in name only and wants more war.  The dems in the senate need to work cooperately with the few republicans that will brake ranks occasionally to vote with them. 

      Again, if we want better leaders, the country needs to wake up and elect more progressives.  Blame the people who voted either deliberately or in ignorance for regressive policies.

      Report Abuse

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