Media misrepresent Clyburn remarks to air attacks on Democrats
Several conservative commentators have misrepresented July 30 comments by House Majority Whip James Clyburn (D-SC) in an effort to suggest that Democrats want "their country [to] lose a war because otherwise they might lose an election," as Fox News' John Gibson put it. In addition, some media outlets have uncritically reported Republican attacks on Clyburn without providing context. What Clyburn said, in fact, is that if Gen. David Petraeus were to report in September that the military effort in Iraq "is working very, very well at this point; we would be foolish to back away from it," it would cause "those 47 Blue Dogs ... to want to stay the course, and if the Republicans were to remain united, as they have been, then it would be a problem for us." In other words, Clyburn did not say that good news from Iraq is bad news for Democrats in electoral terms, but rather that a recommendation from Petraeus against withdrawal would impede Democrats' efforts to garner support in Congress for legislation to begin withdrawal. Indeed, Clyburn added: "None of us want to see a bad result in Iraq. If we are going to get in position to yield a good result, I think Democrats want to see that."
From the July 30 "PostTalk" interview of Clyburn on washingtonpost.com, video of which is available at the website:
BALZ: What do Democrats do if General Petraeus comes in in September and says, "This is working very, very well at this point; we would be foolish to back away from it"?
CLYBURN: Well, that would be a real big problem for us, no question about that, simply because of those 47 Blue Dogs. I think there would be enough support in that group to want to stay the course, and if the Republicans were to remain united, as they have been, then it would be a problem for us.
So I think we, by and large, would do wise -- be wise to wait on the report. None of us want to see a bad result in Iraq. If we are going to get in position to yield a good result, I think Democrats want to see that. We love this country. We're as patriotic as anybody else about this. And we have loved ones involved in this issue just like everybody else. I've got family and friends involved in Iraq and Afghanistan, and so I certainly want to see a good result. But I'm certainly not going to just roll over because the president said. It is only because we get good intelligence from those people like General Petraeus who can be trusted to give us good information.
In an August 1 post about Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney on the washingtonpost.com blog The Trail, which the Post subsequently printed in its August 2 edition, Michael D. Shear noted attacks by Romney on Clyburn:
At each [campaign] stop, Romney also took the opportunity to slam South Carolina Rep. James Clyburn, who said Monday that a positive report from Gen. David Petraeus on progress in Iraq "would be a problem for us." Romney demanded clarification from Clyburn.
"Sometimes they say things they ought to withdraw," he told reporters.
Shear noted the attacks without presenting the context of Clyburn's remarks or indicating that he had given Clyburn a chance to respond. As Media Matters for America noted, an article in the August 2 edition of Roll Call also paraphrased Clyburn, rather than accurately quoting him, and left out the full context of his comments.
In an August 2 National Review Online op-ed headlined "Good News Is Bad News: At least it is for politicians who have bet on America's defeat," conservative columnist Clifford D. May asserted: "As House Majority Whip James Clyburn suggested this week, success in Iraq also would be awkward for those who have bet their political chips on American failure." May added: "To be precise, Clyburn said that it would be 'a real big problem for us' should General Petraeus return to Washington next month and present a positive report on progress in Iraq." May did not quote any of Clyburn's other comments.
In a July 31 entry on his U.S. News & World Report blog, conservative columnist Michael Barone noted that Clyburn said the "problem" was holding together the caucus in favor of changing course in Iraq but nevertheless asserted, "The nightmare scenario for Democrats is that increasing numbers of Americans will see progress in Iraq and will not want to accept defeat when they could have victory." Barone also pointed to the Post interview as evidence that Clyburn "is already having such a nightmare." He went on to assert that a "political party gets itself in a bad position when military success for the nation is a 'real big problem for us.' Voters generally want their politicians to root for the nation, not against it." He did not quote Clyburn's statement that he and other Democrats "certainly want to see a good result." From Barone's blog entry:
The nightmare scenario for Democrats is that increasing numbers of Americans will see progress in Iraq and will not want to accept defeat when they could have victory. House Majority Whip Jim Clyburn, according to the Washington Post's Dan Balz and Chris Cillizza, is already having such a nightmare. He said that a positive report by Gen. David Petraeus in September will be "a real big problem for us":
Clyburn noted that Petraeus carries significant weight among the 47 members of the Blue Dog caucus in the House, a group of moderate to conservative Democrats. Without their support, he said, Democratic leaders would find it virtually impossible to pass legislation setting a timetable for withdrawal.
The "us" in question is of course the House Democratic leadership. A political party gets itself in a bad position when military success for the nation is a "real big problem for us." Voters generally want their politicians to root for the nation, not against it. We're still a good distance from this nightmare scenario for congressional Democrats, and we may never get there. But it seems that Jim Clyburn, a highly competent politician and from everything I've seen a really nice man, is worried about it.
During the "My Word" segment on the July 31 edition of Fox News' The Big Story with John Gibson, Gibson, like Barone, noted that Clyburn was talking about keeping the Democratic caucus together. Gibson stated: "Representative Jim Clyburn, a Democrat of South Carolina, is quoted by The Washington Post as saying that a positive report on the surge from General Petraeus in September is going to cause, quote, 'unity problems for Democrats in the House of Representatives.' Translation: 'If we're winning, some conservative-minded Democrats won't want to quit Iraq as quickly as [House Speaker] Nancy Pelosi [D-CA] and [Senate Majority Leader] Harry Reid [D-NV] would like. Those Democrats will think, "If we're winning, why should we surrender?" ' " However, later in the same segment, Gibson distorted Clyburn's comments, asserting that they showed that some politicians' "nightly prayers are evidently that their country lose a war because otherwise they might lose an election":
GIBSON: So, something like winning, such as a good surge report, is simply bad news from the war front for some Democrats. If we can believe Clyburn, some Blue Dog Democrats -- the more conservative ones than others -- don't carry their disdain for Bush to the extreme that they need their country to lose a war. For that, they should be commended. But what about the others who are not that sensible? What should we say about politicians who actually fear a good report on the surge, whose nightly prayers are evidently that their country lose a war because otherwise they might lose an election. Oh, the panic. Oh, the terror. Win the war?
Believe it or not, there are Americans for whom that is very, very bad news. You wonder how they sleep, unless it's upside down in a cave. Vampires don't have trouble sleeping.
A July 31 editorial in Investor's Business Daily, headlined "The Wrong Party," similarly misrepresented Clyburn, asserting that he "envisioned it being 'a real big problem for us' if the commander of U.S. forces in Iraq, Gen. David Petraeus, presents Congress with a positive report of progress in September, which seems increasingly likely as sectarian violence drops." The editorial appeared to briefly distinguish an electoral political problem from an issue of caucus unity, asserting that "House Democrats could be fractured, making it harder to mandate a pullout, Clyburn repined." But in the very next line, the editorial again appeared to blur that distinction: "When your country's winning a war is 'a real big problem' for you, it's time to take stock of exactly what your party stands for." The editorial did not note Clyburn's statement that "[n]one of us want to see a bad result in Iraq. If we are going to get in position to yield a good result, I think Democrats want to see that."
A column by Kevin O'Brien in the Cleveland Plain Dealer also misrepresented Clyburn's remarks:
As House Majority Whip James Clyburn, a South Carolina Democrat, admitted to the Washington Post the other day, a positive report from the general would be "a real big problem for us."
No kidding.
If the Democrats have a strategy that goes beyond defeat and retreat in Iraq, they're keeping it to themselves. But the U.S. defeat has to happen before President Bush leaves office, so it can still be all his fault, and so any Democratic successor will not be forced to admit that all of that let's-bring-them-home-right-now stuff was partisan hot air.
The column later quoted Republican presidential candidate John McCain asserting, "I think the transcendent challenge of the 21st century is the struggle against radical Islamic extremism" before asserting, "He's right, so why should good news for our side in that struggle be bad news for the Democrats? At least, that's what the Democrats say."
From the July 31 edition of Fox News' The Big Story with John Gibson:
GIBSON: Now, to "My Word." A bit of Iraq news, now. It appears that the surge may not only be causing trouble for insurgents in Iraq but also causing trouble for Democrats on Capitol Hill. Representative Jim Clyburn, a Democrat of South Carolina, is quoted by The Washington Post as saying that a positive report on the surge from General Petraeus in September is going to cause, quote, "unity problems for Democrats in the House of Representatives." Translation: "If we're winning, some conservative-minded Democrats won't want to quit Iraq as quickly as Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid would like. Those Democrats will think, 'If we're winning, why should we surrender?' "
Would it be too much to suggest that certain other Democrats like Pelosi, Reid, [Rep. John] Murtha [D-PA], [Sen. Russ] Feingold [D-WI] have way too much invested in losing this war? The idea we could win the war cuts the ground from under them. Some Democrats need us to lose for their own political purposes. They've already told the country we're losing. They need to blame Bush and Cheney for losing.
So, something like winning, such as a good surge report, is simply bad news from the war front for some Democrats. If we can believe Clyburn, some Blue Dog Democrats -- the more conservative ones than others -- don't carry their disdain for Bush to the extreme that they need their country to lose a war. For that, they should be commended. But what about the others who are not that sensible? What should we say about politicians who actually fear a good report on the surge, whose nightly prayers are evidently that their country lose a war because otherwise they might lose an election. Oh, the panic. Oh, the terror. Win the war?
Believe it or not, there are Americans for whom that is very, very bad news. You wonder how they sleep, unless it's upside down in a cave. Vampires don't have trouble sleeping.















Ok, how many understood Clyburns remark was about the process of getting most of our military back home.
How many believe his concern was for his parties future in the next round of elections.
Both? Then his dominate concern.
Gibson is an expert on the unliving cycle of Vampire exsistence? My knowledge on the subject is spotty. I thought they had to slept on their native soil. He has proof that they're sleep is untroubled? I suppose in his mental state one fantasy is a good as another.
Perhaps he meant Vampire Bats. In which case I'll give the sleeping position an ok. Still I wonder if they don't have trouble sleeping, but I could be completely out to lunch here.
Um....what?
gesundheit!
What's hilarious about all of this is that the news from Iraq is never going to be good no matter what, so there'll be no trouble for the Democrats in any way. So who are the right-wingers going to blame six months from now? Or six months from that? They can smokescreen all they want, but when will judgement day come for them? Never?
The same media that didn't do it's job to warn America about Bush's hype and lies into this illegal war is continuing their job as WH stenographer is distorting the words of a man who listens to his constituents.
This distortion amounts to telling America to shut up and stay the course with the biggest failure in our United States history. Being a WH stenographer is getting to be such as habit that the media might as well be considered the shackle for the free.
Wow, Clyburn taken out of context!!! First time something like that has ever happened. Read the whole article, linked in a post yesterday, can see where the VRW media people get their spin. Clyburn did not do a good job in thinking through his opening statement. He should have realized how it would be spun, afterall he is a member of the only party in the US to have any smarts.
Yeah, instead of just answering the question honestly he should have first made a political calculation.
Sometimes I think we ought to give these right wing nut jobs English As A Second Language classes.
They seem to misunderstand such simple statements English can't possibly be their native language.
Either they misunderstand or they deliberately lie about something that's easily understood to try to turn it into a political advantage.
Clyburn could say it was the alcohol or drugs that made him say these thing.
Then he could say, he's sorry and is going into rehab.
The statements he made weren't ground shaking, They were what he and his party are worried about. They can afford to lost a power play like the Iraqi war effort. They don't give two bits for the soldiers, for the Iraqi's or for peace in the Middle East for that matter.
It's all about getting the votes so they will have the power to spend the countries money.
It will be hard for the Democrats to further their Socialist agenda when the good American people know their thought process.
Rev,
You sound like you are speaking from experience reagrding the drugs & alcohol situation, maybe it's time for you to enter rehab.
Clyburn was ASKED what his party would do if Petraeus came back with a positive report. He didn't just blurt out that quote with no context.
What if a reporter went to the owner of the Minnesota Twins and asked him how the bridge collapse affected the game. If the Twins owner said, "Well of course we had to cancel the game," would you jump all over him for caring more about the game than those injured in the accident.
Clyburn was asked a question about party politics and he answered it.
Clams,
I think you are spot on that Clyburn is speaking in political terms. However it still comes across as a Freudian Slip and makes the Democrats look very bad.
Clyburn is unequivocally stating that a good report by Prateaus is bad for the Dems political agenda. It is very difficult to spin out of that.
Good news in Iraq = Bad News for Democrats
Bad news in Iraq = Good News for Democrats
Everyone knows that. Clyburn just made the mistake of actually saying it.
Just caught this in the other thread regarding Ambassador Crocker. He is quoted as saying:
Earlier this year, Congress tried to quantify success or failure in Iraq by mandating periodic White House progress reports on 18 military, political and economic benchmarks. When the first report was issued last month, White House officials stressed the positives and Democrats in Congress accentuated the negatives.
You can see this proves Clyburns point.
AA,
How does this prove Clyburn's point?
Only 8 of 18 benchmarks reported "satisfactory progress." Gee, how silly of anyone to find that not such a good sign.
Even worse, of the failed benchmarks the one that Bush found most upsetting was progress in reching an oil revenue sharing agreement.
AA,
You bought the spin and looked beyond what was actually said.
He doesn't say Bad for Dems.
Re-read with your blinders off please.
No spin necessary when you read Rep. Clyburn's response correctly. The Democrats' "political agenda" being getting the troops safely out of Iraq and stopping this illegal, immoral, senseless, and costly (in both human and monetary treasure) war. Squinting when your read tends to blur and skew content. Open eyes and an open and engaged mind will do wonders for one's reading comprehension skills.
AA,
Of course Clyburn was asked a political question, but he could have shown his political motivation was not so fixated on what a "real big problem" it was for him and his fellow Democrats should a positive report be forthcoming. Those were the first words out of his mouth, thus exhibiting what he was most concerned about.
A Freudian slip? That's as good a characterization as I have heard.
Yes Tommy,
His problem is carrying out the wishes of yourself and most of the American Public in getting our troops out of Iraq.
I'm sorry he is fixated on what is best for America.
Then that should been his prioritized answer, instead of how his precious political party will look.
Tommy,
That was his answer!
He didn't say anything about how his party "will look." That's even more of a mischaracterization than the press is committing. You've gone beyond the media spin and now you're just making stuff up.
OK, now please increase your medication and get back to us when you actually have a point. Your ludicrous propaganda parrot imitation was sweet now let the adults talk.
Tman, Read RevColin and AA, Thats what I was talking about.
It was no freudian slip. It was an honest answer, something I realize not many people are used to after 7 years of this administration.
He was asked point blank "What do Democrats do" if Petraeus says the surge is working "very, very well" in September.
He answered the Dems have a problem because the Blue Dogs would want to stay the course and break with those who wanted to redeploy.
It's a political problem given the hypothetical.
Next question:
How many stars on the American flag and what do the represent?
Clyburn said what he said and it was clear: good news from Iraq is bad news for the Democrat party.
This is perfectly consistent not only with what the Democrats say to their left-wing base but moreover in what they do in the congress in their continual attempt to undermine the Iraq war effort at every opportunity: cripple the intel effort, leak classified information which is of value to the enemy, cow-tow to the militant elements of the Islamic community, and undermine the administration with allies and foe alike at every opportunity.
It’s amazing that, in spite of this, the U.S. military on the front in Iraq remains committed and in a state of high morale. I guess we can thank the internet and email from the folks back home for that, certainly not the Democrat party or their buds in the media who carry the water for them.
And here comes Oldmarine with his simplistic, partisan, nonthinking view of the world.
Spout a few more talking points please!
SKEPTICAL,
Yup. A totally different view from yours.
Oldie,
Yes, because I actually think before I make a comment unlike you who just repeats what he has been told.
In our first few discussions I actually had a little respect for you, I no longer do. I don't hink you were ever a Marine. The Marines I know aren't as stupid as you.
good news from Iraq is bad news for the Democrat [sic] party
Probably true. So, the Republicans just have to pray for some good news or make some up. The Administration has alot of experience with the latter.
Oh...the word is kowtow.
Yo, ChrisDemo,
No need to make it up. Just look it up. (You won’t find it on CNN, NPR, NBC, etc.)
No talking points here and I still pose the same wager if you want to discuss odds:
The Demos in congress “have a mandate from the voters to get us out of Iraq”. Right?” Then, what are the odds that the Democrat controlled congress will succeed in pulling us out of Iraq prior to the Nov ’08 elections?
Thanks for the correction on “kowtow”. (I need all of the intellectual help I can get).
Oldie,
Where are we supposed to look it up? You never tell us where you get your information.
Since the ReNAMBLAcans in Congress can filibuster it would be a foolish bet.
Your post is completely ignorant from your repitition of LONG ago debunked talking points to your Democrat party nonsense I keep telling you there is NO Democrat Party, you brainwashed Rush Limbuagh psychophant, There is a DemocratIC party and a ReNAMBLAcan party
The insurgency is in its last throes. Right?
That's good news!!!
To the extent they aren’t encouraged to hang by the political left of this country and their media supporters.
Oldie,
What does that mean?
Do you know what the poster was referring to. It was Dick Cheney's comments from 2004. I guess he was wrong! Just like you!