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On MSNBC, Zuckerman claimed that "the consensus is that the surge is working"

August 23, 2007 2:03 pm ET

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SUMMARY: On Tucker, U.S. News & World Report Editor-in-Chief Mortimer B. Zuckerman asserted: "[T]he fact is that, by far, the consensus is that the surge [in Iraq] is working." Zuckerman did not offer any evidence to support this claim. In fact, members of Congress, administration officials, and experts have all stated that political reconciliation, which the Bush administration identified as a key to the success of its escalation strategy, has not occurred.

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On the August 21 edition of MSNBC's Tucker, U.S. News & World Report Editor-in-Chief Mortimer B. Zuckerman, asserted: "[T]he fact is that, by far, the consensus is that the surge is working. So, I don't think she [Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-NY)] can just deny that." Zuckerman was responding to host Tucker Carlson's question, "Why would [Clinton] announce ... that the surge is working?" -- a mischaracterization of Clinton's August 20 speech to the Veterans of Foreign Wars, during which she said, "We've begun to change tactics in Iraq, and in some areas, particularly in Al Anbar Province, it's working. We're just years too late changing our tactics. We can't ever let that happen again." But Zuckerman did not offer any evidence to support his claim that "the consensus is that the surge is working." In fact, members of Congress, administration officials, and experts have all stated that political reconciliation, which the Bush administration identified as a key to the success of its escalation strategy, has not occurred. Seven servicemen deployed in Iraq wrote an August 19 op-ed in The New York Times challenging even reports of military progress. Additionally, a study released by the Center for American Progress and Foreign Policy magazine found that only 17 percent of conservative, moderate, and liberal foreign policy experts surveyed between May 23 and July 4 believed the troop increase has had a positive impact on "protecting the American people from global terrorist networks and in advancing U.S. national security goals." Moreover, 64 percent of conservative experts said "the surge is having either a negative impact or no impact at all."

As Media Matters for America noted, in their August 19 Times op-ed, seven U.S. Army infantrymen and noncommissioned officers currently serving in Iraq wrote that "[t]he claim that we are increasingly in control of the battlefields in Iraq is an assessment arrived at through a flawed, American-centered framework. Yes, we are militarily superior, but our successes are offset by failures elsewhere." Later, they wrote: "Given the situation, it is important not to assess security from an American-centered perspective. The ability of, say, American observers to safely walk down the streets of formerly violent towns is not a resounding indicator of security. What matters is the experience of the local citizenry and the future of our counterinsurgency. When we take this view, we see that a vast majority of Iraqis feel increasingly insecure and view us as an occupation force that has failed to produce normalcy after four years and is increasingly unlikely to do so as we continue to arm each warring side."

CAP and Foreign Policy, which is published by the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, found in their third "Terrorism Index" survey that more than 80 percent of the experts surveyed -- including 64 percent of self-identified conservatives -- believed that the U.S. troop increase in Iraq has had a negative impact or no impact on national security. Participants in the survey were asked what impact, if any, "[a]dding more troops to Iraq in President Bush's recent 'surge' " has had on "protecting the American people from global terrorist networks and in advancing U.S. national security goals." Fifty-three percent of the experts surveyed said the troop increase has had a somewhat or very negative impact and 30 percent said it has had no impact at all, while 17 percent said it has had a somewhat or very positive impact. According to the survey's methodology, the survey was "designed by the Center for American Progress and Foreign Policy" and "[p]articipants in the survey were selected by Foreign Policy and the Center for American Progress for their expertise in terrorism and U.S. national security."

Additionally, in an August 6 report, national security expert Anthony H. Cordesman of the Center for Strategic and International Studies, asserted that many of the successes in Iraq "ha[ve] not" been a result of Bush's strategy and that it "has failed in many aspects of its original plan."

Further, several experts have offered negative assessments of political progress in Iraq, and therefore of the success of the troop escalation by the Bush administration's own terms. As Media Matters has noted, when announcing his Iraq escalation strategy in January, Bush specifically stated that "[a] successful strategy for Iraq goes beyond military operations" and will include a political component: "hold[ing] the Iraqi government to the benchmarks [America] has announced." And in an appearance on the August 5 broadcast of NBC's Meet the Press, Defense Secretary Robert Gates stated that a "successful outcome in Iraq requires political reconciliation" distinct from military success:

RUSSERT: In March, you said we would know by the summer whether or not the surge was successful. Do you -- have you reached a conclusion?

GATES: I think that the military side of the surge -- we've still got a little ways to go -- but I think that the military side of the surge has been successful. I think that the ability to go in -- the problem when we would go after Al Qaeda and insurgents before is that when we would hit them in one place, they'd squirt to another place.

For the first time, the commander has enough forces that he can attack all of their basic locations at the same time. So it's much more difficult for them to squirt out and escape. And we're capturing and killing quite a lot of these people and beginning to re-establish order in neighborhoods. There's one major town -- I'm not going to name it, because I don't want it to be a target -- but there's one major town in Anbar that has not had an IED explosion since February. So, there has been progress, I think, on the military side of the surge.

RUSSERT: But they're -- a victory in Iraq is not a military solution.

GATES: No, all the commanders and I think everyone agrees that a successful outcome in Iraq requires political reconciliation, there's no question about that.

Examples of experts stating that there has not been political reconciliation in Iraq include:

  • Introducing their Iraq policy paper "Strategic Reset," CAP national security experts Brian Katulis and Lawrence J. Korb argued that "[t]he fundamental premise of Bush's surge strategy -- that Iraq's leaders will make key decisions to advance their country's political transition and national reconciliation -- is at best misguided and clearly unworkable."
  • In a May 17 interview with Harper's magazine, Marc Lynch, associate professor in the Department of Political Science at George Washington University, said the "surge" is "changing the distribution of violence a bit but not making much difference in the core strategic issues." He added that the Bush administration's "argument was that the surge would create a secure political space that would allow for political reconciliation. So far, the opposite has happened; there's been little progress towards reaching a new political compromise and if anything the distance between the sides seems to be growing. On the military side, there have been some interesting developments in Anbar province, like you've been reading about in the press lately, but that has little to do with the 'surge.' "
  • In a July 8 Boston Globe op-ed, Robert Malley, Middle East program director for the International Crisis Group, and Peter Harling, a Damascus-based senior analyst for the organization, wrote that "the answer to Iraq's horrific violence cannot be an illusory military surge that aims to bolster the existing political structure and treats the dominant political parties as partners."
  • In July 17 testimony to the House Foreign Affairs Committee, Steven N. Simon, Hasib J. Sabbagh Senior Fellow for Middle Eastern Studies at the Council on Foreign Relations, asserted that "[t]he large presence of US ground forces has had little effect on Iraqi politics, or on the insurgency. The surge has redistributed insurgent activity but not suppressed it. Ironically, violence now touches more of the country than before, with a corresponding erosion of societal stability and government credibility."
  • In a feature in the August 16 edition of The New York Review of Books, Peter W. Galbraith, a former U.S. ambassador to Croatia and currently senior diplomatic fellow at the Center for Arms Control, argued:

Even if the surge has had some modest military success, it has failed to accomplish its political objectives. The idea behind Bush's new strategy was to increase temporarily the number of US troops in Baghdad and Anbar. The aim was to provide a breathing space so that Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki's government might enact a program of national reconciliation that would accommodate enough Sunnis to isolate the insurgents. Meanwhile, Iraqi forces, improved by their close relations with US troops and additional training, would take over security.

Furthermore, as Salon.com's Tim Grieve wrote on August 21, military success is, in fact, distinct from success for the overall "surge" strategy:

We'll admit it's a fine distinction, but it shouldn't be so hard to understand. Is the "surge" having some success, in some areas, in reducing the levels of violence in Iraq? Yes. Is the overall "strategy" working -- that is, is the Iraqi government using the "breathing space" it's getting to do the things it needs to do? No. While it's certainly in the Bush administration's interests to conflate the questions and confuse the answers, the White House has people on staff paid to do just that. Journalists aren't supposed to be doing it for them.

Members of Congress and the Bush administration have also pointed to a lack of political reconciliation. For example:

  • In an August 20 joint statement after their recent visit to Iraq, Sens. Carl Levin (D-MI) and John Warner (R-VA) said:

    While we believe that the "surge" is having measurable results, and has provided a degree of "breathing space" for Iraqi politicians to make the political compromises which are essential for a political solution in Iraq, we are not optimistic about the prospects for those compromises. We were in Iraq both during the recent initial meeting of the Iraq Presidency Council, the Prime Minister and the President of the Kurdish region and during the immediately following expanded meeting, which were intended to reach political compromises. We would like to be optimistic that those meetings will lead to substantive progress, however -- given the performance of the Iraqi political leadership to date -- we remain extremely cautious in our expectations, as does our distinguished U.S. Ambassador to Iraq, Ambassador Ryan Crocker.

    According to Grieve, during an August 20 follow-up conference call with reporters, Levin said, "The purpose of the surge, by its own terms, was to ... give the opportunity to the Iraqi leaders to reach some political settlements. They have failed to do that. They have totally and utterly failed."

  • On August 21, prior to Zuckerman's appearance on Tucker, U.S. Ambassador to Iraq Ryan Crocker said reconciliation is not occurring. As an August 21 McClatchy Newspapers article reported:

The top U.S. diplomat in Iraq on Tuesday called the country's political progress "extremely disappointing" and warned that support for the government of Prime Minister Nouri al Maliki is not unlimited.

Ambassador Ryan Crocker's remarks to reporters were the harshest criticism yet by a Bush administration official of Maliki's government and may be a prelude to what he'll tell Congress in a report that he and Army Gen. David Petraeus, the U.S. military commander in Iraq, will give next month.

"The progress on the national level issues has been extremely disappointing and frustrating to all concerned -- to us, to Iraqis, to the Iraqi leadership itself," Crocker said.

"We do expect results, as do the Iraqi people, and our support is not a blank check."

[...]

Crocker acknowledged Tuesday that the decision by some Sunni tribes in Anbar to align themselves with the United States against al Qaida in Iraq wasn't a sign of reconciliation between Iraq's Sunni minority and the Shiite-led government.

"It is probably an essential prerequisite for reconciliation," he said. "But it isn't reconciliation."

From the August 21 edition of MSNBC's Tucker:

CARLSON: Has Hillary Clinton taken yet another position on Iraq? Well, listen to what she told the Veterans of Foreign Wars yesterday about the troop surge.

CLINTON [video clip]: We've begun to change tactics in Iraq, and in some areas, particularly in Al Anbar Province, its working. We're just years too late changing our tactics. We can't ever let that happen again. We can't be fighting the last war. We have to be preparing to fight the new war.

CARLSON: Those comments come after the New York senator again refused to apologize for voting for the Iraq war in the first place, though she did concede that, quote, "I regret giving George Bush the authority that he misused and abused." What are voters to make of where she stands now?

Joining us: Mort Zuckerman, editor-in-chief of U.S. News & World Report and chairman and publisher of the New York Daily News, and Rosa Brooks, columnist for the Los Angeles Times. Welcome to you both.

Rosa, how can you believe, how can you -- it's almost a Zen question. How can you fit into your head these two propositions: "The surge is working"; "We ought to leave immediately"? How does that work?

[...]

CARLSON: Well, I wonder, Mort, what you think the political calculation behind admitting it in the first place is. I mean, Hillary Clinton -- you know, anybody running for president doesn't make a statement like that without a reason for making it, a political reason for making it.

Why would she announce to the Veterans of Foreign Wars yesterday that the surge is working?

ZUCKERMAN: Well, I think the fact is that, by far, the consensus is that the surge is working. So, I don't think she can just deny that.

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    • Author by JLyons (August 23, 2007 2:05 pm ET)
         

      There is so much hate right now toward the idea that the surge may be working. Why?

      Report Abuse
      • Author by bruce1ace (August 23, 2007 2:10 pm ET)
           

        If you listened to Hannity et al, you would know the answer to that question.

        Report Abuse
      • Author by lostlogic (August 23, 2007 2:14 pm ET)
           

        I don't think it is hate.  I think people are justifiably concerned with what is being accomplished in the end.  If we accept the premise "The surge is working"--we have to ask ourselves working to do what?  I think the concern is the discussion stops at "The surge is working" and goes no further. 

        Report Abuse
        • Author by JLyons (August 23, 2007 2:24 pm ET)
             

          Thank you, nice response I see your point.

          Report Abuse
        • Author by Lynn (August 23, 2007 2:34 pm ET)
             

          Lost

           

           

           

          It seems to me that they are amending the goal again. The surge was to be conducted in concert with the moving the political processes forward because it was said that with just with just one. So I fail to see how this quell in violence in certain areas is now the measure used to say that progress for a permanent self sufficient and government has been made. I wish that were so but then again maybe they are indeed going to simply declare this as a success and leave, maybe this is what surge bragging is all about.

          Report Abuse
          • Author by lostlogic (August 23, 2007 2:45 pm ET)
               

            Lynn, I think they are using the "surge is working" to obscure the real issue--is the strategy working to achieve politcal resolution.  It is obviously not a success as to that purpose.  There is a report coming out that is apparently going to say the government in Iraq is weakening.  So to say the surge is working is a pretty hollow victory in this war.  It may be working as a tactic but it is not working as a strategy to achieve political resolution.  I think the administration is going to drag this war out and leave it for someone else to resolve.  I would like to hear someone ask just once if the surge is working what is the surge working to do.

            Report Abuse
      • Author by pete592 (August 23, 2007 2:17 pm ET)
           

        Why?

        Because in your seemingly twisted world, accepting a harsh, unfortunate reality is akin to hate.

        The "idea" that the surge may be working is simply and currently just that, an idea. 

        Report Abuse
        • Author by JLyons (August 23, 2007 2:23 pm ET)
             

          Because in your seemingly twisted world, accepting a harsh, unfortunate reality is akin to hate

          I asked a simple question because I do not know what to believe I hear it is working and is not working, why you have attacked me by saying I am in a "twisted world" is uncalled for. If you do not want to have a respecfful discussion please do not stoop to this level and do not respond to simple non partisan questions

           

           The "idea" that the surge may be working is simply and currently just that, an idea

          Thank you, that would have been a better answer.

          Report Abuse
          • Author by pete592 (August 23, 2007 2:28 pm ET)
               

            Non-paritsan question?  Yes, but it was also a non-partisan answer. 

            Stoop to this level???  You're the one who trotted out "hate".  I called BS, albeit personally, by asserting that hate has nothing to do with it.

            Report Abuse
            • Author by RoberttheP (August 23, 2007 2:30 pm ET)
                 

              Pete, I understood J's question and see nothing wrong with the qord "hate". I hate the surge and do not believe a word of it. Why is that wrong?

              Report Abuse
              • Author by pete592 (August 23, 2007 2:39 pm ET)
                   

                The accusation was not hate for the surge, but hate for the idea that it's working.  In either case, it is not an apt description for criticism of the strategy, its goals, the leadership from which it spawned, or the idea that it's working.

                Report Abuse
                • Author by portnoy64 (August 23, 2007 4:19 pm ET)
                     

                  I think there' s a chance it good work if it's given a bit more time.  The ability of the surge to lessen violence has given the political solution time and space to move ahead.  This has been especially true in Anbar province.  Why not give the military a chance to see if the surge will allow political tactics to prevail in other parts of Iraq too? 

                  Report Abuse
                  • Author by sundog (August 23, 2007 4:45 pm ET)
                       

                    Portnoy, you've adopted the righties' language of making it sound like continuing the war is doing the military a favor.  They equate 'support the troops' to 'let them succeed.'  But tricking the country into supporting a ridiculous, bound to fail, war of choice is hardly supporting the troops.  And yes, it's bound to fail.  There are simply some things you can't do with military force.  It's a misapplied use of force that just causes more violence for years to come.  Until we accept this, the situation will simply continue to erode and create more people who want to kill Americans.  The people who led us into Iraq have either lied or been wrong about EVERY major point they made.  What makes you so inclined to believe them now?  It's really bizarre. 

                    Report Abuse
                • Author by RoberttheP (August 23, 2007 11:06 pm ET)
                     

                  Pete , maybe I misunderstood, all I know is I do hate the surge, it has been a waste of time.

                  Report Abuse
              • Author by JLyons (August 23, 2007 2:50 pm ET)
                   

                Thanks Bushlies, I agree with you. 

                Report Abuse
      • Author by onionhead (August 23, 2007 4:22 pm ET)
           

        That is not what this article is about. It is about whether there is any proof to the claim that "the surge is working". 

        In fact, the article goes on to site sources that cast doubt on this claim. Remember, people thought that the Iraqi elections and the capture of Saddam would restore order. 

        I'm all for the surge working (just like I was rooting for the Iraq elections to bring stability). But asking a simple question like "where's the proof?" is not an act of hatred.

        Report Abuse
      • Author by clore3090 (August 23, 2007 9:38 pm ET)
           

        People generally don't like being lied to, and if you follow the news on Iraq, then the claim that the surge is working will strike you as a truly brazen lie.

        Follow the news:

        Antiwar.com

        INFORMATION CLEARING HOUSE. NEWS, COMMENTARY & INSIGHT

        Strike The Root - a journal of liberty

        Informed Comment

        IraqSlogger

         

        Report Abuse
      • Author by neilhaig2074 (August 24, 2007 4:13 am ET)
           

        so it looks like things are getting better over there, where's the problem?

        however wrote this article is delusional! how is a troop surge meant to fix political reconcilliation?

        We have eased the violance, which should allow more police and army to take over. it now looks like the 'coalition of the willing' can withdraw from areas now. this will dramatically expediate reconcilliation, but it is not going to happen overnight!

        i hear more conservatives are for pulling out in the senate than democrats...

        Report Abuse
    • Author by nomobush (August 23, 2007 2:18 pm ET)
         

      The surge is not simply the increase in troops. It's the increase in the number of troops that was to allow the government in Iraq to gain political control.

      That political control hasn't happened.

      The surge is not a success.

      Report Abuse
    • Author by pete592 (August 23, 2007 2:24 pm ET)
         

      Oh come one, let's cut Zuck a little slack.  He could be talking about the consensus amongst just the dead enders and the fortunate few who have been able to procure enough security to take advantage of the rug special.

      Report Abuse
    • Author by arebeeo (August 23, 2007 2:24 pm ET)
         

      It is not hate.  That seems to be an odd use of the term, in fact.  It is doubt that drives an opposing view that the so-called surge is working.  This bunch has lied so often about how things are going over there that the current PR that claims the surge is working is just the latest attempt to justify keeping this thing going.  I just do not believe it.  I will not believe any report from the current administration or an ass-kissing general.

      Report Abuse
      • Author by JLyons (August 23, 2007 2:27 pm ET)
           

        I will change the term from 'hate" to unacceptance?

        Report Abuse
        • Author by RoberttheP (August 23, 2007 2:31 pm ET)
             

          I hate the surge so you can keep it at that.

          Report Abuse
        • Author by Semiauto (August 23, 2007 2:34 pm ET)
             

          The last set of benchmarks, none of the goals were met and only 8 of therm showed any progress. Bush sent Patreous to Iraq to do a job, to which he will report back to Bush and then Bush will report to us on how his plan went and what the guy he sent to do it found. I have little faith that they will report progess. Real number show things are still very very bad in Iraq, and my fear, and maybe the fear of many here, is that Bush will say there is progress and use that as justification to continue mismanaging Iraq to the cost of more American lives.

          Report Abuse
          • Author by bittermarv (August 23, 2007 3:49 pm ET)
               

            I have little faith that they will report progess.

            I'll bet you folding money that Bush will report on significant progress.  Enough to continue Bush's failed policies through the end of his administration, at least.

            Now, whether this report will have anything to do with the reality that most of us are familiar with...

            Report Abuse
            • Author by Icedog (August 24, 2007 11:11 am ET)
                 

              Just curious.....can anyone explain why Democrat House Majority Whip James Clyburn stated that American success in Iraq would be bad news for the Democrats? 

              Report Abuse
              • Author by solon (August 25, 2007 5:04 am ET)
                   

                There is no such thing as a Democrat Majority Whip there is a DemocratIC Majority Whip and a ReNAMBLAcan Majority Whip.

                Report Abuse
          • Author by ajwan (August 23, 2007 4:47 pm ET)
               

            I think the issue is that it is easy to report progress, because in many cases no matter how badly something is going overall, you can point out at least one thing that showed "progress".

            For example consider hiring a contractor to build you a 2 car garage and everyday he comes and stays the whole day and manages to hammer one nail or make one cut to a board. You complain and he says, "What's the problem, it's clear I am making progress. So you say ok keep going, but then after a few weeks you notice he is taking out nails. You complain and he says, "Whats the problem, I've had to make some adjustments but with these adjustments I'll be making even more progress. So four years laters he still is working on the garage and since you are paying hourly the price of the garage currently stands at about $400,000 and it's still not complete. Meanwhile since the wood has been out in the elements so long unprotected, much of the wood has become rotten and needs to be replaced. You complain about this and he says, but look I bought a surge power hammer. I will be able to nail at least two nails a day. And sure enough he is nailing two nails a day and he proudly reports to you. "The surge is working".

            Report Abuse
        • Author by solon (August 25, 2007 12:17 pm ET)
             

          It doesnt address the main point he made. This administration has lied so much about Iraq from day one, its only prudent not to take them at their word here.

          Report Abuse
      • Author by MiddleLeft (August 23, 2007 4:42 pm ET)
           

        I will not believe any report from the current administration or an ass-kissing general.

        And not just any ass-kissing general.  But the one that got his job by claiming a surge might work when the generals actually in the battle zone were saying it could not.

        --ML 

        Report Abuse
    • Author by Dem02020 (August 23, 2007 2:43 pm ET)
         

      "Consensus" is a difficult thing to assert, in this kind of matter.

      In order to be sure, you'd usually have to at least have a 'show of hands', or a voice vote, or at best, a recorded vote by ballot.

      That's a good idea! Let's have a recorded vote by ballot, to be absolutely certain as to whether or not there is a "consensus that the surge is working"!

       

      If we took such a vote among the American People, I'd bet my wallet that there'd be no "consensus that the surge is working"...

      ...and if the vote were among the Iraqi people, I'd bet the house.

       

       

      Report Abuse
    • Author by nerzog (August 23, 2007 3:07 pm ET)
         

      The Bush apologists are playing a shell game here. Apparently the concentration of troops in Anbar has reduced the violence there. Good. Now, how are you going to keep the violence down in Anbar while you go and take care of those places where the violence continues? You see, it's not rocket science that the bad guys are going to lay low while the streets are being patrolled by heavily armed Marines. Hell, if you put twenty cops on every block in Washington D.C., you'd probably cut the crime rate to almost zero.

      The Bushies will focus on the one or two areas where the surge is "working", and ignore the big picture. Count on it.

      JLyons, you can put me down as a skeptic. It's not that I don't want the surge to work, it's just that I don't believe a word this President tells us. I always assume he's lying until proven otherwise.

      Report Abuse
      • Author by JLyons (August 23, 2007 3:13 pm ET)
           

        JLyons, you can put me down as a skeptic. It's not that I don't want the surge to work, it's just that I don't believe a word this President tells us. I always assume he's lying until proven otherwise

        no, i do not disagree with you, i was just asking what others thought.

        Report Abuse
      • Author by magnolialover (August 23, 2007 3:25 pm ET)
           

        Yes, working in one spot, in a large country, but not in the other locations around said large country. Anbar, apparently, working. But what about the 400 some odd people blown up last week in mutiple bombings? What about the increase in loss of life and wounded from our side of things since the "surge" started?

        I think in order for the so called surge to work properly, you'd have to "surge" in every hot spot in the country, and stay there for awhile. Probably something on the order of 5x the number of troops we have on the ground right now. This would quell almost all the violence, and probably give the political process time to actually work in Iraq, and get things on a good footing, but this probably won't happen. Too many people required, and too few available. Also, too much money, and not enough to go around, unless we raise taxes, institute a draft, and get the money and troops that we need in order to actually "surge" properly.

        None of which I want to see at all, but situations and tactics that I think might work.

        Report Abuse
        • Author by darkmass (August 23, 2007 3:40 pm ET)
             

          Magnolialover,

          I wrote some truth yesterday in a response to one of your last posts under the "soft bigotry of low expectations" thread concerning something I've understood for some time now.  You were the first I've seen here to provide the proper context for my response.  Sadly, my response seems to have not been noticed by anyone, or maybe it just wasn't understood.  But I think you will get it.

          *Anyone* is welcome to look in on it of course.  Jeter once said he wished I'd post more often...I suspect he too will understand.

          Cheers.

          Report Abuse
        • Author by nerzog (August 23, 2007 3:42 pm ET)
             

          Bingo. At some point, Rumsfeld and Cheney apparently decided that this war could be fought "on the cheap"...after all, we were going to be greeted as liberators, right? I'm sure it wasn't hard to convince President Numbnuts to stand on the X and say the appropriate words.

          This calls into question the claim that Cheney changed his mind about invading Iraq because of 9/11. Even if 9/11 had convinced him that invading was worth the risk, what made him disregard his own conclusions that it would be a quagmire? What made him think that they could take and hold Iraq with less than half the troops they used to push Saddam out of Kuwait?

          Report Abuse
    • Author by eweston8542983 (August 23, 2007 3:37 pm ET)
         

      The classic counter insurgency ratio is one solder for every 40 civilians. Even if that were done it would not create a sustainable Iraqi government.

       The U.N. has made some recent noises about becoming involved. As they do have some experience and some sucess creating and encouraging democracys, this is as good a piece of news on Iraq as I've heard in four plus years.

      Report Abuse
    • Author by DorisRussell (August 23, 2007 3:47 pm ET)
         

      The surge is working?Yeah right and Bush is the best President ever.

       

      Report Abuse
    • Author by laissezfairesucks (August 23, 2007 4:00 pm ET)
         

      Another Jewish Zionist porpagandist has said something untrue? What a surprise.

      Report Abuse
      • Author by johnrtorres638 (August 23, 2007 5:21 pm ET)
           

        Another Jewish Zionist porpagandist has said something untrue?

        So we just can't trust them Jews? .... um

        Report Abuse
    • Author by CaseySpring (August 23, 2007 4:08 pm ET)
         

      Zuckerman tends to make these outrageous statements. The fact is the surge is not a success and the reason is the Iraqi Government is a joke. As long as they do not make political benchmarks in Iraq they are doomed. People can say all they want about the "surge" but that has not worked .

      Report Abuse
    • Author by scooter (August 23, 2007 4:11 pm ET)
         

      The surge may have made one small piece of dung smell better, but certainly left many piles elsewhere. BushCo can define "better" all they want, but to the thinking man (and woman) there is very little going well in Iraq.

      Face it. Bush is still poking the hornets' nest and we are all paying for it. He is already a failed president, but wants so desperately to be able to make the statement "I did something right" before he leaves.

      The world is much worse off, and will continue to be for years after this disaster leaves.

      I cannot find one friend or acquaintance who thinks that the surge is working. By what definition is this additional stick-poking making things better? For whom? By what standards... and I'd accept almost any standard at this time to feel better about my idiot preznit

      Report Abuse
    • Author by Bootsy (August 23, 2007 4:25 pm ET)
         

      It seems to me that they're using this term "the surge is working" to buy Bush more time.  This is repeated to those who still believe in Bush, so that instead of bringing the troops home, he can keep them over there till next year.  Who knows what they'll come up with by then?

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    • Author by Limit Corp. Ownership (August 23, 2007 4:33 pm ET)
         

      You are correct...

      It's going to take years to recover from president chicken-hawk's eight years:

      Debt through the ceiling; the greatest concentration of wealth between rich and poor than at any time since the Great Depression; the economy in shambles; our infrastructure collapsing; disastrous wars fought for no discernable reason other than to try to gain political advantage.

      Welcome to right-wing America.

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      • Author by sundog (August 23, 2007 6:00 pm ET)
           

        Of course that's what they're doing.  Getting into Iraq and now staying in Iraq.  We've seen that they will do and say anything to accomplish this.  It's depressing the way we now debate their BS as though they have ANY credibility.  It's all a smokescreen to get the country to support the next year of war.  Check out the current ad campaign Freedoms Watch in which they tell you to call congress to support the war.  I've found they'll actually connect you to your rep. if you tell them you agree with all of the nutso stuff they say.  I find it's fun to call them over and over and act like I don't understand what they're doing.  Weird people those republicans.  For a good time call 1-877-222-8001.  Call early, call often.  They pay for the call. 

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    • Author by Bootsy (August 23, 2007 4:58 pm ET)
         

      The sad part about it is that around a third of the country actually thinks we're safe because of this illegal war.  How, I don't know.  Especially since the actual people who were resposible for 9/11 are in Afghanistan and not Iraq.  The really sad part about this whole thing is that congress can stop the war by cutting off funding, but seems to be they're too afraid of being called names by Republicans than actually doing what they were voted in to do, which is what a majority of American's want...stopping the war.

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    • Author by nerzog (August 23, 2007 6:21 pm ET)
         

      [link to www.comcast.net]

      Yep, that surge is workin' ...yessireeeeee......

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    • Author by redking75687 (August 23, 2007 6:24 pm ET)
         

      That ain't the consensus from Iraq. Place is even more violent than it was before. Also the population are facing extreme hardships in this 5th year of occupation and the US is NOT providing any humanitarian relief. 5 years into a war with no purpose other than to steal oil fields. 5 years with no end in sight, with no point to it other than corporo-fascist piracy. The surge (escalation) is not working, the cause was lost long ago. All that remains is for more to die and more to pontificate about how necessary those deaths were. The psychopath may often justify his crime for the common good.

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    • Author by roguecowboy6511 (August 24, 2007 7:34 pm ET)
         

      Next time a Pro-War Hack is interviewed someone needs to ask what the IMPACT is if we stay for another decade. Our top GENERAL ON THE GROUND has stated that it will take AT LEAST a decade to "WIN".   How many more US Troops killed? 10,000?How many more US Troops wounded? 50,000?How many more ISF  killed?  30,0000?How any more ISF Wounded? 150,000?How many more Iraqi Civilians killed?  250,000?How many more Iraqi Civilians wounded? 1.5 Million?How many more Iraqi's will be displayed from their homes? 50,000/month? 6 Million?Will there be any Iraqi's left to GOVERN or be GOVERNED when we "WIN" and establish a DEMOCRATIC IRAQ?   Oh ya, then ask what the impact will be if we withdraw 100,000 troops by the end of 2008?<!-- SPAMfighter Signature -->

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