Limbaugh on wounded Iraq vet: "I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber"
SUMMARY: On October 4, Rush Limbaugh
asserted that he "didn't call" wounded Iraq veteran Brian McGough "a
suicide bomber" on his October 2 show and said he was
"grateful" for McGough's service. Limbaugh said on October 2:
"[T]his is such a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran, lying to him
about what I said, then strapping those lies to his belt, sending him out via
the media in a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into."
On the October 4 broadcast of his nationally syndicated radio show, Rush Limbaugh asserted that he "didn't call" wounded Iraq veteran Brian McGough "a suicide bomber" on his October 2 show and said he was "grateful" for McGough's service. McGough appeared in an ad released by VoteVets denouncing Limbaugh's September 26 characterization of service members who support troop withdrawal from Iraq as "phony soldiers." In the ad, McGough says to Limbaugh, "Until you have the guts to call me a 'phony soldier' to my face, stop telling lies about my service." As Media Matters for America documented, Limbaugh said on October 2: "[T]his is such a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran, lying to him about what I said, then strapping those lies to his belt, sending him out via the media in a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into."
From Limbaugh's October 2 radio show:
LIMBAUGH: VoteVets.org has -- they describe themselves as an organization comprised of veterans of the Iraq and Afghanistan campaigns who oppose current policy in Iraq. They've put together a TV ad that takes aim at me. This ad's going to run on Fox News, on CNN, it's going to run on WMAL radio in Washington, $60,000 ad buy that's going to run, I think, on our local West Palm Beach station down here. And there's a man identified as Brian McCoff -- McGough -- it's M-C-G-O-U-G-H, I'm not sure how he pronounces it, McGo, McGuff -- I haven't watched the ad.
He discusses his service in Iraq, the wounds he suffered there, and he says to me in this ad, "Until you have the guts to call me a 'phony soldier' to my face, stop telling lies about my service." You know, this is such a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran, lying to him about what I said, then strapping those lies to his belt, sending him out via the media in a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into.
This man will always be a hero to this country with everyone. Whoever pumped him full of these lies about what I said and embarrassed him with this ad has betrayed him. They're not hurting me, they're betraying this soldier. Now, unless he actually believes what he's saying, in which case it's just so unfortunate and sad when the truth of what I said is right out there to be learned.
After several media outlets noted his comments about McGough, writing that Limbaugh compared McGough to a suicide bomber, Limbaugh revisited those remarks on his October 4 show. After replaying his October 2 comments he said: "I called him a hero. The other reference is to where the drive-by media runs in, blows things up, creates all these messes, and then heads on down the road to create another one. I called him a suicide bomber -- you see how this works. I didn't call anybody who legitimately serves a 'phony soldier.' I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber."
The Los Angeles Times reported on October 4:
Limbaugh responded on air Tuesday, comparing McGough metaphorically to a suicide bomber. He said the ad was "a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran, lying to him about what I said, then strapping those lies to his belt, sending him out via the media in a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into."
Similarly, The New York Times reported October 3:
The advertisement, to be pushed with a modest $60,000 buy, is scheduled to be broadcast Wednesday on national cable news channels, with a radio version in certain markets during Mr. Limbaugh's show. In it, a wounded veteran chastises Mr. Limbaugh. On Tuesday, Mr. Limbaugh compared the veteran to a suicide bomber, saying the advocacy group had strapped "lies to his belt, sending him out via the media in a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into," according to a transcript distributed by Media Matters.
ABCNews.com reported October 3:
Limbaugh publicly denounced the VoteVets.org ad, likening the Iraq War veteran featured in the ad to a suicide bomber.
"This is such a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran, lying to him about what I said, then strapping those lies to his belt, sending him out via the media in a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into," Limbaugh said Tuesday on his radio program.
Limbaugh has said that his "phony soldier" comments were referring only to one soldier recently convicted of lying about his service. The radio talk show host has also attacked Rep. Jack Murtha, D-Pa., a retired Marine colonel and opponent of the Iraq War.
"I was not talking about anti-war, active duty troops," Limbaugh insisted. However the liberal media watchdog organization Media Matters disputed Limbaugh's claim that his "phony soldiers" comment was taken out of context, pointing to the transcript as proof that the reference came two minutes before discussion of the discredited man.
"After referring to troops who disagree with him about Iraq as phony soldiers, he's gone on to compare one of our Purple Heart veterans from the war in Iraq to a suicide bomber," said Karl Frisch, spokesperson for Media Matters. "It's time for him to stop digging the hole and start being accountable."
In an October 3 article, FoxNews.com said:
Limbaugh decried the ad by the group that he linked to MoveOn.org, figuratively saying VoteVets is treating McGough like a suicide bomber.
"This is such a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran, lying to him about what I said and then strapping those lies to his belt, sending him out via the media and a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into. This man will always be a hero to this country with everyone. Whoever pumped him full of these lies about what I said and embarrassed him with this ad has betrayed him, they aren't hurting me they are betraying this soldier," Limbaugh said.
From the October 4 broadcast of The Rush Limbaugh Show:
LIMBAUGH: Let's go to the audio sound bites, shall we? Let's -- we have a montage of this morning and last night. We have Joe Scarbourough of MSNBC, John Roberts of CNN, Willie Geist, MSNBC, somebody else on MSNBC, and Norah O'Donnell all talking -- you know, this poor guy Brian McGough of VoteVets.org, he's running around saying that I called him a suicide bomber yesterday on this program. And of course, he says it, there's no questioning it, and here's the montage of the drive-bys reacting to it.
Sit tight, Dawn -- Dawn's about to explode in there. She came in today, walked in -- "I am never going to watch or listen to Geraldo again after last night, and I am never" -- Alan Colmes -- just, you know, chill, chill. Everything's under control here. It's going our way. Here's the montage:
[begin audio clip]
JOE SCARBOROUGH, MSNBC: We're going to hear for the next five days how Rush Limbaugh called this guy a suicide bomber.
JOHN ROBERTS, CNN: Limbaugh called this guy a suicide bomber.
WILLIE GEIST, MSNBC: Metaphor to say he was like a suicide bomber.
KEITH OLBERMANN, MSNBC: Comparing that soldier to a suicide bomber.
NORAH O'DONNELL, MSNBC: Essentially comparing him to a suicide bomber.
[end audio clip]
LIMBAUGH: All right, anybody care what I actually said about this? Would you like to hear what I actually said? This was Tuesday on the program, and I was talking about the ad that they are running.
[begin audio clip]
LIMBAUGH: You know, this is such a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran, lying to him about what I said, then strapping those lies to his belt, sending him out via the media in a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into. This man will always be a hero to this country with everyone. Whoever pumped him full of these lies about what I said and embarrassed him with this ad has betrayed him. They're not hurting me, they're betraying this soldier. Now, unless he actually believes what he's saying, in which case it's just so unfortunate and sad when the truth of what I said is right out there to be learned.
[end audio clip]
LIMBAUGH: I called him a hero. I called him a hero. The other reference is to where the drive-by media runs in, blows things up, creates all these messes, and then heads on down the road to create another one. I called him a suicide bomber -- you see how this works. I didn't call anybody who legitimately serves a "phony soldier." I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber. That's out there -- I called him a suicide bomber. [laughter] Here's McGough. He was on MSNBC last night talking about the fact that I called him a suicide bomber.
McGOUGH [audio clip]: My reaction is disgust, how someone can sit in that chair and say that I am a car bomber, or excuse me, a suicide bomber, is disgusting. I've seen the aftereffects of a suicide bomb. I've had friends that were hurt in suicide bombs. It makes me mad down to a place where I can't even think to describe. It's just repugnant.
LIMBAUGH: And -- it's not just repugnant. It's very sad. Brian, let me -- let me try this again. Mr. McGough, I admire you for your service. I admire anyone and everyone who volunteers to serve in the United States military in this country, always have. I'm grateful to you for your service, and that, Brian, is an unqualified thank you, whether or not you support the war, or the surge, President Bush, or not.
Yes, Rush, it was a descriptive comparison to a suicide bomber you made. Repeat after me, Rush: I was wrong. I'm sorry.
He just can't help himself. Even when he's as horrified as he is right now. He simply can't help himself.
Indeed. Rush's fear factor has again reached the level of pilonidil cyst. It’s 1970 all over again.
He DIDN'T call him a SUICIDE bomber. he called him a HOMICIDE bomber, you dumb librulz.
This is another example of why conservatives are wrong when they say that liberals want to silence right wing talk radio hosts. I want Limbaugh to keep talking about how he compared McGough to a suicide bomber without calling him a suicide bomber. Please, Mr. Limbaugh, by all means, keep talking.
This is almost better than when he explained that he never said Michael J. Fox was faking his symptoms, but merely acting and exaggerating.
The vet was used like a suicide bomber.
Exactly. Except for the part about being used, committing suicide, or bombing. But otherwise it was a perfect comparison.
Which makes him a suicide bomber.
And I didn't call you a crackhead, just an addle-brained Oxycontin addict.
Rush now says; "I admire anyone and everyone who volunteers to serve in the United States military in this country, always have. I'm grateful to you for your service, and that, Brian, is an unqualified thank you, whether or not you support the war, or the surge, President Bush, or not."
So now it's unqualified, when we all know as of last week his qualification was that soldiers must agree with Rush and Bush, otherwise--THEY'RE PHONY. I wonder, is there a form to fill out, an oath to swear, when enlisting that explains to which political beliefs soldiers must conform?
It's hopeless.
The phony soldiers knew when they signed up that they'd be going to Afghanistan or Iraq. But no one warned them that upon their return, they were to be confronted by the eeville VoteVets, who turn them into mindless walking zombie suicide bombers in limpaugh transcript belts, destined to wander the earth in eternal agony, popping up in the media right out of the blue, running into as many people as possible. No form could EVER resist the awesome power that commands them to do such wicked deeds.
Give me my gun. I'll only need one bullet...
May I please pull the trigger?
No, I'd prefer to do it myself.
I may be too cowardly to be left behind to suffer the torture of a scorched earth with nothing but mindless phony soldier zombie bombers. But I have enough honor to initiate the ultimate escape myself...
But feel free to pry my gun from my cold dead fingers after I'm gone and use it as you deem necessary.
"...after I'm gone..."
Neon, I was just wondering if you had, like, some good CDs or some othe stuff that, like, you wouldn't be using after, you know, you were gone and everything...
Well, I promised LeatherHelmet he could have the BeeGees, Culture Club and KC, and Barney wanted my Helen Reddy, Andy Gibb, and Bobby Sherman albums. But I'll let you have the pick of what's left of my vinyl: Abba, Osmonds, K-Tel Disco Daze, and Carpenters.
How are you set for 8-tracks?
Got any Allman Brothers?
I wanted to pull the trigger because I thought you were aiming at PussPocket, not you--sorry...
Oh, no. I would never do that.
I think Rush deserves to be left behind on a planet with nothing but phony soldier zombie bombers.
...and Ann Coulter, so that the species won't proliferate.
Okay, I concur. [whew]
"I didn't call anybody who legitimately serves a 'phony soldier.'"
You questioned the military legitimacy of anyone who professed to be a soldier and who disagrred with your positions on the Iraq war. When Mike form Chicago said he was ex-military, you said sarcastically that you used to walk on the moon. Remember, Rush? ...think hard. That fuzziness from all the drugs will go away some day...once you stop using.
"I admire anyone and everyone who volunteers to serve in the United States military in this country, always have."
John Kerry? Murtha? Al Gore? Max Cleland? For the sake of fairness would MMFA please cite all the great things Rush has said about these volunteers.
And let's not forget the Navy veterans who actually served in Kerry's Swift Boat. Every one of them were slimed by suggesting that they were all lying about Kerry's actions, too. After all, since they supported Kerry, and we actually THERE, then they had to be participants in Kerry's lies. The fact is military personnel are like anyone else to the right-wing pundits--if they do not toe the line they are worthy of no respect whatsoever. The only difference now is that Rush went too far, and is now having to backtrack so he can try to maintain the myth that he cares one whit about the soldiers.
Was there ever any public point made that the guy who came out most vocally about how Kerry "lied" to get his medals also got his medals from the very same incident?
Go ahead Rush. Keep talking. Keep practicing you're first amendment rights. And I'll keep waiting for the day when your hypocracy bites you in your a-- like a big cyst. What a pig!
I'm sure that it will turn out that all this fuss about "suicide bombers" is the result of a transcript editing job funded by George Soros for MM under the direction of Hillary Clinton and Fidel Castro. I say the butler did it with the wrench in the Conservatory.
Limbaugh's sinking faster than the Phillies.
I'm watching that game, and that is fast
9-3 Rockies
10-4 Rockies!!!! GO ROX!
I'm withya--GO ROX !
I'll say this though- before TBS's run with the playoffs are over, I'm going to be so sick of Frank Caliendo, a guy I used to think was funny but am now finding more annoying every time he shows up during commercial breaks. That is, during EVERY commercial break.
I know. Little things like that make the playoffs seem sooooo long.
He does a horrible Jack Nicholson. It reminds me of the high schooler who is brave enough to try impressions -- both in the actual impression and the material.
I can't stand the TBS coverage, especially the Rockies v Padres single playoff game. I felt like it should have ended up on MMFA the way they called that game. They laughed it off when the Rockies blatantly had a home run taken away from them and then spent an hour on Holliday's play at the plate. It was like watching election returns on Foxnews. I followed that team for years in Colorado, watched all of those kids come up out of the minors. I was there Helton's rookie season and all year when he hit nearly 400. I love Coors Field and one of the only things that has made me miss leaving Colorado a year ago was not being able to be there for the Rocks great run. So when they finally get to dance on home plate? I'm wathcing freaking TBS create a 'controversy' to make sure that Rockies fans don't feel too good about it and Padres fans feel like they got absolutely robbed and not just beaten. I swear that Foxnews type of coverage is even ruining the way they cover baseball. Dammit. Thank you and good night.
AMEN SUNDOG!!! If you ever come back and want to grab a game, hit me up! GO ROX
"I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber."
Instead, Rush failed to do his homework and familiarize himself with McGough's story, just like any radio talking head should before he chooses to smear someone. If he had bothered, then perhaps Rush would have thought twice before he used a disgusting and tasteless metaphor to describe a solider who has a brain injury resulting from a suicide bomb.
Rush is dishonest, incompetent, selfish, and refuses to take responsibility for what he says. He has no business being on the radio, especially radio that broadcasts to our armed forces.
Pete: The fat gasbag did not only fail to familairize himself with McGough's story--he did not even bother to learn his name or see the ad. The reason for that is simple--Rush could care less about any of these soldiers; to him they are nobodies who are so stupid that they can be easily manipulated by "liberals." He has to pay lip service to acting like he cares because many of his listeners care about the troops, but he has no regard for them as real human beings. And why is it that these right-wingers always use such hyperbole whenever they play martyr? Whenever someone disagrees with him, O'Reilly is the victim of "assassins" or the "biggest villians" in the country. Limbaugh is the victim of someone "strapping lies to his chest and going out into the public." Where do these clowns get off comparing their "persecution" as they sit in their air-conditioned studios to life and death scenarios? They are so pathetic it is unbelievable.
Good post, but I completely disagree; Rush very obviously did his homework. He knew just how to hurt this soldier. I believe he googled up this soldier's name and discovered that he was wounded by a bomb attack and wanted to cut him to the quick - to teach him a lesson. rush is a small, small, evil man.
Rush and his ilk always stick there chest out the farthest when it comes to the 'drumbeat to war'. When it comes to actually serving in combat themselves, they run away with their tails between their legs...Or, is that a cyst between their cheeks? What a Chicken Hawk and a coward!
Ol PussPocket is a flip-flopper. He was against troopis in oposition, now he's for them. FLIPFLOP FLIPFLOP.
Rush always slimes the military
The worst one I remember was Limbaugh's outrageous lie that troops in Iraq are safer than they would be here in America. Limbaugh had the nerved to fraudulently deny the great danger our troops bravely face. Limbaugh told the lie just to sell a fictionalized version of the situation in Iraq to make the war look better than it is. I shuddereed worrying that Limbaugh's terrible lie was broadcast on Armed Forces Radio.
Limbaugh often referred to US generals who opposed the war or called for Rumsfeld's resignation "Clintonistas." Limbaugh said the generals were taking part in plots devised by the Clintons.
Limbaugh recently called General Clark "the mad bomber of Bosnia." When Dick Durbin spoke against torture at Guantanomo, Limbaugh accused Durbin of calling our troops Nazis, under the theory that since US troops would have had to be the ones to carry out the torture Durbin must have been talking about the troops. By that standard, if Clark was the mad bomber of Bosnia, US troops must have gone on insane bombing runs in Bosnia. Limbaugh either owes an apology to Durbin or the troops.
I heard him call the Uk sailors who surrendered to a larger Iranian vessel months ago "cowards" for not going down in a hail of bullets. Very demeaning to our ally's sailors. I have asked in prior posts if the ditto heads agree with El Rushbo on that comment. No one ever responds. Do you agree? I would really like to hear the views of his supporters.
Where are his defenders today? It would do you all well to either explain this one or distance yourselves a bit....
Don't worry the defenders are here. Watching as you guys' grasp to anything you can. There is just nothing we can say that would make any difference. I mean really, we have been here giving all the factual information you guys need to make an intelligent decision but you still choose not to. That is all we can do.
We HAD the information, what you hiveminders gave us was the Limborg spin. Weak, transparent and without merit but hey The Oxymoron INSTRUCTED you what to think so its your JOB to spew it out as if it made sense. Good luck with that.
JMZ, the facts are available, as you said. I'm speechless as I sit here and read through everything that is spewed by these guys and notice that: A) no one is willing to completely read transcripts; and B) most can't even use their own names when giving their opinions. I guess factual information, ownership of opinions, and thinking are just missed by most of them.
JMZ,
Care to defend/explain the statement? I want to see if my straws have grips.
Here I am. I can't believe how few conservatives there are on this page. I guess it's the old "birds of a feather" thing. You all sound very young and very dumb. I've listened to Rush for years and no one supports our fighting men and women more than Rush. He was right to call all of these phoney soldiers, who were given a voice by liberal outlets such as this one in an attempt to undermine out military...phoney soldiers. Can you not see the damage these phoney soldiers have done to our military? Are you people really that blind? Many have been convicted of their crimes and sentenced to prison. The true traitors who give aid and comfort to our enemies are your elected officials in the democrat party who have been undermining our troops for years. They started this Rush issue, which is based on total lies, in an attempt to get their extremist left-wing butts out of the big hole they know they've dug for themselves by trying to please mindless little lefties like all of you on this page who want "peace" at any price. There was a caller who called in to Rush's show yesterday and said something I'd like to say to all you little twits. "Don't piss on my boots, then tell me it's raining."
MMFA is really grasping at straws. David Brock has no shame. Once again MMFA tries to find something where there is nothing.
Super post, DOD. I can't argue with any of your facts or well-reasoned positions.
Explain this one then. What did the metaphor seem like to you DOD?
strapnoun
1a. A narrow strip of leather or fabric which can be used for hanging something from, carrying or fastening something, etc;
Thesaurus: belt, leash, thong, strop, band.
Hillary's Media Matters are a bunch of buffoons. He said NOTHING about a suicide bomber and even if you thought so he would have continued the metaphor by saying the vet was going to walk out there and take out everyone he could. while dying. Just more lies as Hillary's Media Matters goes down the toilet.
It is a common phrase to strap something on a belt meaning to carry thoughts, ideas or objects. But Hillary's Media Matters just continues to be mocked because of its lies.
So Gough's not a suicide bomber, just an easily manipulated moron?
Well, I can understand your outrage. BAD MMfH! BAAAAaaad MMfH.
OK, I'll bite. Find me the quote where Rush says "McGough is a suicide bomber". Unless you guys are mind readers( I borrowed that that from those who post here) he did not say it.
Who is claiming that he said that? Show me where MMFA states that Limbaugh declared McGough to be a suicide bomber.
Show me the quote where Durbin said US troops were Nazis.
Let’s see, suicide bombers are used and lied to about what “Allah“ says“
Rush says about Brian, "a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran, lying to him about what I said.
Suicide bombers place explosives on a suicide belt or vest based on lies told about Allah.
Rush says about Brian, “then strapping those lies to his belt” .
Suicide bombers are sent out in public, with the lies told about Allah strapped with an explosive belt, the purpose, to kill as many people as possible.
Let’s see what Rush said about Brian, “sending him out via the media in a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into."
You gotta another version of what Rush meant, I'd sure love to read it.
Dave,
What do you think he was inferring?
And when I say, "Only a moron could ask such a stupid question!"...Tell me where I directly called anyone in particular a moron!
does every dittohead have selective hearing?
what did the metaphor el druggo used mean?
when he uses the term "drive by media" he always notes that he is comparing the msm and bloggers to drive by shooters.
so if his metaphor wasnt comparing the sgt to a disturbed, easily misled suicid bomber...why did he use it...and why did he totally ignore it when he replayed the clip.
but its obvious that the dittoheads so hate all that is good and right about our country that they will believe anything this idiot says, even when he doesnt say it
cognitive dissonance is a scary thing
Apparently, use of a brain is not required to be a dittohead ... since you are saying that Rush had to say exactly those words to call a guy a suicide bomber.
If I said that I used a conveyance which ran on gasoline, had four seats, a steering wheel, the word "Ford" on the trunk, four tires, an engine, windshield wipers, and drove on a highway, could you make the intellectual connection that I was referring to a car, without me actually saying that?
Rush has used that dodge plenty of times ...
Dave
You are on your knees servicing Rush. But I didn't call you a c@cksucker.
I totally agree with you. I was just trying to make that point in another post. You said it much more eloquently than I could, though. My problem in expressing that thought was that I couldn't find an example to cite in which an author used the image of strapping something to a person's belt and then sending that person out into as many people as possible to do damage in a non-suicide-bombing context.
For instance, I tried searching for "strapped" and "into a crowd" in the Google news archives, but imagine my disappointment when most of the stories that came up were about suicide bombers.
I'm sure you're right, though, about strapping things to one's belt and then running into as many people as possible being a common figure of speech for spreading ideas. Do you think you could help me find an example of this?
RUSH: "You know, this is such a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran, lying to him about what I said, then strapping those lies to his belt, sending him out via the media in a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into."
And the walk in to as many people as he can walk into part? What does he mean about walking into as many people as possible?
OH THAT IS RICH !!!
Once again, a loyal Limbot trying to explain (excuse) another vile comment made by his hero Limbaugh. This time against, yet another wounded war veteran who doesn't agree with the disgusting boilbutted draft dodger.
You guys just need to give it up. There's no way you can keep up with Limbaugh's lies and obcene rhetoric. And, why would you want to?
It is a common phrase to strap something on a belt meaning to carry thoughts, ideas or objects. Leather
LOL, is there ANY length that you folks will not go to TRY to rationalize what Rush said?
That is a common phrase I never heard used before and I am old. I also never heard of macbeth before either and yet according to the ditto heads he seems to have been on posters everywhere someone against the war would look. Do you come from an alien world?
Leather Helmet: You posted the definition of the noun form of strap. Rush used the verb form. Please tell me you know the difference between the two.
Also, if it's a common phrase to strap ideas or things to one's belt (BTW, the former would make it a metaphor, the latter would make it a literal thing), is it also a common phrase to walk into people while ideas or things are strapped to one's belt?
The phony soldiers controversy was one thing. It is so painfully obvious that Rush was comparing McGough to a suicide bomber that I don't know how you can defend him. It's also obvious that Rush knows he can use a suicide bomber metaphor when describing someone's actions and, as long as he doesn't use the words "suicide bomber," his listeners will help him wriggle out of it by being as obtuse as possible about it.
Please, someone, anyone, post a reference to "strapping ideas or things to one's belt and walking into people" as a common usage. I mean, c'mon, this is beyond ridiculous. But, then again, you guys bought into the Rush's defense of his comments about Michael J. Fox too.
You're absolutely right. MMFA is manufacturing this one by distorting what Limbaugh actually said. If you listen to his original remarks in their full context, it becomes clear that Limbaugh wasn't comparing McGough a suicide bomber.
Rather, Limbaugh was comparing McGough to another kind of person who has things strapped to their belt and walks into a crowd to do damage. You know what I'm talking about. I forget what they're called, but it's a pretty common figure of speech.
Anyway, that's not what's important. What's important is that Limbaugh most certainly did not compare McGough to a suicide bomber. Limbaugh had something totally different in mind: one of those people with dangerous things strapped to them who walk into crowds hoping to hurt as many people as possible. One of them. Not a suicide bomber. Not at all.
It is a common phrase to strap something on a belt meaning to carry thoughts, ideas or objects. leatherhelmet
Thanks for the post, Vy.I'll "strap that to my belt", meaning carry your thoughts or ideas with me.
Seriously ,LH, that's a phrase I've used at least 5 times today.
"Hey (co-worker), would you mind strapping this on your belt for a minute?"(meaning think about my idea)
"I'm sorry for the loss of your mother. I'll strap her on my belt" (meaning think about her)
Greatest post in a long time. LH.
I think my last post had some formatting problems.I'll "strap that on my belt", as the common saying goes, and try to solve the problem.
I'm always having formatting problems on this site, too. When you've strapped the solution to this problem to your belt, would you mind walking into as many people as possible (as the saying goes) so that the rest of us will be informed?
Of course,vysotsky. The minute I get the solution "strapped on my belt" (as the everyday colloquialism goes) I will make a beeline for you, as if driven by religious and nationalistic fury, and strap whatever info I have to your belt.
You know, this is such a blatant use of a valiant comment veteran, lying about what he said, then strapping those lies to his belt, and sending him out via the media matters website in a forum to walk into as many people as he can walk into. This leather-man will always be a hero to this forum with everyone. Whoever pumped his helmet full of these lies about what limpaugh said and embarrassed him with this baloney has betrayed him. They're not hurting you, they're betraying this commenter. Now, unless he actually believes what he's saying, in which case it's just so unfortunate and sad when the truth of what limpaugh said is right out there to be learned.
Think I'll go over to Crooks and Liars and strap on a little more truth.
Be back later
Rick
Thanks, guys. I really needed the laugh.
Sounds more like tag, or a Larry Craig relay race. I wanna know what your doing with my belt.
Now I'm creaping myself out, ugh.
WESTON:
I think you might have something there. Let's see ... the metaphor was not about "suicide bombers", but instead about ... a Larry Craig experience. Yeah, that’s the ticket!.
“You know, this is such a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran”
This would be the hapless, confused and gullible victim, this dumb soldier, sent into the men’s restroom for reasons he doesn’t understand.
“… lying to him about what I said …”
This would be the “secret coding” of actions that the hapless victim is told, falsely, comes from Limbaugh, toe taps and hand signals that will communicate a desire, and win a “surprise reward.” But of course, Limbaugh never said any such thing.
“… then strapping those lies to his belt …”
This would signal a forewarning that the belt at some point would be removed, allowing the eventual lowering of the trousers …
“… sending him out via the media in a TV ad …”
This would be the actual utilization of those toe taps and frantic hand signals, a “show” …
“… to walk into as many people as he can walk into.”
This is the metaphor for the consummation of the transaction, the “walking into” other people.
YES! This MUST be the metaphor Limbaugh intended. It wasn’t a suicide bombing being suggested at all, but instead just some everyday gay trolling!
With THIS explanation of what Limbaugh really meant, that silly “suicide bombing” metaphor seems really far-fetched. This way, it’s not a stupid, gullible suicide bomber at all, but instead a stupid, gullible gay troller. Problem solved!
The word you're looking for is right there on Fox News: "homicide bomber."
Yeah what are they called now I cant remember either. Oh yeah phony suicide bombers. thats what he meant. I heard he had just been talking about belts the day before and said there were phony belts out there that phony suicide bombers strapped on so they could scare people who thought they were real suicide bombers. George Sorros has a phony belt company and bill Clinton hates America and Michael Fox gives them acting lessons. how unfair to so grossly misinterpret what he really meant.
Precisely!
DOD may be on to something.
DOD says, "Once again MMFA tries to find something (a human being with a conscience) where there is nothing (Rush Limbaugh).
Hey GOPWANTSAMERICANSTODIE
Keep telling yourself that. Being you have been assimilated by the Limborg hivemind I am sure you believe it. Those of us with an actual functioning cerebral cortex we can READ. Its YOU that has nothing. Then again you NEVER DO.
Yeah, right...It's David Brock that has no shame...Speaking of shame, did you ever read Mr. Brock's book Blinded By The Right? There are some pretty shameful episodes detailed in it. But, like any true rightie why would you want to be bothered with the facts about your dying political agenda and it's less than honorable tactics and exploits. At long last, do the conservatives have no shame? I mean, besides Larry Craig!
No, he didn't call him a suicide bomber. He just implied it! What a turd! Servicemen everywhere should spit on him!
How much OxyContin are Rush's apologists on?
Now we know why he was doctor shopping--he didn't have enough to go around.
Mr. McGough, I admire you for your service. I admire anyone and everyone who volunteers to serve in the United States military in this country, always have. I'm grateful to you for your service, and that, Brian, is an unqualified thank you, whether or not you support the war, or the surge, President Bush, or not.
Way to create a scandal out of nothing MMFA. How much is Hillary paying you.
Seriously, CD? What do you think Rush was describing when he was talking about walking into people strapped with lies?
Can Rush do ANYTHING wrong?
CompliantConsent may not be able to respond until tomorrow, after Rush's show airs.That's when Rush straps things on CD's belt, which is a common saying meaning to put ideas into his head.
Well, let me see if I can take a swing at this one. Maybe he means that Mr. Mcgough was lied to and believed what Mr. Limbaugh said or even worse intentionally went out there knowing that this was a great smear moment. Maybe he meant that Mr. Mcgough"strapped these lies to his belt" because no one would dare criticize a member of our military no matter what he is saying (well unless that is Gen. Patreus, or the 24 haditha marines, or any other military man the left feels they need to target). Maybe he meant that they "strapped these lies to his belt, to get as many people as he could" because, well putting commercials on almost every network is "going to as many people as he could. To say that this attack was not orchestrated would be ignorant.
Sure and strapping things to his belt and going out to bump into people had NOTHING to do with suicide bombing. RIIIIIGHT. I thought even the completely brainwashed and assimlated Limborg would shy away from defending this one but proving that a hiveminder has NO THOUGHTS except what they are TOLD to think they RUSH in here to show there is NOTHING the Oxymoron could possibly say they wouldnt defend as IF he actually had a shred of decency.
Copious: with all due respect, you cannot really believe that a belated "I love soldiers, really I do" comment by Rush, after days of his imflammatory rhetoric resulting in his being called out by Mr. McGough, makes all this a "non-story", can you? If you really believe that, you are clueless. If you don't (and I suspect that you really don't) then you are just being intellectually dishonest in yet another attempt to kiss Rush's behind. Either way, your comment is useless.
"I am NOT a crook!" Richard Nixon
Way to create a scandal out of nothing, Woodward and Bernstein!
Way to avoid the point AGAIN. I know Rush doesnt pay you hiveminders anything. Why should he you spout this nonsense for free.
Solon but he does make them feel so self righteous and victimized by liberalism. Worth its weight in gold. Or should I say his weight in gold.
Oh please! Scandal? Hardly! Just another example of how when caught in an obvious lie, Rush couldn't even pretend that he 'misspoke'. He had to go on the defensive and compound it with distortion after distortion. Typical right-wing strategy. Never admit an error no-matter how obvious or captured on video/audio/artist rendering. What a tool! Reminds me of Larry Craig. Instead of slinking away in shame, he has chose to act as though he was 'taken out of context' with his bizarre bathroom antics. Seriously, who touches another guy's foot while in a stall??? When 'forced' to use a public restroom, I don't even want to touch the seat!!!
oreilly, limbaugh, hannity all show the hedonistic (look it up sean) wasteland that is the "consevative right"...however, on the other hand these morons show that it is possible to be completely brain dead and still make money... What a country!
As an honorably discharged, disabled Vet who served over 36 years ago, when Rush would not, I humbly submit that Limbaugh and his chicken-hawk ilk be labeled what they truly are....Phony Patriots
GOPnot4me.
I guess he question is, do you think Rush supports the troups or do you think he doesn't support the troups? As a 24 year Vet and a long time listener to Rush, I would stand by Rush as a genuine supporter of the troups. His reference to "phony soldiers" was in response to an ABC piece that exposed people claiming to be Iraq War vets that had never actually gone over there.
JJ - Vancouver, WA
And I respectfully disagree. The context makes it clear he was talking about soldiers who dont agree with the war. The caller cited phony soldiers then SAID REAL SOLDIERS WANT TO BE IN IRAQ. Rush said they signed up for Iraq. THEY being REAL soldiers. THAT is agreement anyway you look at it. The inescapable conclusion is that only PHONY soldier Dont want to stay in Iraq. Which according to the poll published by Stars and Stripes would be about 72% of them.
SOLON, Rush has clearified his remarks to make it clear what he MENT. I don't know how others were raised, but I think the person who spoke gets to explain what he ment. He has publicly explained that he doesn't have an issue with real vets who speak out against the war. So if you have a concern that Rush thinks that any soldier who speaks out against the war is a "phony soldier", you can be rest assured that's not what he thinks. He has publicly stated that. It would be helpful if Media Matters would highlight the fact that Rush has explained what he ment about "phony soldiers".
Did you say the same thing about Kerry when he explained (what is pretty clear if you view the whole speech) his Bush joke last fall?
I think Rush supports the WAR and intentionally confuses that with supporting the troops. He supports the troops just like he supports his car, his house or any other object he uses.
I believe that Rush believes that he supports the troops. I do not doubt that his incredulous response to these accusations are genuine. He truly believes that he supports the troops, when in fact, he supports those troops that either agree with his agenda, or those troops that don't talk about it. Troops that oppose his agenda? Knee-jerk attack response, built upon years and years of being in the GOP attack machine, where the first response is to demoralize your opponent and denigrate them publically.
The proof does not lie in what Rush says, or even in what he believes, but in what he does. If he aggressive attacks soldiers and veterans who disagree with them as a knee-jerk reaction, he obviously hates them more as liberals than he loves them as soldiers, and this kind of public attack is not consistent with supporting the troops.
"And I'm not a drug-addled, doctor-shopping, misogynistic, racist, draft-dodging, mean-spirited, academically unsuccessful fool."
Wow. Keep talking, Rush.
I think that a lot of people are starting to wonder when the smear campaign against Rush Limbaugh is going to stop...
Probably when George Soros runs out of money!
Well you have to figure in the economics of the machine. Which gets a good missinformation to dollar ratio.
Allow for inflation, plant maitinence, and that George don't give MMFA money or marching orders.
Decode your answer now.....did you remember to carry the bum? Good.
Nice Firesign Theatre refrence, Eweston.
Thank you for recognising it. FST is a source of many good quotes, for me. I feel occasional guilt not giving them and others sources credit. So in general I'll say up front, if I may throw out a good one, it might be someone elses words, and I appreciate those sources. If I can give credit smoothly, if I even remember who it was, I'll do so.
I was wondering when it would START. Rush doesnt get HALF the flack he earns.
i hope that you and the rest of the dittoheads are aware that everytime rush and the rest of the wingnut talkers use soros as the boogeyman, it is a veiled analogy to the great antisemitic lie that jews cotrol the media.
"It's all lies I tell ya, nothing but lies" even the racist remark that got me fired form that sports TV show, and that "phony" house keeper that said I asked her to get me more drugs was all lies.... This poor imitation of Porky Pig is so afraid of getting negative e-mails, he charges his fans about 50.00 to sign up for his website that allows only the most faithful to send him e-mails. These guys, like limbaugh, hannity and the rest are like aging frat boys who still beat up the freshman and then laugh about it.
I admire those talented broadcasters and the duty they serve in their air conditioned studios spending four hours a day free associating on whatever passes through their enormously talented minds in their undying service to the First Amendment. But when the right gets a hold of these poor men and delude them into serving a false cause it's like shooting a birthday clown up with Viagra and bringing him down to the Pee Wee soccer field.
What? It's a common metaphor for something completely clean and wholesome, no really.....
Oh, for God's sake, have you people of MoveOn and Media Matters, at last, no shame? Your over the top distortions of what has been said bear no resemblance to the discussions documented in the transcripts of Mr. Limbaugh's radio show.
Count me as a Rush defender. And happy to tell you so.
TaterCon
There was NO distortion. I will count you one of the Limborg. You have been assimilated CHECK.
Tater, have to break this to you: you've been conned.
Too bad about that pride thing...pride goeth before a fall.
Rush: "...somebody else on MSNBC"...KEITH OLBERMANN, MSNBC: "Comparing that soldier to a suicide bomber."
Looks like Olberman is becoming 'Voldemort' to the 'Right Wingers'..."He who must not be named!" LMAO
I know what Leatherhelmet wants Rush to strap on.
I’ve got to make an appointment to get my hearing checked. I obviously am not hearing what Rush thinks I’m hearing. I mean it’s obvious that everyone in the country needs to have their hearing checked. We just misunderstand his enunciation and are just too proud to admit that we all need hearing aids. I’m going to buy stock in Miracle Ear tomorrow so I can retire to a south sea island after the stock explodes 100000% after everyone starts buying the hearing aids we all need. :o)
If one person on media mermadons had two functional ears, and one brain that could process what rush said and has said about our troops then you would be able to figure out that he supports our troops and didnt even come close to what you people think he said but your left wing minds will not allow for sensible conclusion but for ignorant and insane tactics to get (rush) fired for something that you twisted so bad it makes me sick to think our country is being led or should i say drivin into the ground by the far wacky left when the true anti soldier anti war whacks are most of the democratic leaders in the house and the senate. oh and by the way this is a shout out to rush, sean, neal, and bill keep up the good work no matter what these people say you are on the right side and the true american knows that.
There is this little-known concept in the English language called PUNCTUATION. Did we not cover that module yet in our home-school program?
Matt, it's doing a shout-out. Be cool about the puntuation. ;0)
And where did MMFA call for Rush to be fired? Oh wait another ignorant cell of the Limborg just telling us what the Oxymoron TOLD him to think. As usual it has nothing to do with reality. Just the spewage he was programmed with. Stupid is as stupid posts and you are REALLY stupid.
I'm pretty sure you're trying to be clever and say, "media myrmidons," like Neal Boortz has tried to be clever with.
Clue bus rolling through: when trying to be clever, please use spellcheck. Thank you!
I LOVE the fact that this issue is still being persued by these left wing bias sites. KEEP IT UP! The more you keep this and other phony issues alive, the more you show just how deperate you are. And continue to drive more and more independent thinkers away from you. We conservatives should bow to you for giving us the gift that keeps on giving. Thanks!
Just one in the looonng line of your delusions. Another Limborg heard from.
But it's ok for a sitting Congressman to call the Haditha Marines Murderers. This is really twisted reality here.
We and our congress have a duty to supervise our agents whom we give deadly weapons. WE need to be more tolerant of everyone's speech. It is getting to the point where any public figure talks on an issue they better have a fully prepared and focus group tested speech or they might say something that offends. Hard to really discuss important issues with that sort of gag. this is political correctness on both sides. the right rarely is willing to admit its own form of political correctness: like how dare Murtha express any concern over the possibility that soldiers may have committed an atrocity unless and until there has been a conviction of each and every one.
After reading the transcripts of this particular comment I agree that Limbaugh compared McGough to a suicide bomber. This is an unmistakable analogy. Limbaugh is harming his credibility by denying what is obvious in the transcripts. Much like Media Matters harmed its credibility stating that Limbaugh was lampooning dissenting soldiers with his phony soldiers/Jesse Macbeth comments.
When you have two powerful media organizations spewing lies and half truths at each other, you know the end result is going to be audience confusion. There is going to be so much mud on the ground after this war is over, that important issues like Iraq and Brittany Spears will be ignored.
It is clear from the original transcripts that Limbaugh was referring to fake soldiers like Macbeth when he made his phony soldier comments. It is also clear that MM was disingenuous when they voided the transcript section regarding Jesse Macbeth. Now it is also obvious that Limbaugh is being dishonest when he describes his comments regarding McGough.
I don't know where that leaves an independent observer to place judgment. Is MM evil for lying about Limbaugh's comments, or is Limbaugh evil for lying about what he said about McGough? Certainly both MM and Limbaugh have a long history of half-truths, smears, and blatant dishonest.
Perhaps the best position for the casual observer is to ignore this story, and Google for news on real issues. (Such as Brittany's child custody, and a two-year old story about a missing girl in Aruba.)
I have posted a disposable page on my interpretation of Limbaugh's comments, if anyone is wondering why I have come to the the conclusion that I have. I did this because the 750 word limitation here seems to be broken. (Yes, there are more than 750 words at the link, but when it was 749 words it would not post.)
Rush Limbaugh and the Phony Soldiers
Media Matters did no such thing. It takes a committment to give Rush the benifit of the doubt to even take the arguments made OVER AND OVER seriously. In THIS instance there is NO wiggle room whatsoever unless you are completely detached from reality. I applaud your fairness on this issue but absolutly deny Media Matters hurt their credibility in ANY way with their previous accusation. I thought it well founded. It has been gone over till its in the ground we just disagree.
I disgree with your assessment of Limbaugh's comments regarding phony soldiers, and at this point we'll just have to leave it at that.
I believe that I have given logical discourse to show that Limbaugh's phony soldier comments were clear in their meaning. I also believe that MM made a poor decision when making an attack based on semantics. Subjective arguments are difficult if not impossible to win.
Fortunately for MM, Limbaugh was given enough rope to hang himself, and has been caught in an obvious lie regarding comments made about McGough.
And I believe we have given much BETTER arguments that what he SAID was clear and it WAS aimed at the soldiers who are NOT real because they dont want to be in Iraq. He communicates professionally. What he SAID and agreed to is clear.
I think among others things, his supposed agreement to what the caller said is one of MM most subjective arguments.
No where does Limbaugh indicate any affirmation or agreement with the caller's opinion. No where does Limbaugh state a definition for "phony soldiers" that matches the opposite of the caller's definition of "real soldiers."
The caller defines "real soldiers" only after Limbaugh has coined the "phony soldiers" term. That means by virtue of cause and effect, it is impossible for the caller's comments to retroactively redefine Limbaugh's term. This is further backed by the example of Jesse Macbeth that Limbaugh gave, as it gives a clear definition as to what Limbaugh meant by "phony soldiers."
It might be your opinion that some argument that I have not yet read on this site better explains Limbaugh's statements, but I have yet to see. (feel free to link me rather than taking the time to rehash it)
In any regards, the fact that there are multiple plausible explanations for the phony soldiers comments makes it difficult for MM to tun the subjective argument into a factual one.
Yet, if Limbaugh is going to continue to deny he compared McGough to a suicide bomber, MM might win the argument by default. If Limbaugh destroys his credibility on the McGough issue, then he will lose face in light of his earlier arguments.
Some daylight seems to be appearing here. Of course the agreement with the second caller is subjective. So is our understanding of about 60% of our conversations everyday. Even in the world of defamation a jury may find a statement made by innuendo even if not explicitly said.
If you are going to publicly convict a man (who's livelihood depends on the appearance of being patriotic) of calling dissenting soldier's phony, then you probably will want to base your arguments on facts instead of conjecture.
Limbaugh never stated that dissenting solders were phony, nor did he agree to anyone that said such. You can argue that there is implied agreement to someone who might have said such, but a clear parsing of the transcript shows that Limbaugh connected the term "phony soldier" to Jesse Macbeth.
What Limbaugh clearly suggested was that he was disinclined to believe that someone who disagreed with his views on the Iraq war was either a real soldier or a real Republican...literally. Thus, the arrogance and ignorance of Rush Limbaugh as there are indeed Republicans and soldiers who disagree with Limbaugh's views on the war. His comments were insulting to the military and Republicans alike.
Perhaps I am looking at too narrow of a piece of the transcript? Could you cite the section of the transcripts that shows literally that:
"Limbaugh clearly suggested was that he was disinclined to believe that someone who disagreed with his views on the Iraq war was either a real soldier or a real Republican"
I cant find the section without going off this site now. I remember reading it several times. When the 1st calls says he is republican RL says something like yeah and i used to walk on the moon. I guess he did not literally say that the caller was not a republican ...but I recognize a sarcastic response. If the standard is literally "say in just those words" then you are "right" If you dont think that he meant that then you are wrong in my humble human opinion. I persoanlly think he should be able to call all soldiers who oppose the war #*#*** or any foul thing he sees fit and not be censored for it. But I constantly see the left hamstrung by needing to avoid any phrase that might be taken out of context and exploited by RL for 3 hours a day. We also have just seen Congress officially censure moveon. I just want an equal playing field. When people are trying to actually communicate ideas with a degree of passion and using metaphors and arguments they can overstate something. When the left does it it is act of congress time, when the right it is barely covered. Not a fair way to debate.
Your own link further down has it and Limbaugh says Mike i doubt that you're a republican before the sarcastic moon walk comment. How literal does he have to be to ring your literal bell?
I read your interpretation of Limbaugh's comments, and you made good points. Based only on the section of the transcript you parsed, I would have to agree with you. However, when I read the transcript from the beginning - the beginning both on MM and Limbaugh's website - I feel that Limbaugh's comments leading up to the phony soldiers remark clearly show he was not only referring to Jesse Whatshisface.
In fact, I think the person he was most insulting was Caller1, Mike. Mike repeatedly told Limbaugh that he was a Republican and supported withdrawal, and Limbaugh repeatedly told the caller that there was no way he could be a Republican, essentially calling Mike a liar. The caller then mentions that he used to be military, and Limbaugh responds that he used to walk on the moon. Now, unless "walking on the moon" is some obscure drug reference that I'm not hep enough to comprehend, this exchange shows that Limbaugh believes that his caller is a liar, both about being a Republican and being former military. He bases his accusations of the caller misrepresenting himself on his belief that the US should leave Iraq.
When Limbaugh finally makes the phony soldiers remark, and even when he brings up Jesse, I believe he is demonstrating that he is inclined to believe that soldiers who are against the war are likely to be fakes. He may respect soldiers, and he may even be forced to acknowledge once in a while that there are "real" soldiers who disagree with the war. But he believes that anyone who disagrees with him or supports withdrawal is phony until proven real.
MD: If you are going to publicly convict a man (who's livelihood depends on the appearance of being patriotic)...
First of all, Limbaugh's critics aren't in a position to convict Limbaugh of anything. This isn't a question of whether or not Limbaugh broke a law -- it's entirely a question of what Limbaugh meant by exclaiming "The Phony Soldiers!" in a conversation with a caller. The question is entirely one of interpreting his intentions, and it's a perfectly legitimate and necessarily subjective question.
More importantly, though, Limbaugh's livelihood depends much more directly on selling advertising than on maintaining an appearance of patriotism. He's the one who has made his show about patriotism, not his critics. If he's vulnerable to questions about his fair-weathered support of U.S. troops, then it is only because he has hitched his show to that particular wagon.
mutual disdain,
what you neglect to note in your analysis, is that el druggo has a history of attacking vets and active duty soldiers, when they do not share his political views. and these attacks are never based on substance, but are ad hominems. such as when he called paul hackett a "staff puke" and alledged that hackett only went to iraq to "pad his politcal resume'". you neglect to note that in attempting to defend himself, rush included murtha (a decorated vet) and beauchamp (an active duty soldier, serving in iraq) as also being phony soldiers.
el druggo does not want to be held accountable for his words...and the time for that is now at an end.
he has called liberals and those opposed to the war as being unpatriotic....but what is he who only supports those soldiers that hold his views. no matter what his protestations.
Limbaugh's previous comments regarding Hackett indicate that he believes Hackett was hiding his true political views, instead of clearly stating his left of center positions. Limbaugh believes that Hackett is simply running on his military record, and not providing his true political thoughts.
I don't think this gives any credence one way or another on the interpretation of Limbaugh's "phony soldiers" comment. It doesn't appear Hackett is attacked for his service in light of his political position, so much as for not being clear about those political positions.
Congressman Murtha appears to have been rebuked, not for his dissent, but for making false claims about the guilt of Marines in the Haditha incident.
Limbaugh blelieves Murtha is a soldier who has made false claims about atrocities in Iraq. Limbaugh argues that this is similar to Jesse Macbeth who also made false claims about atrocities in Iraq.
Murtha made the following comments:
It's much worse than reported in Time magazine. There was no fire fight. There was no IED that killed these innocent people. Our troops overreacted because of the pressure on them and they killed innocent civilians in cold blood. And that's what the report is going to tell.
Now, you can imagine the impact this is going to have on those troops for the rest of their lives and for the United States in our war and our effort in trying to win the hearts and minds.
Following his statements the Marine Corps stated that Murtha was not briefed on the Haditha situation until at least a week after making the statements listed above. This means that Congressman Murtha besmirched the honor of several combat veterans who had not even been charged of any crime. He essentially called them guilty before they had even been charged.
Limbaugh's biggest problem is that now that he has denied comparing McGough to a suicide bomber, he has destroyed his credibility. In doing so, he has harmed his ability to defend past positions and statements. The casual observer must now say to themselves, "If Rush lied about his clear statements regarding McGough, then did he also lie about his more ambiguous phony soldier statements?"
I think MM made a mistake bringing up the phony soldiers charges, but it appears Limbaugh is willing to give them all the ammo they need to hang him.
I think Limbaugh's handlers should put him on a 2 minute delay for the rest of the month and go to bumper music anytime he makes any more false statements.
I have a question about Haditha - was Murtha incorrect?
I keep seeing outrage that some Marines were called murderers for what initially appeared to be a cover up of a slaughter, which I would think most people would agree is an atrocity. Is the outrage that Murtha should have waited a week to say what he did, or is the outrage that Murtha was wrong about what happened?
I'm gonna need to wiki this, but would appreciate elaboration.
Murtha made the following comments in November of 2005: (Source)
It's much worse than reported in Time magazine. There was no fire fight. There was no IED that killed these innocent people. Our troops overreacted because of the pressure on them and they killed innocent civilians in cold blood. And that's what the report is going to tell.
Now, you can imagine the impact this is going to have on those troops for the rest of their lives and for the United States in our war and our effort in trying to win the hearts and minds.
In order for Murtha's statements to be true, the 24 men in question would have to be found guilty of murder. The "in cold blood" comments make it seem as if it were done purposely and without remorse.
In order to show that Murtha's statements were incorrect, I decided to source the latest Haditha information from Al Jazeera so there would not be a question of bias in favor of the Marines:
Source: Reduced charges for Haditha marine
An investigating officer has recommended that a murder charge be dropped against a US marine accused of leading his team in killing 24 Iraqi civilians in Haditha two years ago, a defence lawyer says. If the proposal is accepted, as is likely, it would mean that no one will face murder charges in the biggest case involving Iraqi civilian deaths.
...
If the proposal is accepted by Lieutenant-General James Mattis, the commanding officer overseeing the case, no one will face murder charges in the Haditha case.
...
Wuterich, 27, has expressed regret over the deaths but maintained that he operated within combat rules and "made the best decisions I could have at the time".
Murtha, without all the facts, convicted Marines who had not even been charged at the time of murder. Unfortunately, because of his role in congress, he is protected against most defamation suits.
"And that's what the report is going to tell."
Murtha was apparently quoting an investigative report from the military. Are you suggesting the military lied about its own troops? Why would they do that?
That one of the parties to the killings may escape the legal consequences does not mean he did not commit the crime. Do you remember the O.J. Simpson murder trial?
The military immediate response to Murtha's comments was to state:
"there is an ongoing investigation; therefore, any comment at this time would be inappropriate and could undermine the investigatory and possible legal process."
On August 4th, 2006 a Marine Cops spokesman was quoted as saying that Murtha was not briefed on Haditha until a week after his comments. How did he quote a military report, when he wasn't even briefed yet?
At the very least Murtha is guilty of releasing information before the investigation was completed, but since the Marine Corp has stated Murtha was not briefed until a week after his comments, it is likely he is guilty of much more.You seem to overlook the possibility that Murtha could have learned information regarding Haditha through informal channels - members of the media and/or the military outside of a formal briefing.
I am no fan of Murtha, but I fail to see the importance some are placing of his opinion on what happened at Haditha. Above you claimed Murtha "convicted" the other soldiers. That appears to be hyperbole. Murtha didn't convict anyone more than Gary Conditt or OJ Simpson were "convicted" by people's opinions. Much ado about nothing.
as hackett never hid his feelings about the war, nor the fact that he is/was a liberal, el druggo is again proven to be a liar.
in the same piece, el druggo alledges that max cleland tried to use his uniform as a cover for his liberal leanings...another smear against a vet who left 3 limbs on the battlefield in service to his country.
when the swiftboaters came out with their smears against kerry, i never heard a peep from el druggo that kerry should be respected for his service...infact, el druggo was busy helping to spread the lies from this org, and helping to spread the lies about kerry's congressional testimony during nam
this is el druggo's history of supporting the troops, no matter what their political leanings.i
The Cowards white flag of surrender - "Let's call it a draw"
Actually a more realistic summary of my statements would be, "Let's call them all liars and read the real news."
If you concede that both Limbaugh and MediaMatters have lied in the past week, and even more-so in the past, what really is the best course of action?
I guess if you're a partisan, you claim victory for your side. If you're a realist, you step back and wonder how much propaganda you've been consuming from both of these dishonest brokers of information.
I'm not a Limbaugh fan btw, and probably agree with you on more issues than you might think.
"If you concede that both Limbaugh and MediaMatters have lied in the past week, and even more-so in the past, what really is the best course of action?"
Personally? Dismiss the one that lies more. What specifically are you accusing MM of lying about, though?
In this instance, I am accusing MM of being disingenuous in its claims that Limbaugh's phony soldiers meant dissenting troops. I am also accusing MM of being dishonest in regards its initial posting of the Limbaugh transcript in which it voided the contextually relevant Jesse Macbeth section.
That standard pretty well means the left can not comment on what it thinks is the clear meaning of his comments so long as he does not literally say it in just those words. he insinuates 15 hours a week. When he comes out explicitly it may be less harmful than when he attempts to create links between A and B without explicit or logically stated connection. In my opinion he was clearly linking macbeth and soldiers who oppose the war in manner intended to come in just under the conscious radar. With your standard we have to let him do this without calling him on what he is tacitly saying.
I am accusing MM of being stupid in leaving out the macbeth comments which i suggest is the really obnoxious move by El Rushbo.
md -
i appreciate your effort to examine the matter in a dispassionate light. but your arguments founder because you refuse to take into account the big lie on which limbaugh's entire fulmination was predicated: the utterly false claim that those who speak out against the war, who report on soldiers with negative views of the war, etc., "only speak" to these "phony soldiers" -- of which i count a grand total of two -- before arriving at their views. this is patently and verifiably untrue. "they" speak to thousands of soldiers who have fought and been wounded and done multiple exhausting tours, some later killed. why would we take limbaugh seriously or accept his ex post facto rationalizings when his initial premise is provably bogus?
further, limbaugh has made a career is snatching "bites" out of context or out of full context and using them to discredit or smear. it's his modus. yet he now wants to be granted this courtesy in a very dubious instance where extraordinary elasticity is required to credit him at all.
finally, limbaugh's acolytes and lickspittles have swarmed this site to denounce all soldiers who assail the war as cowards and traitors. thus we know what his listeners think. are we to believe limbaugh is not catering to this listernership? if not, why doesn't limbaugh simply state a clarification: "I do not see antiwar soldiers as phonies in any way" would do it.
i do not like being manipulated and do not buy into many of MM's half-baked notions of "slights" against the left. we are not simpletons here. this case is clear from the evidence, the context, the history of the individual involved,the near absence of "phony soldiers," and the fact that many of his colleagues on the right express this opinion ab. antiwar soldiers quite freely.
it is what it is.
Could someone here point me to the MediaMatters Rush Limbaugh Phony Soldiers Fact Check? It appears to be missing from the site.
http://mediamatters.org/items/200710020011?f=h_top
Rush Limbaugh is nothing more than an aging, hard-of-hearing wingnut who's passed his prime in radio.
This conservative fraud avoided military service like the flu. Plus, he can't keep a wife. This right-wing loon is a failure in life.
He's the one who eventually will be taken off their air.
Folks, what we have here in el rushbo is a freak of nature. I can only marvel at his ability to say something one minute and then deny he said it the next.
If you listened to any part of his show yesterday, you heard a man that is about to lose what is left of his mind.
He says he supports the troops...must be a tough love thing. He has extended his brand of support to Kerry, Hagel, Cleland, Hackett, etc., etc. Someday they will appreciate what Limbaugh has done to....uh...for them.
Rush -- This is what a REAL soldier looks like. Although I suppose you would consider this the "chickification" of war.
Why don't YOU volunteer to go to either Iraq or Afghanistan to help with reconstruction, you chicken-hawk blowhard?????
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21135715/displaymode/1107/s/1/
So, we have the evidence of what Rush said ... his defense is tainted because he doctored the evidence ... if it were anybody on the left, there would be great outcry and accusations of tampering with the evidence ...
I guess that Michael Vick would have loved to have the opportunity to doctor the evidence against him and present that as "the truth" ...
I don't want Rush off the air. I used to listen to him in the early 90's and he showed me by his words that I was and am a Liberal. I am curious though, is there a list of his sponsors? I would hope that by losing even a couple of sponsors he'd be put back in his place and realize he's not untouchable.
His website lists all his sponsors.
Thanks to you all for turning me into an activist. The phony outrage over the phony soldier story caused me to check out this website, and the first thing that jumped out at me is the designation of being a 501(c)(3) organization. Having served on the boards of such organizations, it was clear Media Matters is NOT one of those. I checked on IRS.gov and found that there is (yet another) form available - one to report fraud, which I have now done. Because we are not (yet) a socialist country, ALL sides have the right to speak their minds, but NOT at taxpayer expense - Once citizens are forced to support just one side, then we become a socialist state.
Oh, and to most of you posting here, you'd have much more success making your points if you left out the crude comments and childish emotions. Such diatribes just make me laugh, and not take anything seriously............like children spatting in a sandbox. If you truly want to be taken seriously, I suggest you handle yourselves in a mature manner.
The airwaves BELONG to us WE decide how they are used. It is that simple. You MIGHT be taken at least SOMEWHAT seriously if you left off that air of condescension.
Just who exactly is the WE to whom you are referring? The airwaves BELONG to us WE decide how they are used. And what is you point?
thanks for the advice, grandma. good luck with your frivolous bureaucratic venture.
You're welcome for the advice, and thanks for the good luck wish.
Oooh one of my favorite conservative doublespeak moments, "I'm going to call you names while scolding you for childish name calling."
Hey, I lost a kettle somewhere, could you call "Black" to help me find it?
I think you are the real "socialist[sic]". It seems you have some difficulty with a difference of opinion yourself, eh comrade?
i hope you are also filing a fraud complaint against accuracy in media, the rightwing counterpart to mmfa
Thank you - I wasn't aware of Accuracy in Media. In looking at their website, they appear to have a different approach to their mission than MM. I also haven't found any reference anywgere (yet) to their organization being started by anyone currently running for office. The reason I filed the IRS fraud report is because Mrs. Clinton is on tape stating that she started Media Matters, and since MM was started very recently, it certainly appears that MM is intended to be a political organization for the benefit of Mrs. Clinton. Again, that by itself is no big deal - it's the designation of being a 501(c)(3) that I find objectionable.
I have sat back and watched the debate for the past week on here. After carefull thought and reflection, I have come to the conclusion that MMFA is trying to make a mountain out of a molehill. I can take anything anyone has said and turn those words against them by taking them out of context and that is exactly what MMFA has done.
Why don't we discuss the "phony soldier" MacBeth and what he had to say or what about Tom Harkin's false claim of seeing action in VietNam or how about Harry Ried's claim that the war is lost.
How about Moveon.org's ad about the General. (good thing Patton is not around, Moveon's office would be gone)
Only when a conservative says something that can be taken out of context does MMFA jump up and down and the "kool-aid" drinkers that follow MMFA jump up and shout.
Fair debate without name calling is the backbone of this country. Present both sides and agree to disagree without all the personal attacks and this country will go forward.
BTW: anybody want to explain to me why Obama has now stopped wearing the American flag lapel pin when he is seen in public?
I too have to have my comments approved by a moderator, so I doubt this will ever be seen by you. And yet, I like to write. So.
It's interesting to me that you believe that Limbaugh's comments only seem damaging when taken out of context. To me, it's the opposite. When I read the exchange between the second caller and Limbaugh, I see no indication, really, that Limbaugh is agreeing with the caller's statement that it is necessary to agree with the war in order to be a real soldier.
Taken in context, however, it becomes clear who Limbaugh is referring to with his phony soldiers comment. He is referring to Caller 1, whose claim that he was Republican, former military, and in favor of withdrawal was met with frank disbelief by Limbaugh. He is referring to Jesse Macbeth, and other people who pretend to be soldiers to get benefits or get attention. In these cases, he is correct - these are phony soldiers.
What is problematic is that Limbaugh makes it clear that because in several cases people claiming to be soldiers have been proven frauds, he is justified in assuming that anyone who contacts the media claiming to be a soldier and against the war is automatically suspect. This assumption means that he is calling military members against the war phony soldiers, and that is why his comments were offensive and just plain stupid.
This just got really interesting. After posting a comment on this site I received this notice:
Thank you for your comment. Because you have not posted enough comments yet, your comment will not be publicly viewable until a moderator has a chance to approve your comment. All comments submitted are reviewed during normal business hours (9 a.m. to 5 p.m. ET Mon-Fri) and posted as soon as possible, depending on volume. Comments submitted outside of that time frame may take longer to appear on the site. Comments that are obscene, off-topic or otherwise in violation of our terms of use will never appear on the site.
I wonder how much of my original post will show up?
Good thing I saved it.
it showed up fine
is your paranoid, america hating mind at ease now?
He didn't actually call McGough a 'suicide bomber' - he didn't use those actual words but the analogy he made is clear to anyone who has more than a lambchop of a brain... and that's being generous. He knew what he was saying.
What Rush Said:
You know, this is such a blatant use of a valiant combat veteran, lying to him about what I said, then strapping those lies to his belt, sending him out via the media and a TV ad to walk into as many people as he can walk into. This man will always be a hero to this country with everyone. Whoever pumped him full of these lies about what I said and embarrassed him with this ad has betrayed him. They're not hurting me. They're betraying this soldier. Now, unless he actually believes what he's saying, in which case it's just so unfortunate and sad when the truth of what I said is right out there to be learned.
Now is it me or do you guys keep leaving out the entire conversation. This is why everything is taken out of context. Never did he call this man a suicide bomber, but he did call him a hero. Now I'm gonna do what you guys have been doing for a week now and be ridiculous. now we all know that rush thinks negatively of suicide bombers, so he could never call a suicide bomber a hero. Hence, after calling this man a hero it would take away any thoughts that he was calling him a suicide bomber. (I feel like the knight in Holy Grail)I can see how if someone wanted to believe that he called this man a suicide bomber they would come to that conclusion especially when you leave out the whole conversation. The fact is he called this man a hero but you guys will never see that point.
so what exactly does the metaphor mean, if not an allusion to a suicide bomber.
and calling the sgt a hero doesnt change the fact that he also said that the mccough was incapable of thinking for himself.
So you went from being a drone to complaining legally to the IRS all due to our phony outrage. Good eye on the designation. I don't think I've ever noticed it.
Would you take your new political activisim to the level of making legal complaints also about say the AIE, Cato Institute, and the ever popular Federalist Society?
Making you laugh is part of our efforts to make you feel good and thereby help you reap the healthy benifits of this feelings, no need to thank us. Just part of the services we provide for all of our disturbed posters.
Thanx Bob and Ray for that last bit, slightly modified.
Because I am new to all this, I am not familiar with AIE, Cato Institute, and the "ever popular "Federalist Society - but I will check them out. Thanks!
"I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber"
Reminds me of an exercise in tense. Hee we go.
"I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber." (Not me!)
"I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber" (That's not what I said!)
I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber" (I called him something else!)
I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber" (not that guy over there!)
I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber" (not this particular guy!)
I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber" (I meant to call him something else!)
I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber" (No, a different bomber.)
I didn't call this guy a suicide bomber" (No, a siucide 'something else.)
See how easy it is. It all comes down to which word Rush was trying to emphasize in his statement.
Jesse Macbeth, who claimed that he and other soldiers had slaughtered innocent civilians in Iraq, but who, it turns out, had never set foot in Iraq and had never even completed basic training before being drummed out of the Army. Sounds like a phony soldier if there ever was one.
Many voting Americans are definitely stricken with war weariness and that is certainly tied to the Republicans. But most Americans aren’t inherently antiwar, they are anti-losing the war. Nor do they cotton to dishonest smears that try to make U.S. soldiers look like war criminals.
“If you make the most of it, you study hard, you do your homework and you make an effort to be smart, you can do well. If you don’t, you get stuck in Iraq.” Sen John Kerry
Does Kerry respect our troups?
as the quote by kerry was referring to the president, i would say yes, he respects the troops.
thanks for playing
Defender here. It's just so difficult to respond to your diatribes. It's like trying to negotiate with Ahmadinijead. How can you reason with one who is unreasonable.
Any NEW news going on, maybe something more important than this!
I'm amazed at how many here on the left here are following MMFA over the cliff.
I think I've seen calmer groups at a lynch mob.
But, like sharks in the water, many smell blood and are in a feeding frenzy.
However it seems to me that most here have simply drunk too much kool-aid.
ps:
Analogy is the comparison of two pairs which have the same relationship.Thanks for the definition ... now, a definition of "bad analogy" ...
using the comparison of smoking and eating ice cream ... you don't eat second-hand ice cream ...
A better analogy might be second-hand urine in a pool ... or maybe finding a nice quiet spot to sit and read, and some guy with a loud portable stereo playing "music" that you find repulsive comes and sits 5 feet away and turns the volume to 11 ...
"I admire anyone and everyone who volunteers to serve in the United States military in this country, always have."
Except of course if they have dissenting (and informed) opinions.
Interesting that the RW zombie defense here seems to be, "Well Rush didn't use the actual words "suicide bomber" so he's off the hook." Nice parsing. Your party has sunk so low next you guys will start debating the meaning of "is." Republicans are the new Democrats.
Yes, you did, Rush. Rush Limbaugh hates America!
You go Rush....Never give up!!!!! Your army is growing everyday.
Limbaugh most certainly did not call McGough a suicide bomber. That is a ludicrous, sel-serving leap from his actual language and frankly an indefensible accusation. As you make your living lying you should really do a better job of it. Neither of your accusations against Rush can even be reasonably argued by anyone with any intellectual honesty. Of course that is undoubtedly why they must find a home on sites such as yours, Huffington and with various left wing media shills on CNN, MSNBC and the like. The more the left works to silence or discredit its opponents with lies and clearly ridiculous claims, the more you reveal about yourselves.
Isn't the "I haven't read it", "I haven't seen it", I haven't heard it yet" bs getting a little thin from this crowd? The biggest item(s) in the news, especially those about YOU personally and you don't have time to check it out for yourself? Yeah Rush, Perino, Cheney,... we believe you..... are dummasses that is......
Here is what is going on...
Our side will not budge... No compromises...
Your side will not budge... No compromises...
We ALL lose...
Rush, Ann, Sean and others on my side are WRONG...
Hilary, Reid, Murtha and others are WRONG on your side...
We ALL lose again...
As long as my side AND your side continue to throw insults at each other instead of hammering out VERY HARD compromises to the War (that I support & some of you don't) or the Socilized Health Care (that some of you support and I do not), then we are just ALL stuck.
Your side says that WE CONSERVATIVES are to blame for all that is WRONG with America, hey we ARE part of America too...
Our side says that YOU LIBS are to blame for all that is WRONG with America, hey you ARE Americans too...
How will this EVER end, you here at MM can not really believe that you can have it ALL your way, we Conservatives that listen to Rush can NOT think we can have everything our way...
But when I read the post here throughout all of the recent threads I only see stubborn hatered of the "OTHER" side. Hell, all of my posts up till now have been FULL OF SLURS, HATE, MY SIDE IS RIGHT, YOUR COMMIES and other stuff that I am not very proud of now. But wait, the responces to me and other Consevatives on this site have NOT been kind either, calling us NAZIS, RADICAL CHRISTIANS, POOR HATERS, RACISTS, ect.
When will both side (yes, me too) learn that we are ALL in this together, like it or not. We prove right here in these forums that America is DIVIDED, slit down the middle with BOTH sides feeling that they are the ONLY ones that have rights, feelings, thoughts and opinions.
We will we ALL stop name calling and just see IF, and I know it's a HUGE If, but if we can find ANY common ground, any place to compromise.
But just look back at these threads over the last 10 days or so. It really does not look like there is ANY uniting factor ANYWHERE other then our dislikes for each other.
I really do not know what to do anymore. I will NOT change my basic beliefs that American has far too many that want the United States to actualy LOSE a war, a poll showed that 1 in 5 Dems want the US to Lose, think it would be better for the World. Sorry, but that scares me. I can not give up my thought that calling a 25 year old in a family that makes around $80k a year is poor and needs MY money for Health Insurance.
The list could go on and on...
And from you side you would say that you will not drop your opinions that there should be Universal Health Care for all Americans, Socilized womb to tomb hand outs of all kinds, Increased taxes on "the rich", an END to the illeagle war...
See ? Where do we start to compromise ? What can we do ?
You folks of BOTH parties just watch how bad this post gets hammered... Watch the hate come out. Even here we will find NO civility, no compromises, so how do we expect to get along with each other and survive. My side is NOT going away, we are getting louder and stronger and pushing back against what we feel like is the decline of America, your side is NOT going away, it is ALSO getting STRONGER and LOUDER.
How does this end ?
I guess it's good for us ALL, heck I did more then my share of name calling, to vent and call people fools, racists, Nazis, Commies, liers, ect ect ect.
But we just end up hating each others and each others opinions more & more... The divide keeps getting wider and wider.
We will not be silenced, neither will OR should your side.
You have the SAME rights I do, both sides seem to forget that.
I will say this, I fully expected MM to keep my posts out. I was wrong, they have not, they have been totaly fair. So for that I'm sorry. This site hase been more then fair with all my typo's and gramatical errors.
I wish we ALL could learn to forgive and find compromises, but i think that's just to much to hope for...
Please keep posting. We have grounds to discuss things but we must strive to know the truth of each story instead of the spin.
I think that Limbaugh got caught doing something he routinely does and that is slander anyone who disagrees with Bush and his policies. Media does Matter.
Lymphbug buying off mediamatters.org for crass advertising.
Limbaugh used the word soldier on his show Friday? Can you believe that? He actually said the word soldier. How dare he? And Thursday, he said liberal? Oh my gosh, are you kiddin? Why is he still on the air?
"I will say this, I fully expected MM to keep my posts out. I was wrong, they have not, they have been totaly fair."
- mgarnett251924
Yeah, liberals are like that.
Try posting a dissenting comment on one of the RW sites (e.g FreeRepublic) and see how long it takes before you get banned.