MSNBC's Carlson invoked Lorena Bobbitt to claim Clinton is tapping into women's anger toward men
On the November 1 edition of MSNBC's Tucker, while discussing the response by Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton's (D-NY) presidential campaign to the October 30 Democratic debate, host Tucker Carlson asked whether Clinton can "claim to be a grizzled veteran of rough and tough politics and then cry 'No fair!' when her male opponents fire a few jabs at her." Carlson then said that Clinton "clearly is playing the gender card" and asked MSNBC political analyst Pat Buchanan, "Does that work?" Buchanan rejected Carlson's assertion, stating, "I don't think she's saying that." Carlson went on to state, "I think whenever she appears tough, I think it's good for her. I think she actually is tough. But the one thing we learned from the Lorena Bobbitt case is there's a great deal of resentment among women aimed at men. That's why Oprah's huge." Carlson continued: "I'm serious. Women are angry at men in a lot of ways. They don't say much about it, but they are. And she's pandering to that resentment and anger, and it's wrong." Nationally syndicated radio host Bill Press responded: "I think men have a reason to be angry at women based on what Lorena Bobbitt did." Carlson replied, "Well, I couldn't agree with you more. No man would ever defend the corollary. But women are like, 'Oh, I understand why Lorena did that.' I mean, they're really mad. And she's taking advantage of it."
In an earlier segment on the program, Carlson had asked National Organization for Women president Kim Gandy, "What about being a woman ... is going to make her [Clinton] a better president?" Gandy replied, "[T]here's no question that women do bring a different life experience to everything that they do," and added, "[F]or women everywhere, the idea of having a woman president ... means something very important to them." Carlson went on to say, "No, but you're using stereotypes about women to her advantage. You're saying. 'Women are a certain way, she is a woman, therefore, vote for her.' You could also say -- why couldn't you take that to the negative side? Maybe I could say, 'Women are too emotional,' or maybe, 'They're bitchy sometimes. Don't vote for her.' But you're not allowed to say that. You can only credit being a woman to the positive side." Carlson later added, "[W]hy not just take gender out of this and fight fair?"
Carlson has previously referred to castration in talking about Clinton. As Media Matters for America documented, Carlson attributed a "castrating" quality to Clinton, stating: "[T]here's just something about her that feels castrating, overbearing, and scary." Further, Carlson has repeatedly said of Clinton: "I cross my legs involuntarily every time she comes on the air."
From the November 1 edition of MSNBC's Tucker:
CARLSON: I'm just confused by the rationale for the Clinton campaign: She's a woman, therefore vote for her. And I've asked this question of many people. Maybe you can answer it. What about being a woman -- specifically related to her sex -- is going to make her a better president?
GANDY: Well, there's no question that women do bring a different life experience to everything --
CARLSON: Right.
GANDY: -- that they do. And the fact that -- even the fact that we have a woman running, a woman front-runner for president, sends a terribly important message to our daughters and to our sons that women can be leaders.
CARLSON: But once you've acknowledged that --
GANDY: And that is so important.
CARLSON: OK, I get that.
GANDY: And for women everywhere, the idea of having a woman president -- not just a woman president, but a woman who will be a terrific president --
CARLSON: But don't you see you've opened yourself up -- now, hold on.
GANDY: -- means something very important to them.
CARLSON: Now that you've conceded that men and women are different and that being a woman is an advantage, you also have to concede that it could be a disadvantage.
GANDY: I said women bring a different life experience --
CARLSON: They bring a different life experience.
GANDY: -- because women are treated differently in this society.
CARLSON: OK, maybe it's good, maybe it's also --
GANDY: And they bring that understanding.
CARLSON: No, but you're using stereotypes about women to her advantage. You're saying. "Women are a certain way, she is a woman, therefore, vote for her." You could also say -- why couldn't you take that to the negative side? Maybe I could say, "Women are too emotional," or maybe, "They're bitchy sometimes. Don't vote for her." But you're not allowed to say that. You can only credit being a woman to the positive side.
GANDY: Of course people are saying that. Lots of people are saying that.
CARLSON: No, she's saying --
GANDY: They're saying, "Oh, the country's not ready for a woman president. I think I'm gonna -- "
CARLSON: But why not just take gender out of this and fight fair? Why not just say, "You know what, it's not about gender."
GANDY: Oh, is that unfair for her to point out that she's woman --
CARLSON: Absolutely. Absolutely.
GANDY: -- is unfair fighting?
CARLSON: Absolutely. Because the expectation --
GANDY: Oh, come on.
CARLSON: I'll tell you exactly why. Because you are seen -- and this has happened in campaigns with her and other female candidates -- you are seen as a bully, as mean, as one of the boys -- as she said in her absurd reference during her speech at Wellesley today -- if you attack her. And shouldn't this be a campaign about ideas and what she stands for, and not about her gender, which she can't control?
[...]
CARLSON: The question is can Hillary claim to be a grizzled veteran of rough and tough politics and then cry "No fair!" when her male opponents fire a few jabs at her. Joining me now, MSNBC political analyst Pat Buchanan and the nationally syndicated radio talk show host and all-around great guy Bill Press.
PRESS: All right.
CARLSON: Pat, I mean, the obvious question: She clearly is playing the gender card -- "You can't hit a girl." Does that work?
BUCHANAN: I don't think she's saying that. I think what she did was very effective up there at Wellesley. She's going to these gals up there who adore her, and she's saying, in effect, "Look, I'm out there and all the boys piled on me and we're doing just fine. I came out of Wellesley." And they're all enthusiastic. I think, frankly, that solidifies her folks, and she's turning herself into someone who stood up against the whole crowd and handled herself well. Took a couple of shots and came out and is willing to go back. I think, frankly, this is the best day she's had. It wasn't yesterday when she endorsed that --
CARLSON: Interesting. No, that's a totally -- I mean, I think whenever she appears tough, I think it's good for her. I think she actually is tough. But the one thing we learned from the Lorena Bobbitt case is there's a great deal of resentment among women aimed at men. That's why Oprah's huge. I mean, women are angry --
[laughter]
CARLSON: I'm serious. Women are angry at men in a lot of ways. They don't say much about it, but they are.
BUCHANAN: Holy smokes.
CARLSON: And she's pandering to that resentment and anger, and it's wrong.
PRESS: I think men have a reason to be angry at women based on what Lorena Bobbitt did.
CARLSON: Well, I couldn't agree with you more. No man would ever defend the corollary. But women are like, "Oh, I understand why Lorena did that." I mean, they're really mad. And she's taking advantage of it.
CARLSON: Maybe I could say, 'Women are too emotional,' or maybe, 'They're bitchy sometimes.
Uhhh, Tucker...watch replays of your show. You're decribing yourself.
CARLSON: I'm serious. Women are angry at men in a lot of ways. They don't say much about it, but they are.
Jeez, Tucker...you're embarrassing. Even Pat Buchanan is telling you to stop. Why are you so angry at women?
Never have I seen a supposedly grown man so in fear of losing his masculinity. The very IMAGE of a woman on a screen terrifies him to the point of protective posturing. And he's not embarrassed to ADMIT it, as if it's a valid guideline towards judging others.
The usual political observation is a candidate "comfortable in his own skin." For Carlson, it's the image of a man horribly uncomfortable in his own foreskin.
We can only hope he is in near constant therapy. The kid has real issues with women to the point his insecurities color his every public appearance. The main question is, how could a broadcasting network give a man a talk show who has such obviously abnormal phobias?
Carlson continued: "I'm serious. Women are angry at men in a lot of ways. They don't say much about it, but they are."
But the one thing we learned from the Lorena Bobbitt case is there's a great deal of resentment among women aimed at men.
With a view of women like this........
<Begin sarcasm> Tucker, do you even have a girlfriend? <End sarcasm>
I've heard he has a wife and two kids
CARLSON: I'm serious. Women are angry at men in a lot of ways. They don't say much about it, but they are.
I wonder how his wife feels about that comment. I wonder if he is projecting.
CARLSON: And she's pandering to that resentment and anger, and it's wrong.
I have yet to see an example of HRC pandering to womens resentment of men. The resentment and anger she is pandering (to all of us) is the resentment against corrupt and incompetent men. There is a difference.
Seems like all of the MEN of Republan SPEAK are all on the same talking points today. It is these REAL men who are spreading FEAR that a woman may be president or at least a nominee. It is these REAL MEN who are repeating something that no one else is hearing, that Sen. Clinton is looking for pity because the men are ganging up on her.
Really, has she said that. NO she hasn't . It are the REAL MEN of the Republan party that have interpreted this and have filled the airwaves with this latest HILLARY HATE assualt. Hell, look at men who have every right to question her..Edwards, Obama and compare them to the REAL MEN...Limbaugh(drug addict), O'Reilly(sexual harrasser) and Tucker, (a dolt). Who would you rather have on your side?
Men of the Republan Party, please do not fear this Senator from New York because she is not like Lorena Bobbit...Hillary will sterilze the Knife first.
"But the one thing we learned from the Lorena Bobbit caseis there's a great deal of resentment among women aimed at men."
Uhhh, Tucker...
Do you think it might have been the years of physical and sexual abuse that Lorena Bobbit's husband subjected her to that might account for at least some of her resentment towards him? You know...that it's not just a general resentment by women towards men? Just wondering...
Irony, are you contesting Tucker's study of Lorena Bobbit as a representative cross section of American women?
Seriously, does Tucky watch anything but his own show? Is he really completely unaware of his public image as a woman-fearing pansy?
"Seriously, does Tucky watch anything but his own show?"
HBL, I think Tucker watches Nancy Grace...and Desperate Housewives, of course.
No this has nothing to do with Carlson's lack of comfort with his masculinity. It is all about being totally willing to unreasonably attack Hillary Clinton even when doing so makes him sound like a person totally unsure of himself as a male. His attacks and snide remarks about Hillary are legend and non stop. Obviously he feels very inferior to debate her on the issues so he introduces all these straw issues even when it makes him sound wussy and so terrible.
I, was not a Hillary supporter. I has plans of voting for Obama but after the debate in Philly, and all the microscope coverage she receives, I'm not so sure. I may vote for her in protest! Each and every other candidate should receive the same microscope coverage that Hillary receives! With the exception of Obama, I doubt the rest can hack it.
I don't appreciate Tucker and the rest of the weasels dumping on Hillary. You have complained about her voice, speech, thighs and cleavage and her marriage you freaking little wimps. You got a beef with her on an ISSUE, SAY IT! It appears a woman with balls frightens the sh*t out of Tucker, which gives me more reason to vote for her!
For Obama and Edwards, your beef should be with the current administration not Hillary. Articulate what you're about! You want to show a difference, tell me what you have planned for this country. I don't particularly like Hillary but I DON'T appreciate the 'guys' dumping on Hillary. You are a Dem, act like a freaking Dem. You beef is with what we, as a country have endured for the last 6 years under Republicans! Tell me what you would do differently, don't tell me what Hillary has or has not said, I can figure that out all own my own! You keep this crap up, you will guarantee that she is elected!
These people are fishing.
Day after day, 24/7, 365, charges are leveled against HRC in hopes that something will eventually stick. Its reminding me of Starr and his fishing expedition.
If she gets through this process somebody ought to check her bloodlines and see if she's related to Ghandi or Mother Theresa.
I am so sick of Carlson I had to stop watching him. The anonymously sourced story about HRC listening to an illegal recording of a political opponent 15 years ago in combination with the cat story from 7 years ago finally made me do something more worthwhile with my time.
I haven't decided who I'm supporting but all these attacks on HRC have got me pretty pissed.
Man, I'll tell you, even reading about what Carlson is saying is painful.
He's just so f'ing stupid he's worse than cruel and unusual punishment.
Of all the stars in the political firmament he surely is the dimmest.
HEY MSNBC.
DO US ALL A FAVOR AND GET THIS MOFO OFF THE AIR.
HE ADDS NOTHING TO YOUR LINEUP AND YOU"RE LOSING VIEWERS BECAUSE OF HIM.
Johnny, I'm not sure what you're trying to say about Tucker...just open up and speak your mind. You don't have to mince words... ;>)
Right on!!!!
Pearlene, I will never get you upset.
P.S. What are you doing the next eight(8) years?
Perlene said;
I may vote for her in protest!
It appears a woman with balls frightens the sh*t out of Tucker, which gives me more reason to vote for her!
You keep this crap up, you will guarantee that she is elected!
You will not be the only one. This is what Tucker and other Neocons are moaning about. If they attack her too viciously, it may backfire.
I personally know of traditional republicans that will vote for HRC as a way to poke a stick into eye of the Neocon beast, to teach a lesson and to stop them from screwing the country even more. It's no big risk, she is more conservative than Goldwater was anyway.
What have conservative males done to offend women? That makes all of them scared of having a woman remove their ... umm. Man that just hurts thinking about it. But the GOP has a really "I Spit on Your Grave" fetish right now.
Why are Repub men afraid of women?
Jeez...that's an easy one. Take a look at Republican women. Lynne Cheney scares the sh*t out of me.
What have conservative males done to offend women?
Are you joking? Please name so much as a single issue involving women, where the conservative position, when contrasted with the progressive position, comes out more favorably for women. Social and Economic equality are branded as "liberal" and you even have to ask?
Or was this meant to be a joke?
This is beyond sexist. This is just downright...hm....sexophobic!
Carlson is putting words in people's mouth, "You're saying 'vote for her because she's a woman.'" Idiot.
"Why not take gender out of this and play fair?"
I think you're the one who accused someone of using the gender card in the first place, which brings up gender issues, Carlson.
I guarantee you that right now the republican strategists are polling focus groups to see how the "just voting for her because she's a woman" meme plays out among the middle-Homelanders.
Neon:
And you realize, of course, they're saving the "Hillary is a lesbian" smear campaign for the general election?
Dontcha just love politics? Makes you want to take a dozen showers a day...
...or watch a dozen lesbians shower, which actually polls pretty high in middle Homelandica.
Whoaaa, pardner...now you're getting into Billo territory. ;>)
Tucker, Rush, O'Reilly etc....They remind me of that series of commercials..they should have they're own commercial....
REAL MEN OF PENIS...I hear the background music right now.
Yeah, there's a lot of femenine anger aimed at men like Tucker Carlson.
How on earth does this nimrod get the idea that he speaks for MEN? He used to wear bow-ties for christ's sake! This is the kind of guy that used to get wedgies in the locker room! Tucker Carlson is a pansy! Nothing but posturing blowhard! He's a COAWRAD. He's not a "REAL MAN" and he sure as hell doesn't speak for REAL MEN. Men like him make "real men" look bad, gives us "real men" a bad name.
News Flash Tuck: REAL MEN TREAT WOMEN WITH RESPECT. REAL MEN ARE ONES THAT ACTUALLY MAKE WOMEN HAPPY. REAL MEN ARE SECURE IN THEIR MASCULINITY AND HAVE NOTHING TO FEAR FROM WOMEN! WE LIKE HAVING WOMEN IN OUR LIVES! (AND THAT MEANS ALL AREAS OF LIFE, NOT JUST THE KITCHEN AND THE BEDROOM!) YOU ARE NOT A REAL MAN!
(PS: I just noticed a bit of a homophobic undertone in that rant. Please don't interpret this as making any relavent statements about gays or lesbians. This is just about men, women and Tucker.)
(BUT... REAL MEN are afraid of gays & lesbians either!!!)
Sorry - "AREN'T afraid". Boy I really foxed that one up!
Sorry, Niceguy...but Lynne Cheney still scares the lving sh*t out of me. ;>)
LOL. Yeah, and teh Coulter scares me too. But despite a few notable excepions, I'll stand by my post. ;)
Why?
Why does she scare the $#it out of you?
Why?
Because she's mean as a snake.
Lynne Cheney would make a great ex-wife, the kind that would make you so happy to be rid of. ;>)
Well... that was a joke. I don't fear anyone. Not the person anyway.
What does scare me is the amount of media times she gets, and the resulting influence she has. That's scary.
(But considering the damage she does to the conservative image, it should scare republican's as well.)
"But the one thing we learned from the Lorena Bobbitt case is there's a great deal of resentment among women aimed at men."
Why would he bring up a case from 1993? Doesn't he have anything more recent to add?
I dunno...maybe Tucker's nanny used to secretly terrorize him when he was a small child by threatening to cut off his little wee-wee if he didn't behave. That might explain why he's so terrified of and bitter towards women...and it would also explain the Lorena Bobbitt reference.
I know the feeling...
Using Lorena Bobitt as a representative of american women is only slightly less ridiculous that useing Tucker as a representative of real men.
Plus the incident happened on Bill's watch. Maybe there a conspiracy somehwere...
So, that's it. We have come a long way down to this.
A woman in the white house will cause men to have their penis' removed.
A woman in the white house means women everywhere are resentful and angry at men.
A woman in the white house will be emotional and "bitchy"
.....and will find some way to castrate America.
Carlson attributed a "castrating" quality to Clinton, stating: "[T]here's just something about her that feels castrating, overbearing, and scary." Further, Carlson has repeatedly">[link to www.mediamatters.org] said of Clinton: "I cross my legs involuntarily every time she comes on the air."
What are you gonna do if she wins Carlson......fair warning, lol.....snip snip!
Makes you wonder if Carlson realizes how sicko his remarks make him look...and he is obviously a sick puppy.
OUCH, Lorelei.
Gentle as a butterfly
She moves without a sound?
Not Hardly....
Tucker has been the weenie poster boy for YEARS!!! How this wimp got on TV is a credit to family ties and influence vs hard work and intelligence - Christine Annaphour(SP?) on her worst day overwhelms Tuckers ENTIRE journalistic career . . .
This chump mouthpiece has brain damage from wearing that rediculious Bow Tie too tight too long . . . him and his frattette boys are hardly the measure of "REAL MEN" and I wouldn't be caught dead in a pair of Tucker Pink Underoos . . .
Long ago, his time slot was "time to change channels" . . .
It's an everyday event with Chris Matthews & Tucker Carlson to nit pick the hell out of something Hillary has done, said, worn or has no control over.
Tucker is on a daily rant about Hillary from Sox the cat to her and Bill's marriage and his favorite rant which involves Hillary staying up all night trying to plan out our meals. All manufactured B.S. lies!
Matthews on the other hand has consistently criticized Hillary's voice (which she has no control over) to her cleavage and now his favorite her cackle. Again, none of them subjects that affect the country, but it's fun picking on the lady!
I'm a 26 year old male who is far from being a feminist, but after the last debate and subsequent news coverage I've been swayed. At first I hated Hillary and wanted to back either Obama or Edwards either one. However, after watching the last debate and how they piled on to her with anger that should be directed to the Republican's I'm now a HRC supporter!
What is this clown talking about? He is a clown. He and all his conservative bunch of talking bobble heads started their assault on her femininity years before she officially decided to run for president. YEARS!Media Matters has it all archived. Now they are mad she's using it to her advantage, when men - white men specifically- have used their God given gender and race as stepping stone to be president since the first president. Do you really think our society would've accepted a female president in George Washington's day? How 'bout the slaves? I could see it now Nat Turner runs for president.
P.S. I said it before I'll say it again, clowns all of 'em.
Funny thing is, Lorena Bobbit is more of a man than Tucker Carlson.