Dobbs claimed as "fact" baseless assertion that half of Culinary Workers Union "are illegal aliens"; CNN's Crowley did not challenge
On the January 16 edition of CNN's Lou Dobbs Tonight, host Lou Dobbs noted that that the Culinary Workers Union Local 226, based in Nevada, "is encouraging its members to caucus on behalf of Senator [Barack] Obama [D-IL]" and then claimed: "[I]n point of fact, as many as half of the union's members are illegal aliens" [emphasis added]. Near the end of the segment, Dobbs referred to the "Culinary Workers Union, with just about half of its membership assumed to be illegal aliens" [emphasis added]. CNN senior political correspondent Candy Crowley, appearing on-air from Las Vegas, did not challenge either assertion. On-screen text during the segment read: "Many of Culinary Workers in Nevada are Illegal Aliens" and "Fears Illegal Aliens Could Influence Outcome of Vote."
Dobbs did not provide any support to back up his assertion regarding the makeup of the Culinary Workers Union. On March 23, 2007, the Associated Press reported that, according to the Union's then-political director, "about half" of the union's members are "immigrants":
An army of union cocktail waitresses, housekeepers and line cooks stands ready to throw its numbers and organizational abilities behind a presidential candidate.
But Democrats who hope to enlist the state's largest labor union to try to win Nevada's new early caucus must address issues important to the service workers who make Las Vegas glitter.
[...]
So it's no surprise that one of the candidates' first stops was at the Culinary offices.
Union leaders invited all eight Democratic candidates to address their members. Delaware Sen. Joseph Biden, Ohio Rep. Dennis Kucinich, former Alaska Sen. Mike Gravel and former vice presidential nominee John Edwards declined the invitation, citing scheduling conflicts, union Political Director Pilar Weiss said.
Weiss said the members, about half of whom are immigrants, have said they're most interested in candidates' positions on immigration and health care reform.
"We expect that the candidates will recognize that we have a service economy and they're talking to service workers," Weiss said.
So Dobbs' claim amounts to the assertion that all of the members of the Culinary Workers Union who are immigrants are, in Dobbs' words, "illegal aliens."
From the January 16 edition of CNN's Lou Dobbs Tonight:
DOBBS: Democratic presidential candidates tonight are stepping up their battle to win the Hispanic vote before Saturday's caucuses in Nevada. The powerful Culinary Workers Union is to play a critical role in that effort. The union is encouraging its members to caucus on behalf of Senator Obama -- but in point of fact, as many as half of the union's members are illegal aliens.
Candy Crowley reports now from Las Vegas. Candy, just how concerned is the Democratic Party, if at all, about possible irregularities -- shall we call them -- in those caucuses?
CROWLEY: Well, look, let me tell you what they say -- and this is a couple of officials -- about why they think is this not a problem, OK? They say, first of all, the idea that illegal immigrants who are trying to hide from the law are going to show up, sign an affidavit that they're a U.S. citizen and caucus, seems to, in the words of one, to be ridiculous.
They also say that given that, that they really don't see how a massive outpouring of illegals could change a caucus. They said there just won't be this massive outpouring, so there won't be a way to kind of change whatever the caucus decides. I will tell you that also we spoke to a PR guy for a couple of these hotels here, who didn't want to be named, but who said, "Look, these are multinational corporations here, these hotels. We don't hire illegals." I know I say that at my own peril, but I'm just telling you what they're saying at this point, Lou.
DOBBS: That is delightful. That is one of the better bald-face lies to emanate from any corner of this campaign so far; luckily it doesn't come from one of the candidates. But the very idea that, you know, that makes perfect sense what you're -- the Democratic folks -- Democratic Party folks said, because we know that these illegal aliens, for example, would never deign or dare to march in the streets of the United States, demanding rights of citizenship when they're here illegally.
We know they would never, for example, in any way, violate law with fraudulent documents or identity theft or take jobs with improper documentation. So, you're right. The nation's mind should be at ease on the issue of the integrity of these caucuses.
CROWLEY: Well, let me tell you another thing that really is interesting along the campaign trail. Our [senior political] producer, Sasha Johnson, points out that at one of these events with Hillary Clinton, somebody shouted out: "Do you have to be a U.S. citizen to caucus?" So these campaigns understand that there is in fact a language barrier and some confusion about how these Nevada caucuses actually work, so it's going to be a really interesting Saturday, let's just say that.
DOBBS: It should be an interesting Saturday. We're laughing about it here. But the reality is, this is serious business. We're talking about the integrity of our Democratic process, and it's an integrity that is not being preserved through the efforts and the concerns of many state governments or the electoral boards across the country.
It's a very difficult issue. So the Democratic Party, with all of the assuaging comments, what that really adds up to is they're taking no additional steps to assure that everyone who caucuses is legal and properly there within the caucus.
CROWLEY: Well, one of the things they want to -- they say they're going to do here, and particularly along the strip where they have these at-large caucuses where the culinary workers and others by the way will get a chance to go ahead and caucus -- they say, "Listen, they're going to have to show, first of all, an employee ID and they are going to have to sign that affidavit that says: 'Listen I'm a U.S. citizen. I am eligible to vote.' "
The Democratic Party says it will then check that against voter registration rolls, and then, if there's any discrepancies, they will refer it to the state. It's a felony to say that, but you do have to sort of step back and think, "OK, after this is all over and done, what's the incentive to actually take those names and match them up against the registration?" So, you know, they're the ones, you know, obviously, enforcing it, so we'll see how it comes out.
DOBBS: Indeed we will. The Culinary Workers Union, with just about half of its membership assumed to be illegal aliens there to begin with, supporting Senator Obama. That ought to be just -- I don't know why anyone would be concerned at all about this situation.
Candy, thank you, as always, for your excellent report. Candy Crowley, we appreciate it.

















Hmm. Is Dobbs right? Sure, he shouldn't assume without proof, but the only question here is the "illegal" status, since the union's president acknowledges half are "immigrants."
And nobody say "racist" because Dobbs didn't say of what country the immigrants come from, and there are just as many eastern European workers in the casinos as latino.
If Dobbs didn't have a well-documented history of explicitly racist language, I'd say you have a point there.
But since he does...you don't.
Yeah, what's 10-20 million people, nada, no big deal.
If we don't control our borders and know who is coming across, our soverignty is indeed in question.
Did I say that the sovereignty of our entire nation hangs on whether some folks south of the border come here legally or not? I don't see how you get that from what I wrote.
Notwithstanding, are you telling me having clearly defined borders, through which people should travel legally, is not an essential element to preserving a nation's sovereignty?
What I think is yes, we do need to have clearly defined borders, and I do think that people coming here need to do so legally. I also think that saying that those people who are coming here, the millions of them, are going to affect the soveireignty of our country is wrong. These are the people who then become part of our country, and they actually do integrate into our society, and become more or less, Americans (if they stay here). Most are hard working, family oriented, pay taxes (on fake social security numbers), and live good peaceful lives.
Sovereignty is defined as: Sovereignty is the exclusive right to exercise supreme political (e.g. legislative, judicial, and/or executive) authority over a geographic region, group of people, or oneself.
If these folks are illegal, can't vote, can't affect the outcome of elections, can't elect people to speak for them or fight for what they want, how are they going to affect the sovereignty of the United States again?
A smaller example would be Europe. There are open borders between most, if not ALL of the EU countries, and amazingly enough, each country still is its own sovereign. I know, slightly different, but still slightly similar. Bear in mind also that most of the illegals coming here are from a lower socio-economic class and that just adds into the lack of power that they have, since in the US, money is power. Being on the lower rung, there aren't too many folks who will speak for you, and not having power, or money, it's hard to do it for yourself.
this report discusses efforts to deter illegal entry to europe. "spain is buying boats, helicopters, night vision scopes, and heat seeking cameras to detect migrants crossing the nine mile strait of gibraltar..". the idea that it's only the united states that is attempting to enforce it's borders is wrong.
http://migration.ucdavis.edu/mn/more.php?id=3051_0_4_0
of the top ten countries last year who had the largest numbers of lawful permanent residents, all were either asian, latin american or caribbean. not one was european. number one was mexico, then china.
http://migrationinformation.org/USfocus/display.cfm?id=651
Well Tommy, when he says things like this to legal citizens, he doesn't really disprove that notion. Considering he's married to a hispanic wife you'd think he could be just a little more respectful. I'm married to a hispanic wife, mine makes sure I know what's considered proper and not when dealing with my hispanic elders, I'm pretty sure Dobbs wife does the same.
In an interview with Lesley Stahl, Dobbs spoke about his meeting with the Congressional Hispanic Caucus saying they implied that he was anti-Hispanic by asking him, "if I'd ever eaten a taco before, for God's sake".[17]
Pat Buchanan
Michele Malkin
Bill O'Reilly
John Gibson
Well hold on to your horsies, tommy! Didn't Buchannon and Gibson both say we need more white babies? ;)
Maybe not on record as against, but sure does suggest they want a color test!
Here's the one I was really looking for.
Buchanan "on record":
KING: If the border were secured and, through legal immigration, California became majority Hispanic, majority Latino. Texas became majority -- you've got a problem with that? If they came in through legal immigration?
BUCHANAN: Yes, I do. Yes, I do. If their -- because of the Mexican situation, Mexico has a claim on this country.ARRGH! The text gremlins are back.
hopefully this shows up legible:
BUCHANAN: Yes, I do. Yes, I do. If their -- because of the Mexican situation, Mexico has a claim on this country.
NOW the goal posts move.
Your original parameter was "in any way anti-legal immigration".
Tommy requested "proof that anyone who is calling for strict enforcement of our immigration laws is in any way anti-legal immigration"
All I'm doing is fulfilling his request, nothing more.
>>Buchanan's concern is that there is a large group of Mexican "separatists" residing in SWestern U.S., who believe that the southwestern part of this country still belongs to Mexico. Thus with the increasingly large influx of Mexican immigrants who hold dearly to this notion, Buchanan believes that in the future the southwestern United States will be indistinguishable from Mexico.
His thinking here is pure xenophobia paranoia, and I am diassapointed you would quote it as if it were somehow correct. Exactly how many "separatists" live in the Southwest US? I would be surprised if it were even 1/10 of the number of people who support the confederate cause.
I'm sure Buchananan been right on some issues, but you quote him as if he were an oracle, ignoring that he has been wrong on even more.
http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=2553
Virgil Goode
Mike Huckabee
He lumps them all together.
This proves my contention the true impetus behind the "illegal immigrant" movement is really an anti immigrant movement period.
arebeeo,
Aren't you just as guilty as Dobbs in making THAT assumption?
Those that complain about health risks? Make immigration easier, and put medical centers along the borders and at the ports - require medical certification for temporary residency, much like the checks from Ellis Island.
Those that complain about a drain on our system? Make immigration and legal documentation easier. Require migrant workers to pay into the tax system, or charge them employment fees for being non-residents/non-citizens during their employment here.
Those that complain about the declining birth rate of white people vs. non-white people? GTF over yourselves!
Dobbs could possibly be right. I been to Vegas several times a year for the past dozen years or so, and I don't think I've come across a hotel maid that spoke English.
What does speaking English have to do with ones legal status? I grew up around people that didn't speak English on a day to day basis and they were all US citizens. Neither of my grandparents can say more then a few phrases.
Stranger,
He could be right, but he could be wrong as well. I would hope that any pundit who makes such a strong and forceful statement would at least take the time and back up his statement with statistics. Union membership rolls would seem to be something that he could easily research (maybe not, I could be wrong), but for him to make that statement is irresponsible without the facts.
I am not saying he is wrong, but he could have done more to back up his assertion.
Not to mention, I believe to work in Vegas, you have to get fingerprinted, and register with the city and get a worker's card, or ID, or something like that. Someone tell me if I'm wrong.
And, if they are illegal immigrants; how are they going to vote and affect the outcome of the election, or the caucus? Last time I knew, you had to be registered to vote and or caucus. Seems as though, if they were illegal, Dobbs has nothing to worry about.
To Stranger, because people don't speak English around you, doesn't mean they don't know how the speak English. For example, I'm a typical white male. I know how to speak Japanese. I have been to Japan on several occasions, and when people around me are insulting me in Japanese, thinking I don't know how to speak it, I can surprise them with something in their own language that makes them embaressed for what they said. Just because there are people around you speaking a different language doesn't mean they don't know how to speak English, to even think so would be ignorant. Oh wait, look who I'm addressing.
Look, the facts are that those who claim to be motivated by some desire to help illegal immigrants, and rationalize attacking any discussion about the problems caused by illegal immigration, the open borders lobby, and the corporate elites, like the US Chamber of Commerce, the Business Round Table, are being dishonest. The corporate and business interests who are forking over untold millions of dollars to La Raza, MALDEF and LULAC do so because they hope to destroy American wage standards and workplace and environmental protections. The US Chamber of Commerce and Business Roundtable are historical enemies of workers.
They are seeking to exploit poverty in the third world to increase corporate profits. Illegal immigrants should be in their home countries working with others there to demand higher wages and opportunities. Instead they are being courted to come and stay here, and some in the government rationalize subsidizing the low wages they receive when they undermine American citizen workers, who are black, brown and white. Mr. Brock might have had an ephinany when it came to his own rights and freedoms, but it seems that he is as willing to be indifferent to American citizens suffering with long term un and underemployment because of outsourcing and the importation of illegal immigrant workers. In this he is as tied to the right wing corporate elite as he was when he worked for the other side.
The fact is that the SEIU and the CUlinary Workers Union (which is tied to the SEIU) is corrupt, they are a top down union, that sides with corporate interests. The union in Nevada has been brow beating and intimidating workers to force them to vote their way, or not have the right to vote at all.
Lou Dobbs has spoken the truth, of course the union won't admit that their workers include a high number of illegals, it's illegal for them to do so. But the truth is that 50% or higher of their workers are illegal immigrants. To state that does not mean one is anti-immigrant, Dobbs' wife is Mexican American, as are his children. Harvard participated in a study that was released in December that proved we never had a worker shortage, it was a lie to discriminate against American citizen workers.
Whaaaaaaaaaat??? HALF? HALF?
Ummmmm, I think he meant to say close to 1/3....Theres a lot of beaners in that Union and if you think theyre all Legal, youd just about believe anything
Dobbs is phony populist. He blaims economic refugees for the sins of corporate elites who deny workers their right to share in the wealth they create.
Dobbs is phony populist. He blaims economic refugees for the sins of corporate elites who deny workers their right to share in the wealth they create.
Maybe I am wrong about him, but crap like this thread is good enough reason to doubt his bs.
In his extended interview on Democracy Now he did not comport himself well. It was shown in that interview over and over again that he has sourced outright falsehoods from white power websites. Ultimtely he simply dismissed the evidence by saying his interviewer was essentially a partisan hack.
Dobbs can kiss my a**.
http://www.democracynow.org/shows/2007/12/4
Truly you are an ignorant fool. I didnt' dismiss the website provided by Roundhouse. Read what I wrote. I looked up the site but want to listen to the interview before typing any response. Don't misrepresent me.
Much of your asinine rant has nothing to do with the problem of ILLEGAL immigration, and is barely comprehensible in any event. And as for your bullsh*t racism assertions, if you're too dumb to realize that people can seek the same goal but for dramatically different reasons, that's your ignorance, not mine.
Dobbs claim is not "baseless." And is almost certainly substantially true.
I do not see the point of challenging likely true statements, just because we don't like them or think they are harmful. It makes MM look silly and non-objective.