USA Today's Page on McCain's Al Qaeda-Iran falsehood: "[M]ost Americans can't tell you the difference between Sunnis and Shiites, either"
SUMMARY: On Hardball, USA Today Washington bureau chief Susan Page asserted of John McCain's admittedly false claim that "[i]t's common knowledge and has been reported in the media that Al Qaeda is going back into Iran and is receiving training and are coming back into Iraq from Iran": "I think it's a verbal error. And, you know, most Americans can't tell you the difference between Sunnis and Shiites, either."
During the March 20 edition of MSNBC's Hardball, while discussing Sen. John McCain's admittedly false claim on March 18 that "[i]t's common knowledge and has been reported in the media that Al Qaeda is going back into Iran and is receiving training and are coming back into Iraq from Iran," MSNBC senior campaign correspondent Tucker Carlson asserted, "This is ridiculous. He misspoke." After host Chris Matthews asked, "Did he do it on purpose? Did he conflate on purpose, like the terrorists with 9-11 and Iraq?" USA Today Washington bureau chief Susan Page asserted, "I think it's a verbal error. And, you know, most Americans can't tell you the difference between Sunnis and Shiites, either." Matthews responded, "Well, they're not leading the campaign for war either." Carlson's and Page's characterization of events followed a pattern -- documented by Media Matters for America -- of media figures echoing the McCain campaign's assertion that he simply "misspoke" without noting that McCain made the misstatement twice during the press conference and also to nationally syndicated radio host Hugh Hewitt during a March 17 interview.
Media Matters documented that several MSNBC journalists and anchors, like Carlson, have dismissed McCain's gaffe. By contrast, on the March 19 edition of MSNBC's Countdown with Keith Olbermann, Newsweek's Jonathan Alter stated of McCain that "[h]e has gotten a lot of breaks over the years for being imprecise from the press." Additionally, during the March 19 edition of MSNBC Live, after airing a condensed clip of McCain's misstatement, NBC News political director Chuck Todd asserted: "[T]his was not a onetime slip and so, you know, this just shows you how much bank -- how much of the foreign policy experience stuff he's got in the bank, because had [Sen. Hillary] Clinton or [Sen. Barack] Obama done something like this, this would have been played on a loop, over and over, and would have absolutely hurt them politically."
From the March 20 edition of MSNBC's Hardball with Chris Matthews:
MATTHEWS: Let me ask you this question: Did John McCain boot it by not really being clear about who our guys and women are fighting and dying for to fight over there?
E. STEVEN COLLINS (radio talk show host): You know, Chris, it's so interesting to me to see him stand there and have to have a United States senator in Lieberman remind him that it's the Shiites, and to just see him not know that at this critical stage in the campaign, because the whole Middle East trip was really about him showing to be presidential. I mean, you look at that and you say, this looked great, and he doesn't know what is essentially an important fact about that part of the Middle East.
MATTHEWS: You're wincing?
CARLSON: Well, look, I've spent a lot of time with McCain talking about foreign policy. I don't agree with McCain's foreign policy, by and large. I don't. I think it's utopian. But the guy knows a lot. This is ridiculous. He misspoke.
MATTHEWS: OK. Second alternative. Second assessment. Did he do it on purpose? Did he conflate on purpose, like the terrorists with 9-11 and Iraq? Did he purposely say we're facing a threat --
PAGE: No, no.
CARLSON: Boy, no. I actually don't give McCain credit for that level of guile. I just don't -- I don't think that's him.
MATTHEWS: So it's a verbal error, that's all?
CARLSON: Absolutely.
PAGE: I think it's a verbal error. And, you know, most Americans can't tell you the difference between Sunnis and Shiites, either, so I'm not sure --
MATTHEWS: Well, they're not leading the campaign for war either.
PAGE: True. But there's no question he actually knows a lot about this area, and I think, you know, he travels a lot, he campaigns --
COLLINS: Yeah, but he made this mistake more than once.
MATTHEWS: I don't know how you can say that Al Qaeda is being trained in Iran. Go ahead, E. Steven.
COLLINS: No, no, no. He made this mistake more than once. And I don't know. It's like, first of all, fundamentally, I'm curious as to how he can be so sure that most of America wants us to remain for 10 or 20 or 100 years in Iraq, and run on that, and to be to so close to the Bush administration. It's amazing to me.
Not only that, but as Matthews said, "Well, they're not leading the campaign for war either."
Matthews can be a real putz, of course, but he deserves some credit for not allowing Page to completely get away with excusing McCain's ignorance.
"most Americans can't tell you the difference between Sunnis and Shiites, either..."
Which I guess is supposed to mean that John McCain is as unqualified as most Americans to be President of the United States, for want of the brains or the desire to look into the matter, and find these things out...
Most Americans hold full-time jobs that don't afford them the time to research these things, and undertand them completely (and LORD knows they get no help from their televisions in this regard)...
John McCain though, is a U.S. Senator who can avail himself to almost any information on any matter of the Federal Government (on the whole U.S. of A. really!)... he has a staff of people at his command also... Diplomats and even Military Commanders come regularly to the Senate, to brief John McCain and to answer whatever questions he has, in person, or if his inquries require time and effort to satisfy, then in writing too...
"most Americans can't tell you the difference between Sunnis and Shiites, either..."
...yet John McCain is a U.S. Senator, imagining himself as qualified to be our President.
ELECT JOHN MCCAIN, THE AMERICAN EVERYMAN!
...he's just as unqualified as you are, to be President!
Well, one thing for sure is that a little over one year ago:
1) Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high;
2) Regular gasoline sold for $2.19 a gallon;
3) the unemployment rate was 4.5%.
Since voting in a Democratic Congress in 2006 we've seen:
1) Consumer confidence plummet;
2) the cost of regular gasoline soar to over $3 a gallon;
3) Unemployment is up to 5% (a 10% increase);
4) American households have seen $2.3 trillion in equity value evaporate
(stock and mutual fund losses);
5) Americans have seen their home equity drop by $1.2 trillion dollars;
6) 1% of American homes are in foreclosure.
America's liberal dummycraps voted for change in 2006, and we got it!
Now if we could just elect Obama so he can stir up the pre-civil rights racial tensions in our country along with the obligatory tax increases, the lib-bozos will be in seventh heaven -- even the atheists amongst them.
Here's a STUUUUUPID question (nod to Madam Schlong and her favorite word...): Whatever became of Obama's former public persona wherein he was simply an agerage American citizen running for president... who just HAPPENED to be black? That disappeared and has been replaced with Obama the race-baiter whose latest campaign strategic vision is convincing us white folk that the anti-white racist rants are quite common among black pastors and Wright's racist views are quite common among blacks in America. Furthermore, Obama's assersion are foriegn and "shocking" to whities, which, according to Obama, is evidence of the rampant RACISM that still exists in our country. All of the sudden Obama's campaign IS about race. Oh yea, he has now twice publicly dissed his "white" grandmother, who is typical of white people in America -- this of course due to the fact that she once confided to her grandson her discomfort at once being approached by a carload of black kids.
The black liberal radio commentators I listen to are now raging on and on about the 500 years of constant oppression that black "brothers and sisters" have been forced to live under here in America, all the while recanting stories (most admittedly made-up) about slaves, as well as lynchings, hangings, Jim Crow laws, the KKK, etc. And their assessment of WHITE people who just don't understand the "black experience" and the "legacy of slavery". Obama 2008 - The campaign of race!
Ok, Fact,
Since you are into facts, please tell us what reforms the Dems have passed that have led to the situation we as Americans find ourselves in. How many times has the Republican minority blocked discussions on relevant bills?
In your opinion, what role have the Dems played?
Friedberg, I know how persistent you are, but I have a feeling these are some more of those questions you might post 10 or 20 times without any answers.
This meathead is even buying into the Rush spin that Obama has made his campaign about race, not the wingnuts screeching about his scary pastor.I'll bet you dollars to Corn Nuts * he's sure that Hillary's camp got the Rev. Wright videos played on the teevee all day.
*modified to reflect prohibitive cost of Doughnuts
Col.,
I'm sure you're right. He probably also thinks that the Reagan tax cuts caused the great economy under Clinton too. I am sensing potential disconnect.
I notice none of you reply with comparable facts. I notice each reply is a baited statement that has nothing to do with facts that were shown. Are you all unprepared to reply with facts?? Or, are you embarrassed to reply with facts?? IMHO, those facts that are just over a year old were accomplished in spite of the democratic 'stall mentality'. Then, when the democrats took power showed exactly what they are able to achieve when they are in control. Remember, the democrats have control of both the House AND Senate, yet you blame the minority replubicans for not getting the job done. Hypocrits
PHILIB and UNFACTUAL,
By implying that all the troubles of this country are the Dems fault since they had minority status the first six years of Bush's term and now have majority yes, but not veto proof majority tells us all here at MMFA that you have nothing new to bring to the table.....
The damage was done long before the Dems took control and will take more than what they have now to fix it!
With all the war profiteering, scare tactics, loss of liberty going on by these corrupt thugs don't you think that your anger should be toward those that created it in the first place? The Bush/Cheney regime!! Or is that to much to ask of you two?
Although....since I get the feeling that no matter what 'facts' I led you two too, you will claim it to be liberal nonsense or worthless because it speaks some volume of truth about the Bush/Cheney regime.....
So why should we even bother with you at all? Why do you two even bother coming here if all you do is repeat the partisan crap coming from FOX Noise or Rush..... come to think of it..... why don't you go and waste your time over at COPIOUSDISSENT's little blog...... you'd feel more at home there!
PHILIB and UNFACTUAL,
By implying that all the troubles of this country are the Dems fault since they had minority status the first six years of Bush's term and now have majority yes, but not veto proof majority tells us all here at MMFA that you have nothing new to bring to the table.....
The damage was done long before the Dems took control and will take more than what they have now to fix it!
With all the war profiteering, scare tactics, loss of liberty going on by these corrupt thugs don't you think that your anger should be toward those that created it in the first place? The Bush/Cheney regime!! Or is that to much to ask of you two?
Although....since I get the feeling that no matter what 'facts' I led you two too, you will claim it to be liberal nonsense or worthless because it speaks some volume of truth about the Bush/Cheney regime.....
So why should we even bother with you at all? Why do you two even bother coming here if all you do is repeat the partisan crap coming from FOX Noise or Rush..... come to think of it..... why don't you go and waste your time over at COPIOUSDISSENT's little blog...... you'd feel more at home there!
PHILIB and UNFACTUAL,
By implying that all the troubles of this country are the Dems fault since they had minority status the first six years of Bush's term and now have majority yes, but not veto proof majority tells us all here at MMFA that you have nothing new to bring to the table.....
The damage was done long before the Dems took control and will take more than what they have now to fix it!
With all the war profiteering, scare tactics, loss of liberty going on by these corrupt thugs don't you think that your anger should be toward those that created it in the first place? The Bush/Cheney regime!! Or is that to much to ask of you two?
Although....since I get the feeling that no matter what 'facts' I led you two too, you will claim it to be liberal nonsense or worthless because it speaks some volume of truth about the Bush/Cheney regime.....
So why should we even bother with you at all? Why do you two even bother coming here if all you do is repeat the partisan crap coming from FOX Noise or Rush..... come to think of it..... why don't you go and waste your time over at COPIOUSDISSENT's little blog...... you'd feel more at home there!
PHILIB and UNFACTUAL,
By implying that all the troubles of this country are the Dems fault since they had minority status the first six years of Bush's term and now have majority yes, but not veto proof majority tells us all here at MMFA that you have nothing new to bring to the table.....
The damage was done long before the Dems took control and will take more than what they have now to fix it!
With all the war profiteering, scare tactics, loss of liberty going on by these corrupt thugs don't you think that your anger should be toward those that created it in the first place? The Bush/Cheney regime!! Or is that to much to ask of you two?
Although....since I get the feeling that no matter what 'facts' I led you two too, you will claim it to be liberal nonsense or worthless because it speaks some volume of truth about the Bush/Cheney regime.....
So why should we even bother with you at all? Why do you two even bother coming here if all you do is repeat the partisan crap coming from FOX Noise or Rush..... come to think of it..... why don't you go and waste your time over at COPIOUSDISSENT's little blog...... you'd feel more at home there!
"Although....since I get the feeling that no matter what 'facts' I led you two too, you will claim it to be liberal nonsense or worthless because it speaks some volume of truth about the Bush/Cheney regime....."
You get the "feeling" but you don't offer any. Take your feeling back over to your computer and find some of those so-called facts you brag about. Just because you don't "feel" like responding you think that makes the facts disappear? Very liberal way of thinking. Is that how it goes in your liberal arts class? If you ignore it long enough it will go away? Then you have the gall to say I should not even be allowed to provide another point of view, here. Is that another tactic learned in your liberal arts class?? To force alternative viewpoints out of class till everyone agrees with your own? I wonder how a conservative arts class would be dealt with if they did the same to liberal points of view. Hypocrit!
Ok..... fine..... I'll take my chances with you......
Here, here, and here
Although these may not be exactly what you ask for, it does give some credence to what I have said...... Although I mostly found only right-wing opinions that exacerbate the myth that the Dems are to blame for the dying economy..... perhaps this alone is fact enough to back what I have said?
I do have to ask unFACTual..... where did those 'facts' come from that you copied and pasted?
Maybe the same way that the economy soared for 8 years during the Clinton administration because of a 2yr Democrat majority and most definitly not because of 6 years of a Republican majority. *sarcasm*
Philib, your "facts" are pretty sketchy, and just because you think they haven't been addressed doesn't mean it's true.But just for laughs, let's look at this one you've unquestiningly swallowed;
"Well, one thing for sure is that a little over one year ago:
1) Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high"
So, even if we handicap you, and accept your undocumented "fact", all it says is that consumer confidence was worse 3 1/2 years into Bush's presidency than 6 years into it. This might spell success to you, because that's what you want it to say. What do you think this "fact" tells you?
Taking Philib's comments seriously is like arguing with a psychotic patient in a mental institution who insists that the sky is actually green.
Channeling Chandler Bing...
Can you bee any more off topic?
And wrong?
Re: Facty's comment
This i
Well apparently <space bar> means click the 'post' button now, oh well.
My comment was supposed to be: "this is your brain on Fox News"
The lenders have had a lot of fun and profit selling sub-prime loans to people who could have afforded standard mortgages. This is the reason the economy is sinking. It has nothing to do with the 2006 elections.
Next time you need some facts, try another rectum.
Well, one thing for sure is that a little over one year ago:
Fact_Loser, perhaps you should make your comparison with the way things were about seven years ago, before we voted a Republican incompetent and his puppetmaster to the Presidency and Vice-Presidency.
Leave it to the losers to blame the results of years of Republican incompetence and outright looting of everything in the country that wasn't nailed down on those who are just now getting a chance to reclaim some of the stolen goods.
FACT_FINDER wrat:
>>1) Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high;
>>2) Regular gasoline sold for $2.19 a gallon;
>>3) the unemployment rate was 4.5%.
>> [ect.]
As Friebergboy pointed out, these changes didn't result because of Democratic policies. But I will add that you are really picking a convenient point in time. What was the consumer confidence like *before* Bush took office? What was the cost of gasoline *before* Bush took office? And, what how many jobs has Bush created in comparison to Clinton? In addition, how great was our debt before Bush took office, how many trillions of dollars did Bush waste compared to Clinton waging a war against a country that was no threat to the US, how many US citizens died because of terrorists attacks on US soil under Clinton, and how many died under Bush?
1) Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high ... 1) Consumer confidence plummet
2 1/2 years isn't very long. In addition, the factors that affect consumer confidence take longer than 14 months (the time the Democrats have narrowly controlled Congress) to take affect. Still, if we want facts, let's look at this consumer confidence chart. Notice the monumental plunges that took place when the Republicans controlled all the branches of government. That 2 1/2 year high that you so laughably bragged about was a mild peak in a largely flat levels that go back years.
2) Regular gasoline sold for $2.19 a gallon ... 2) the cost of regular gasoline soar to over $3 a gallon
This can be directly traced to international factores and the long-term policies of the current administration, endorsed and enacted by the preceding Republican-controlled Congress.
3) the unemployment rate was 4.5% ... 3) Unemployment is up to 5% (a 10% increase)
The economic conditions that produce increases in unemployment rates. Regardless, during the entire time that WPE Bush has been in office, most of it with a Republican congressional majority, the unemployment rates have been higher than they were for the couple of years before he took office.
4) American households have seen $2.3 trillion in equity value evaporate
(stock and mutual fund losses) ... 5) Americans have seen their home equity drop by $1.2 trillion dollars ... 6) 1% of American homes are in foreclosure
The factors that caused all of those took a lot more than 14 months to occur. You can find predictions of the housing crash going back years.
Basically, you threw out a bunch of isolated facts tried to link them to the narrow Democratic majority with no suggestion of cause and effect. You really ought to investigate the concept of logical fallacies, particularly post hoc, ergo propter hoc.
It could help you avoid making such stupid things in the future.
Which I guess is supposed to mean that John McCain is as unqualified as most Americans to be President of the United States, for want of the brains or the desire to look into the matter, and find these things out...
I thought it had been established that Americans vote for the people with whom they would most want to have a beer.
Jon Stewart's Crossfire appearance from 3 years ago:
STEWART: Now, this is theater. It's obvious. How old are you?
CARLSON: Thirty-five.
STEWART: And you wear a bow tie.
[...]
STEWART: Now, listen, I'm not suggesting that you're not a smart guy, because those are not easy to tie.
Yep, those Shia and Sunnis are like, sooo indistinguishable. Much like like the hacks sprinkled across the media landscape...
Well, I've always liked McCain, but I'm not voting for him.
- The "Sunnis", followers of Abu, the majority, with 800 million Muslims.
- The "Shiites", followers of Ali, with 100 million Muslims (Iran, Iraq, Palestine).
I'm a pretty average american. 50 years old, some college, no degree, high tech middle class job and I damn well know the difference between the Sunni and the Shiite factions fighting in Iraq and who is backing each side in the pull for power over the vast oil fields. It's not rocket science and if McCain is truly as ignorant as he appears, he is NOT even as qualified to be president as the bush bot.
That McCain made this trip so unprepared -- probably figuring no one would ask him any real questions because of the barbeque -- well, it's just astonishing. And what's up with his main adviser being Holy Joe?
It's 3:00 a.m. and the red phone rings. Who you want to answer that phone; do we want John McCan'tremember on the receiving end? My perception is that he has not looked too presidential on his presidential image building tour.
Al Qaida is also planting medical misrepresentation of its chemical-Ali weapon of mass destruction in North America...right on the front page of the New York Times. Under the Geneva Protocols it is classed as Double Treachery, black propaganda to not only trick the American public into abandoning live saving anti-viral vaccinations, but lull them into a superstition fluoridated public drinking water is perfectly safe, while they drink that and expect no increased risk of their kids turning out autistic.
http://www.geocities.com/writingindependence/CMJCT3-22-08.pdf
It's simply amazing what you can find on the internet.
According to recent reports received by Western intelligence agencies, the Iranians are training senior al-Qa'eda operatives in Teheran to take over the organisation when bin Laden is no longer leader.
(Scroll-over for translation) Der Autor dieses Artikels konnte eine Liste der Killer Gottes, die in Iran einen sicheren Hort gefunden haben, einsehen. Die Liste liest sich wie das Who’s Who des globalen Dschihads. Knapp 25 hochrangige Führungskader von Al Qaida – Planer, Organisatoren und Ideologen des Dschihads aus Ägypten, Usbekistan, Saudi-Arabien, Nordafrika sowie aus Europa. Ganz oben in der Al-Qaida-Hierachie: drei der Söhne von Osama bin Laden, Saeed, Mohammad und Othman.
A former commander of a group that has at times aligned with Al Qaeda in Iraq, the Islamic Army of Iraq, Abu Azzam al Tamimi, told Al Arabiya television on January 18, 2008, that Iran "interferes in every aspect in Iraq." When asked whom Iran supports, Mr. al Tamimi said, "Everybody — it works with the government, with the opponents of the government, with the opponents of the government's opponents, with Al-Qaeda, with the enemies of Al-Qaeda, with the militias, with the enemies of the militias ... Iran spreads its investments everywhere – with the Shiites, the Sunnis, and the Kurds," according to a translation by the Middle East Media Research Institute.
U.S. military and intelligence officials tell ABC News that they have caught shipments of deadly new bombs at the Iran-Iraq border...What the United States says links them to Iran are tell-tale manufacturing signatures -- certain types of machine-shop welds and material indicating they are built by the same bomb factory. "The signature is the same because they are exactly the same in production," says explosives expert Kevin Barry. "So it's the same make and model."
They're blue...click'em! ;-)
Or maybe you need to turn off your pop-up blocker.
Because it aligns with my other sources. If an animal looks like a horse, sounds like a horse, and then it walks up to you and says "I'm a horse," you can pretty well asume that it is a horse, because you heard it, "right from the horse's mouth" Of course everything should be taken with a grain of salt but the burden of proof for "there are definitively no X's in region Y" is much greater than "there definitively is an X in region Y" because all you need is one solid piece of evidence for the latter.
Here is the transcript of the interview if you wish to read it: http://www.memritv.org/clip_transcript/en/1675.htm
Also: http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=070625232254.etwt6z5u&show_article=1
Yes Iran has an interest in its nieghboors. This is proof of a link between AQ and Iran? Dosen't sell me. But then I don't desperately need to have the idea pushed.
Because it aligns with my other sources. If an animal looks like a horse, sounds like a horse, and then it walks up to you and says "I'm a horse," you can pretty well asume that it is a horse, because you heard it, "right from the horse's mouth"
No. I think you're willing to believe anything bad about Iran even when you don't have facts to back it up. What evidence did the guy present to back his claims?
No, sir, I have clearly made the connections.
- Iran historically has been connected to terror, being a founder and current financier of Hezbollah and other terrorist groups.
- Iran has been caught with their hand in the cookie jar, so to speak. They have sent troops into Iraq, more troops, funds and sent them weapons.
- NOT ONLY American, British, German, and European but also terrorist sources have revealed that Iran has made itself a safe-haven and training ground for terrorists. This list includes three of Osama's sons and (now dead) al Qa'ede #2, al Zawahiri, who was allowed access to Iranian military training grounds.
- Freedom in Iraq is Iran's worst fear. Like the wildfire of revolution that spread through Hispanic America after the American Revolution, freedom in Iraq would certainly spell-out certain doom for the oppressive Iranian regime, which is already in a atmosphere of political unrest.
I think you're willing to believe anything bad about Iran even when you don't have facts to back it up. What evidence did the guy present to back his claims? What do you want? A polaroid of Osama and Ahmadinejad holding hands, straddling the Iraq/Iran border? Unfortunately the International Intelligence Service of the Republic of Antarctica was unavailable for comment at the time of this post, so you will have to settle on my word, plus my American, British, German, Iraqi, and Iranian cited sources as the most unbiased and neutral evidence.Joseph
and...
The Democrats are going to lose (read that end) the war in Iraq - a war the republicans started and, as usual, didn't have the guts to finish for fear of looking bad!
Republicans...didn't have the guts to finish [the war in Iraq] for fear of looking bad!
What the deuce is that supposed to mean? I didn't win the soccer game for fear of looking bad?