G. Gordon Liddy smeared undocumented Mexican immigrants, claiming they "want to reconquer America, they say"
SUMMARY: On his radio show, G. Gordon Liddy claimed that undocumented immigrants from Mexico come to the United States and "want to fly the Mexican flag" and "want to speak Spanish" instead of learning English. Liddy then stated: "They want to reconquer America, they say."
During the June 5 broadcast of his nationally syndicated radio show, G. Gordon Liddy claimed that undocumented immigrants from Mexico come to the United States and "want to fly the Mexican flag" and "want to speak Spanish" instead of learning English. Liddy then stated: "They want to reconquer America, they say."
Discussing immigration with a caller, Liddy asserted: "[T]he problem that I have is with people who come over here and instead of wanting to become Americans, you know, fly the American flag, learn English, and so forth, they want to fly the Mexican flag, they want to speak Spanish, you know, and other varieties of illegal alien. And that's -- that is what distinguishes these people from the previous immigrants." He continued: "Previous immigrants said, 'Man, we can't wait to get out of' -- you know, whatever the country was they came from. 'We can't wait to get to the United States. We want to be Americans, we want to learn English, and, we want, you know, the best for our children,' and what have you. And they proudly displayed the American flag." Liddy added: "Not so, especially these illegal aliens up from Mexico and what have you. They want to reconquer America, they say. They have this outfit called the Reconconquista [sic] or something of that sort, whatever it is in illegal alien."
Media Matters for America has repeatedly documented instances of conservative commentators, including columnist Michelle Malkin and MSNBC political analyst Pat Buchanan, claiming that immigrants subscribe to a "reconquista" philosophy aimed at recapturing the Southwestern United States for Mexico. "Reconquista" is a term associated with El Plan Espiritual de Aztlán, a document drafted in the early formation of the Movimiento Estudiantil Chicano de Aztlán (Chicano Student Movement of Aztlán, or MEChA), a group with affiliates at numerous college campuses and several high schools that "promotes higher education, cultura, and historia."
In a July 15, 2006, article, Los Angeles Times reporter David Kelly wrote of El Plan Espiritual de Aztlán:
MEChA leaders say it is a historical document from a more radical time distorted by critics who focus on a few lines while missing the broader picture.
"When did we say we wanted a separate nation? We never did," said Graciela Larios, who recently retired as head of the UC Riverside MEChA club. "We know about the spiritual plan for Aztlan. It reflects the time it was written in. We are not ashamed of it. We stand by it."
From the June 5 broadcast of Radio America's The G. Gordon Liddy Show:
CALLER: I thought at one time that for immigrants, we -- they were required to have a sponsor, and --
LIDDY: Yes, they -- a sponsor. What that meant was, someone who would be responsible for a place for them to stay, you know, housing, and a job. So that the whole idea was that they would not become a -- what was called a "public charge" -- you know, would be on welfare or anything like that. They would come here, they would have somebody who would sponsor them, they'd have a job, and they'd have a place to stay.
CALLER: Well, I believe that could be enlarged upon and -- so that we wouldn't be put upon by these people that come here and want to raise heck about America. I'm a proud American, and I believe that those of us that are citizens have a right to complain about things that we find grievous, but if you're a newbie coming to America, you need to want to be America -- an American and love America, not come over here and raise dickens and be protesting and all that business. Because you don't have the right to do that. It may say so, but if it does, that needs to be changed, because that's just not right.
LIDDY: Well, now, America's a free country. And everyone who is here legally has the protections of the Constitution, and one of them is the right to gather together peacefully to petition government, you know, with respect to any grievance that you might have. Now, I don't have any problem with that. What I have -- the problem --
[crosstalk]
LIDDY: Now, wait a minute. Now, the problem that I have is with people who come over here and instead of wanting to become Americans, you know, fly the American flag, learn English, and so forth, they want to fly the Mexican flag, they want to speak Spanish, you know, and other varieties of illegal alien. And that's -- that is what distinguishes these people from the previous immigrants. Previous immigrants said, "Man, we can't wait to get out of" -- you know, whatever the country was they came from. "We can't wait to get to the United States. We want to be Americans, we want to learn English, and, we want, you know, the best for our children," and what have you. And they proudly displayed the American flag. Not so, especially these illegal aliens up from Mexico and what have you. They want to reconquer America, they say. They have this outfit called the Reconconquista [sic] or something of that sort, whatever it is in illegal alien.
CALLER: La Raza.
LIDDY: Yeah, well, La Raza, that's another outfit. That's called "the race," that's what that means.
CALLER: You made my point very well, probably much better than I could. But that is exactly what I'm talking about. If you want to come here and love America like we do, that's all great. If you don't, stay home.
LIDDY: Well, yes. And we're talking about legal immigration. We're not talking about the illegals, either.
Why did they ever let this creep out of prison?
So he could explain these simple truths to people like you!
google: "reconquista, mexico"
yields: "Results 11 - 20 of about 1,250,000 for reconquista, mexico. (0.14 seconds)" For being a non-issue, it has a lot of hits.
I like this link, which contains this: "Is Mexico reconquering Aztlan?" right in the page header. If they have to ask the question before all else, there can be no doubt about what the truthful answer is.
Then there is this search: "La Raza"
It yields these results: Results 1 - 10 of about 4,410,000 for La Raza [definition]. (0.17 seconds)
From the first two hits: This is what La Raza claims they are. Notice that nowhere on this page is a mission statement, a strange omission for an "benign" organization?
This is what some others say about La Raza. It does ascribe a mission statement to La Raza: "MEChA is an Hispanic separatist organization that encourages anti-American activities and civil disobedience. The radical members of MEChA who refer to themselves as "Mechistas," romanticize Mexican claims to the "lost Territories" of the Southwestern United States -- a Chicano country called Aztlan. In its national constitution, MEChA calls for self-determination by its members to liberate Aztlan. MEChA's national constitution starts out: "Chicano and Chicana students of Aztlán must take upon themselves the responsibilities to promote Chicanismo within the community, politicizing our Raza with an emphasis on indigenous consciousness to continue the struggle for the self-determination of the Chicano people for the purpose of liberating Aztlán.""
Personally, I hold a negative view of any organization that calls itself, "The Race". This is only one step from, "The Master race" and no different than what any other racial supremacists have had to say over the centuries.
If they have to ask the question before all else, there can be no doubt about what the truthful answer is. (NL###)
I'm not sure if I'm following your "logic". If some text begins with a question, the answer is somehow obvious? Sorry, I didn't read anything beyond that. Try to make sense.
You bring up my point and that is it's mostly radical Latino activitist groups that are the fanning the flames of the notion that this is some kind of invasion/revolution to take back what they feel they lost to the formation of the United States.
And it's inflammatory hogwash based on misdirected Mexican nationalism from the radical fringe, with the clandestine help of the Mexican government.
There was a typically aggressive American land grab-war involved and the Mexican Army lost. There is no soveriegn right involved over Arizona, California and New Mexico. And, as we've clearly demonstrated in the Middle East, when it come to military action, "we all crazy up in here!" Keep your distance, if you know what's good for you.
I don't think that the every-day, come to Amercia, have kids and keep a job-Latino is keen on the "revolutionary" idea of invading Amrercia and taking it back. They've just learned to come to America and feed at the public trough we keep filling with tax dollars.
I don't think that the every-day, come to Amercia, have kids and keep a job-Latino is keen on the "revolutionary" idea of invading Amrercia and taking it back. They've just learned to come to America and feed at the public trough we keep filling with tax dollars.
Gee - couls you be any MORE racist???? And when did this country become "Amercia" and/or "Amrercia"???
Julia are you & I living parallel lives?
I was home yesterday because we were having carpet & a new kitchen floor put in & we had 3 of these suspects in our home!! :-O
My guys were listening to country music...must have been part of their clever plan to fool me into thinking they weren't gonna try to reconquer America ;-)
Who gets the worm?
Julia are you & I living parallel lives?
I just knew we had a deep, deep connection. :-0)
And thanks to MMFA we found each other...
Thanks Mr. Brock :-)
"Oh geeze, and I had two of these suspects in my house laying carpet yesterday."-Juliajane
"I was home yesterday because we were having carpet & a new kitchen floor put in & we had 3 of these suspects in our home!" -Jeter
Julia, Jeter, You hired Illegal aliens to work for you?? As far as i know, and i may be wrong, but isn't that illegal??
Aren't you guys all about holding those who hire illegals accountable?
And as a matter of fact, these guys might not have been illegal. One spoke perfect English, not that that necessarily means anything. But it is the company that hires the workers who are indeed responsible for whether they are documented or not. And if you live in Texas as I do, all of the companies here have Mexican workers for construction, landscaping, carpentry work, etc.. And from what I can see, they have an excellent work ethic and work really hard. I have travelled to Mexico over 20 times and I see the same work ethic there. If you want to stem the tide of illegals,
Juliajane, Whether the company provides the service or not is it not the responsibility of the customer to make sure nothing illegal is occuring? Would you go about it the same way if you knew that there was a chance that the local mob was providing you with whatever?
"You have no control over who comes to your house."
Yes, as a matter of fact you do. It is your home. You can stand in the doorway and not allow someone to come in or you can welcome them. that is called control. Unless of course, you live in some sort of communal public house...
However the point is not whether your mexican workers were legal or not, rather it is the fact that you mention them as a means to lightly dismiss Liddy's comments, which were about Illegal Mexican immigrants. Attempting to negate libby's points, you said that you had Mexicans working for you, and they seemed utterly harmless. But, Libby was talking about Illegal Mexicans and their subversive beliefs. You, by attacking his position, exposed yourself to the reasonable assumption that you were stating that you had illegal Mexicans working for you that you found to be harmless.
Otherwise, I'm sure even Libby himself would find legal, established Mexican Americans to be predominantly pleasant company, just as you had when they worked for you.
"petition the greedy companies that hire illegals for cheap labor and leave us alone."
There will always be a "greedy company" that will, naturally, seek cheap labour. It is our job to deprive the of it.
So every time you go out to eat at an Italian restaurant, you check to make sure they are not mob affiliated? After all, the Cosa Nostra is Sicilian/Southern Italian in origin and the mob has involved itself in the restaurant biz. Personally, every time I've eaten sushi, I'm looking over my back for the Yakuza.
You sir, are comparing apples and oranges. There is a difference between knowingly having possibly illegal acts committed on your property, and going somewhere to eat that could be mob backed. If you are having the (possibly) mob affiliated restaurant cater for you, at your home, then it would be wise to determine the legality of their organization and affiliation.
Its common sense really, you should be able to discern from when you have to know, and when it is unnecessary.
Well, that idea has more basis in reality than Fin's. But I will get Fin to vet all of my future home installers for their status. Of course then there's the problem of getting someone to actually do the work. But I digress.
Hey, my A/C man is Iranian. But I think he's legal. I sure hope so because he will come out all manner of night and day to fix my A/C and when you live in Texas you know how important that is! The guy is a god send.
Anyway, the infamous G. Gordon Liddy would be interested in your Iranian a/c man. He'd want to make sure that he's not too foreign, unless he's willing to break into the democratic hq.
Fin,
As Julia explained, the carpet/flooring company provides the instillation services. Did I ask for proof of citizenship? Nope. Just because these guys were Hispanic doesn't automatically mean they are illegal. My wife & I did business with a reputable local carpet dealer. The 3 installers worked from 9:30am to almost 5pm, took only one 10 min break, were courteous & polite & did an outstanding job.
I'm a strong advocate for tougher laws regarding illegal immigration, including a wall/fence, however I'm not going to insult every Spanish speaking person I meet or who might do work around my home by asking if they are here legally or illegally.
J2, I don't know why you didn't stand in the doorway and not let the hard working scoundrels into your home. For shame. You should have barricaded your fortress and brought out the local militia. Maybe next time you will learn not to be so accommodating and think of Uncle Cracker before you endeavor to have carpet layed.
"Just because these guys were Hispanic doesn't automatically mean they are illegal."
Certainly Jeter, but the fact that most illegal aliens are hispanic narrows down your scope of inquiry. Unless you want to ask everyone that does your general contracting...
"however I'm not going to insult every Spanish speaking person I meet or who might do work around my home by asking if they are here legally or illegally."
Whether you insult them or not, it is your right and responsibility to know. If they are legal, and feel insulted upon inquiry, tell them they can thank all of their brethren who come here illegally for it.
By lightly dismissing NL207's points jokingly with your chummy pals you do not eliminate the truth of Nl207's observations...
Whether some "hispanics" do your yardwork and seem perfectly innocent does not mean that the seperatist radicals do not exist, or that the movement is not common in mexicans.
By lightly dismissing NL207's points...blah blah blah (Finnazi)
If you can figure out the time stamps, all of the comments were before NLs, except mine, which was after yours. If you're going to sell anybody on your white supremacy ideals, you may want to attempt to be less of an idiot. You're not exactly the master race poster boy.
CHS, pardon my indiscretion and inattention to the time stamps, what i meant was their light dismissal of G. Gordon Libby's comment instead of those written by NL207.
what i meant was their light dismissal of G. Gordon Libby's(sic) comment
Are you sure? It seemed like you were referring to NL's comments.
This coming from the lowlife who subverted the constitution and put his love of Nixon before his country.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/14/weekinreview/14preston.html
http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html#Am14
They don't want a separate nation? Take a look at the first three paragraphs of El Plan Espiritual de Aztlán
n the spirit of a new people that is conscious not only of its proud historical heritage but also of the brutal "gringo" invasion of our territories, we, the Chicano inhabitants and civilizers of the northern land of Aztlán from whence came our forefathers, reclaiming the land of their birth and consecrating the determination of our people of the sun, declare that the call of our blood is our power, our responsibility, and our inevitable destiny.We are free and sovereign to determine those tasks which are justly called for by our house, our land, the sweat of our brows, and by our hearts. Aztlán belongs to those who plant the seeds, water the fields, and gather the crops and not to the foreign Europeans. We do not recognize capricious frontiers on the bronze continent
Brotherhood unites us, and love for our brothers makes us a people whose time has come and who struggles against the foreigner "gabacho" who exploits our riches and destroys our culture. With our heart in our hands and our hands in the soil, we declare the independence of our mestizo nation. We are a bronze people with a bronze culture. Before the world, before all of North America, before all our brothers in the bronze continent, we are a nation, we are a union of free pueblos, we are Aztlán.
OK.
I've gotta hand it to you AA. That's the most paranoid thing I've heard today.
Worrier,
I didn't write it. I am only pointing out MMFA's source.
AA, either way, those are not un-documented immigrants. Those are college students from the University of Texas (at least that's the only meeting place on their web-site.)
That's like saying all black people are as crazy as this guy.
Seriously, read his reasons for candidacy. The man is a lunatic.
My favorites are 10 and 11. Apparently there are two Presidents, and he's already one of them.
If you had read down to number 49, in which he charges that the US Government killed his sex life, you would have probably made a donation to his campaign fund, like I just did.
We've has senile, sex crazed, dumb as a stump and dull as a phone book presidents so why not batsh_t crazy.
Wow, I think I got to 23 before my eyes crossed and I blacked out on my keyboard.
I love this from his biography:
Once, I am elected to the office of President of the United States of America the thing I am going to do for the people is regulate the office of the President of the United States of America right and not wrong.
I can get on board with that!
The U.S. Government killed his sex life? And you moonbats want to legalize gay marriage, so Uncle Sam can start ruining more peoples' sex lives.Are you never satisfied*??
* (I mean that in regards to the level of government power, not your sex life)
-- those are not un-documented immigrants. Those are college students from the University of Texas -- dbeden
The last I knew, Texas allows illegal immigrants to enter college. The University of Texas has thousands enrolled.
-- you still can't prove that those undocumented immigrants are a part of this organization --db
You're right...and I don't care to or intend to...just setting the record straight on your "undocumented statement" that college students and illegal aliens are mutually exclusive...they're not.
My first google hit: La Voz de Aztlan, then I had to review a long series of article titles and saw this:
http://www.aztlan.net/mecha_president_arrested.htm
And the article (dated 1/17/08, posted on the aztlan website, recall) starts with:
"U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) has arrested the President of MEChA at Palomar College in San Marcos, California. The 22 year old student, Paola Oropeza, was accused of being in the USA illegally. Also arrested was her father Guillermo Oropeza, her mother María de Jesus Oropeza, and her older sister Claudia Oropeza...Paola, Guillermo and María de Jesus have been deported to Mexico but that Claudia is presently incarcerated at a federal facility".
So the undocumented members of the family have already been deported, and the young lady was sitting in stir as of last January. I feel real sorry for her and I'm sure it is all really unfair, but I'd really really really like to know ... was she paying out-of-state tuition?
Because there are a lot of other very bright foreign students in our universities that are really struggling with those high out-of-state tuition rates, and the ones I know study allllll the time, so that they don't lose the goodwill of their advisors, whose favor they must keep to keep their student visas in place.
BTW this only took me like 4 minutes of googlin' time to find. I think it's presumptuous of you to call other folks' reasoning processes to task when the evidence that favors their case is so easy to find.
actually, at least in the public schools, there are about 150,000 immigrants of unknown status in the school system. Of course, that's in all grades, including college.
http://www.window.state.tx.us/specialrpt/undocumented/3education.html
So basically, you're just guessing that it's thousands attending UT. Got it.
According to the state of Texas...as of 2004...they had 3700 illegal aliens enrolled. That was up from 393 in 2001 when they first allowed them entry.
So yeah, there are thousands.
No, those numbers aren't for the University of Texas only. They are for all public institutions of higher education in the state.
"...just setting the record straight."
I didn't write it
LOL
No you didn't, but you had the balls to post it as some type of proof that Liddy right.
I disagree, JJ. Somebody with any cajones at all would post their own original thoughts, and stand behind them.
This is one of my favorites in the AA troll bag;glance at the MMFA item, start Googling, and copy & paste the first contrary quote he can find. When busted for bullsh*t, shirk it off as having nothing to do with him.
It's most hilarious when it includes his frequent plagiarizing. If it's a halfway credible quote,and doesn't get demolished, he can pass it off as his own. If he gets nailed, he blames the person he quoted, and adds "Oops! I hit post too early, and forgot to include the link/attribution."
ON second thought, maybe Barney does have some big brass ones. Even on an anonymous site, to keep making a clown of himself on such a regular basis does take some nuts. ;0)
Guess the tree rats must have eaten those big nuts he has (or had).
AA,
Is that a group of undocumented Mexicans that posted that?
"They" refers to the Riverside MEChA club.
"When did we say we wanted a separate nation? We never did," said Graciela Larios, who recently retired as head of the UC Riverside MEChA club. "We know about the spiritual plan for Aztlan. It reflects the time it was written in. We are not ashamed of it. We stand by it."
Sorry for any confusion.
Columbus, the item linked to specifically refers to Chicanos, and as far as I know, Chicanos are Mexican-Americans, meaning they're Americans.
You may be a little panicky right now, but try reading it again after you've had a glass of warm milk this evening.
I'd be more concerned about the Dominionists who want to throw out the Constitution and turn the USA into a theocracy based on Biblical law:
http://www.jewsonfirst.org/dominionism.html
Oh dear, look at who is really behind this movement, Fortune 500 ceos and corporate wealth so vast that we are but helpless peons beneath them!!
http://www.utexas.edu/corporate/alumni.html
Conquistador
http://www.lyricsfreak.com/p/procol+harum/conquistador_20111548.html
Not only the lyrics to that Procol Harum song, but also A Whiter Shade of Pale, seemed to be about the Vietnam War.
http://www.lyricsfreak.com/p/procol+harum/a+whiter+shade+of+pale_20111595.html
The imagery is there... it's harder to spot in Whiter Shade, but it's rather obvious in Conquistador, especially from that word alone (which has nothing at all that I know of, to do with Mexicans).
Here's a novel approach to reconcile the argument about illegal immagration.
Secure the gawd damn borders!!
Deport illegal aliens and prosecute the employers that hire them!!
If we can't survive without their cheap labor...have congress get off of their dead beat asses and implement a workable guest worker program!!
There...that oughta take care of the problem...simple and no more arguments about reconquista.
Sure 'nuff tommy...I'll gladly concede the guest worker program to implement the rest of the plan.
Tommy's gone home for the weekend. He only works Monday thru Friday at his job posting here, and I bet he got overtime for posting after 6 PM anyway.
Shortsighted people cannot seem to understand that our economy needs those workers. If we are not going to allow the steady stream of undocumented workers to take those jobs, then we need some other way to provide that workforce. A guest worker program does just that, and it also provides them with the security to feel free to leave.
It's a good idea, and you did a great job supporting your position here.
If we are not going to allow the steady stream of undocumented workers to take those jobs, then we need some other way to provide that workforce.
And I am assuming that you consider all the people on unemployment not worthy to do those jobs? Thats right, they ALL must be disfigured.
Sue,
I think you want to stay away from opining on poster's frequencies or monitoring their hours around here.......at least some us don't have to reincarnate ourselves with numerous screen names because we've posted such vile filth that we get banned when our tempers flare out of control, as what has happened to you many times here. You can change your stripes, or your names, but you are still the same Sue - so stick to the subject at hand and leave all else out, maybe you can remain awhile longer.
As for this topic, you are once again clueless......these "undocumented workers" as you call them only drive down wages hurting the poorest Americans as a result, and if you weren't so shortsighted you'd see that, so wise up.
"Well tommy, if you want to ensure passage, you're gonna have to engage in a little quid pro quo with us libs and concede the guest worker program."-Snoopy
SO you're the type who would do good for your country only if you received something in return? I believe that is called 'selfishness'.
NO, the words Snoopy used to describe it were "Quid pro quo," which is defined by the dictionary as: 1.Latin. one thing in return for another. this is different from compromise, which is defined as: 1.a settlement of differences by mutual concessions; an agreement reached by adjustment of conflicting or opposing claims, by reciprocal modification of demands.
"compromise" = "settlement of differences by mutual concessions"
- FINARFIN / Sunday June 8, 2008 2:54:40 PM EDT
You aren't even trying, are you? Not all compromises are strictly quid pro quo, but good luck running government without it.
"Deport illegal aliens and prosecute the employers that hire them!!"
I agree with you about securing the borders, but deporting 14 million people is impossible. And are you gonna pay for that? Think of the cost, just in gas, it would take to deport all illegal immigrants.
The only real workable solution, at this point, is to secure the border and give those already here a chance to become full citizens.
DB,
The way I look at is this, if you're planning your wedding in 6 months and you suddenly get a life threatening illness, you don't say let's "comprehensively" look at this.......you take care of the illness first and foremost before any marriage plans continue.
Secure the borders first, until our politicians are deadly serious and demonstrate commitment to that end, along with prosecuting lawbreaking employers, no talk of anything else. Period. Otherwise you just encourage more illegal border crossings.
-- but deporting 14 million people is impossible -- db
That's a red herring. I don't advocate deporting 14 million tomorrow. They didn't get here over night and we sure can't expect to deport them over night...but we can sure as hell get started.
When you're caught here illegally...you must go home. If you're a criminal caught here illegally...you must go to jail. Sheriff Arpaio has plenty of land and offered to buy more tents, pink pajamas and bologna to accommodate their stay.
We cannot throw out the rule of law just because it's hard or expensive.
Yes, because not only should we incarcerate people, but we should brutalize and humiliate them. Arpaio is a sadistic demagogue and a publicity hound.
"Think of the cost, just in gas, it would take to deport all illegal immigrants."
Dbeden, think about how much it currently costs us to provide public services for an ever growing amount of illegal aliens who do not pay taxes.
Tommy and Fin's hatred of foreigners is well documented.
"Fin's hatred of foreigners is well documented."
being a foreigner myself, i do not hate them. But, i do not like foreigners that are damaging to this country's well bieng, or on a lesser scale, foreigners that are non-white.If you can overlook your conceptions and politics concerning Newt Gingrich...he has some great ideas about harnessing technology to solve problems like this one.
He uses a great analogy using UPS. If they can track packages world wide with the stroke of a computer key and tell you instantly the status of your package...maybe we should put them in charge of immigration.
Our govt. is the real problem. It's bloated, antiquated and full of career employees concerned with retaining their jobs rather than doing a great job. Don't misunderstand...I know that there are good public employees...but they are the exception rather than the rule.
Yeah, I think you and I are nibbling on the same pie.
The crappy way our govt. operates is the real problem...so how can anyone suggest that they are capable of fixing it.
How about this. Tomorrow we cut a deal with a UPS or FEDEX type company and put them in charge of processing immigration and tracking the status of all those that enter through their system. We'll give them six months to staff up with private citizens...no govt. employees...and then we'll turn it over to them with a clear cut mandate on performance measurements. Financial penalties for poor performance but more importantly heavy on financial rewards for superior service.
For those currently stuck in the quagmire of the current system we'll give them the option of staying with the old system or enrolling in the new process. The old immigration system can remain in play until they run out of customers and then it's hasta la viesta baby.
I know...that pie we're nibbling on is way up in the sky...but for chrissake...we've got to start somewhere because the govt. is incapable of healing itself.
Liddy said that he would say, "hello you handsome devil and I would proceed to have the best sex I've had in my life."
Freak, an illegal freak at that. Ollie North is another illegal.
Julia,
Did you intend a pun with "creep" (committee to re-elect the president)?
Committee to re-elect the president? Rut Roh!
It's ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS or ILLEGAL ALIENS you left wing moonbats!
There is no such thing as an UNDOCUMENTED MEXICAN IMMIGRANT.
They are ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS.
La Raza and MALDEF are only picking on Liddy, because they think he is somone many Americans think poorly of, making it an argument that La Raza and MALDEF can possibly publicly win.
Forget it La Raza MALDEFl we just want ALL illegal immigrants out of our United States - NOW.
Nothing you can say will ever change that, and there is no discussion!!!
I'm a natural-born-US citizen, and a life-long yellow-dog democrat btw, and I've always lived in the west. I've lived in Tucson for more than 4 years now. And I'm sorry to have to agree with a criminal, but Liddy is correct about this.
ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION (not talking about folks who've gone to the trouble to get their documents) is:
1) importing outsourcing;
2) a burden on the educational systems of border states (AZ is getting a handle on it at the Univ level, but its an enormous drain on the educational system up to high school level);
3) not fair to bright foreign students who also wouldn't half appreciate a crack at a free education if they could hop the border without hopping a boat;
4) an attempt to cut the line (in front of many who have taken the trouble to obtain documented-status) when the next amnesty program comes.
5) not tolerated going the other way. Do you have any idea what kind of reception you could expect if you were to enter Mexico illegally?
Watch the talk shows on Telemundo and Univision, legal advice for dealing with INS is given for documented as well as undocumented folks. All you need to get the picture is to understand spanish.
In a nutshell, Liddy is right on this one.
Anne
And don't even try the cheap labor nonsense, that just gives a pass to the bastards who refuse to pay living wages at home and abroad; undocumented workers don't write their own checks.
It is unfair that other immigrants are denied a free education just because they don't share a border with us and it's equally appalling that a free education isn't a birthright for every human and it's unfair that our country doesn't provide free college education for all of us.
The line cutting bit makes some sense until you consider people die waiting.
As for immigration not being tolerated the other way, well our open arms are just what makes our country great.
You sound helpless, what do you recommend? Police state? Militarized borders? ICE raids on neighborhoods?
You have read the newspaper stories about forced druggings, physical abuse and wrongful deaths of undocumented workers while in the custody of U.S. officials, haven't you? Where's the outrage about that?
Nah, if border crossing is what you seek to curb, it makes more sense to protect labor rights and reform free trade deals to give these economic refugees a fair deal in their home country. All this stupid fearmongering does is shut down the debate and prohibits rational solutions from being discussed.
Thanks for your courteous reply.
So you doubt that requiring US states to educate the children of illegal immigrants is a "drain" on K-12 public school systems around the country and wish me to provide evidence? Although this is more-or-less common knowledge, I googled to find one source and found, of course, over 40,000 hits on "illegal immigrants educate K-12". Please google yourself, and you will find: multitudinous complaints, by people who nevertheless supply the education. And personally, I think that is a great thing and that we Americans can be proud of that.
It is one thing for a prosperous state and wealthy communities to fund the education of the children of undocumented workers, but reconsider: here in AZ the housing bubble has burst, the building boom is over, the state govt is dealing with enormous deficits, the local govts property tax receipts are much lower than planned for in school budgets due to foreclosures, and as a consequence those budgets are in extreme deficit. Please let us know where your open-arms are, so we can send these kids up your way until we get our feet back on the ground.
I, like you, abhor the state of Mexican society and the way they handle their economy what with keeping a peon class going in modern times. I take particular umbrage with how they use the US job market as a safety valve to relieve the natural feelings of revolution their peones might have if they weren't working so hard and having to deal with barbaric coyotes and all. And walking 30 or 40 miles through the AZ desert is no joke. The heat alone, never mind the walk, killed several national guard kids sent here from the east to patrol the border, just last year. Really tragic, and I still think about those kids.
Back to the illegal immigrants. I object strongly to US employers taking advantage of what amounts to slave labor, while US workers, who can't go elsewhere like Europe where wages are higher, must deal with an environment of depressed wages and inflation.
I think your point about "people die waiting" is overly histrionic (keeping in mind those national guard kids from the east coast). If you are trying to say that US immigration policy doesn't address the world-wide need for people to leave bad places to come here and get a fairer shake, I hardly see how that refutes my points, nor how it is something we USofAers ought to be expected to remedy. GW thought like that, and dragged us into the grand Iraq-democracy experiment and you see how that worked out. We can't be expected to remedy all the unfairness in the world. You personally can certainly try if you like, as can I in my own way, but it is not right for you to impose that obligation on anyone else.
Also, with respect to the topic here, I claim that Liddy is correct, and that there is indeed a reconquista being attempted among some (small number) of the incoming, illegals and legals alike. Please recognize that, here in Tucson, I have observed the flying of Mexican flags, and it turned me in an instant from a supporter to an opponent. So if you do want to raise the quota, you'll have to fight with me on that one.
Anne Yellow-dog in AZ
I see alot of grousing about the cost of education in the google links, I see people blaming immigrants for the decades long neglect of our education infrastructure. They might as well blame immigrants for bad roads, same difference.
And, oh my God! Mexicans flying Mexican flags! Save us, save us form the conquerers. Come see me when armed revolution breaks out. Otherwise, you have no real gripe, this is a free country where folks can fly whatever flag they want to fly. It's not their fault you have a problem with the flags of other nations.
Seriously, the vast majority of these economic refugees make positive contributions to our country, it's the stuff of elitist bullcrap that ignores the essential labor provided by border crossers. Along with valid criticism, a liitle gratitude is in order.
So what do we do? Militarize the border and initiate a police state where our neighborhoods and local businesses are subject to raids?