NY Times' Kristol stressed need for foreign policy experience before Palin pick -- but now says "insiders ... overly value" it
SUMMARY: In his New York Times column, Bill Kristol asserted that many of the Republicans who are "unhappy about John McCain's selection of Sarah Palin" as his vice-presidential running mate are "insiders who highly value -- who overly value -- 'experience.' " However, when he was making the case that Sen. Joe Lieberman could be McCain's best choice for running mate in a column one week earlier, Kristol cited the fact that "Palin has been governor for less than two years" as a possible reason for McCain not to pick her.
In his September 1 New York Times column, Weekly Standard editor Bill Kristol asserted that many of the Republicans who are "unhappy about [Sen.] John McCain's selection of [Alaska Gov.] Sarah Palin" as his vice-presidential running mate are "insiders who highly value -- who overly value -- 'experience.' " But just one week earlier, in his August 25 Times column, when he was making the case that Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-CT) could be McCain's best choice for running mate, Kristol cited the fact that "Palin has been governor for less than two years" as a possible reason for McCain not to pick her. Kristol also wrote in his September 1 column that "McCain doesn't need a foreign policy expert as vice president to help him out." Yet, when discussing the possibility of McCain selecting Minnesota Gov. Tim Pawlenty as his running mate in his August 25 column, Kristol asserted: "But with [Democratic vice-presidential nominee Sen. Joe] Biden's foreign policy experience as a contrast, could McCain assure voters that the young Pawlenty is ready to take over, if need be, as commander in chief?" Kristol did not explain in his September 1 column the sudden apparent shift in the importance he places on McCain's vice-presidential nominee possessing "experience" and "foreign policy" expertise.
From Kristol's September 1 New York Times column, "A Star Is Born?":
Thursday night, after Barack Obama's well-orchestrated, well-conceived and well-delivered acceptance speech in Denver, Republicans were demoralized. Twenty-four hours later, they were energized -- even exuberant. It's amazing what a bold vice-presidential pick who gives a sterling performance when she's introduced will do for a party's spirits.
There are Republicans who are unhappy about John McCain's selection of Sarah Palin. Many are insiders who highly value -- who overly value -- "experience." There are also sensible strategists who nervously note just how big a gamble McCain has taken.
But what was McCain's alternative? To go quietly down to defeat, accepting a role as a bit player in The Barack Obama Story? McCain had to shake up the race, and once he was persuaded not to pick Joe Lieberman, which would have been one kind of gamble, he went all in with Sarah Palin.
Some media mandarins were upset. One reporter noted that -- horrors! -- Palin had never even appeared on "Meet the Press." Time's Joe Klein remarked disapprovingly that McCain didn't know Palin well and had never worked with her. He noted by contrast "that when Walter Mondale picked Geraldine Ferraro in 1984, House Speaker Tip O'Neill, who had worked with Ferraro, was not only vouching for her, but raving about her."
Of course, Ferraro was widely regarded as an unsuccessful V.P. choice. Maybe rave reviews from D.C. insiders aren't the best guarantee of future success.
And Obama supporters can't get too indignant about Palin's inexperience. She's only running for the No. 2 job, after all, while their inexperienced standard-bearer is the nominee for the top position. And McCain doesn't need a foreign policy expert as vice president to help him out.
[...]
If Palin turns out not be up to the challenge for which McCain has selected her, McCain will pay a heavy price. His judgment about the most important choice he's had to make this year will have been proved wanting. He won't be able to plead that being right about the surge in Iraq should be judged as more important than being right about his vice-presidential pick.
McCain has gambled boldly on Palin. If she flops, McCain could lose by a landslide.
On the other hand, if Palin exceeds expectations, and her selection ends up looking both bold and wise, McCain could win.
From Kristol's August 25 New York Times column, "A Joe Of His Own?":
The two leading G.O.P. prospects have been Tim Pawlenty, the Minnesota governor, and Mitt Romney, the former Massachusetts governor. But with Biden's foreign policy experience as a contrast, could McCain assure voters that the young Pawlenty is ready to take over, if need be, as commander in chief? Also, Biden is a strong and experienced debater. Pawlenty is unproven. If he is the choice, there will be many anxious Republicans in the run-up to the vice presidential debate in St. Louis on Oct. 2.
Romney might match up better against Biden in debate. But it's clear that the Obama-Biden campaign is moving aggressively to embrace a traditional Democratic populist economic message. Such a message will have appeal this year -- especially, one supposes, against a doubly multimansioned G.O.P. ticket of McCain and Romney.
If not Pawlenty or Romney, how about a woman, whose selection would presumably appeal to the aforementioned anguished Hillary supporters? It's awfully tempting for the McCain camp to revisit the possibility of tapping Meg Whitman, the former eBay C.E.O., Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, or Gov. Sarah Palin of Alaska. But the first two have never run for office, and Palin has been governor for less than two years.
So what's to be done? McCain could well decide the obstacles to Pawlenty and Romney aren't insuperable, and pick one of them. He could choose a different Republican governor or ex-governor, senator or congressman. Or he could decide that Obama's conventional pick of Biden allows him to seize the moment by making a bold choice. He could select the person he would really like to have by his side in the White House -- but whose selection would cause palpitations among many of his staffers and supporters: the independent Democratic senator from Connecticut, Joe Lieberman.
Lieberman could hold his own against Biden in a debate. He would reinforce McCain's overall message of foreign policy experience and hawkishness. He's a strong and disciplined candidate.
But, it was priceless to see Kristol's face when he learned of the Veep pick, and all the smatterings and rumors running amok, immediately.....
He seemed speechless.
He seemed speechless.
Too bad is wasn't a permanent condition....
Every time l read one of these f'wits has done a 180 degree turn to suit their new postion l have a fantasy that a little part of their soul is cut away.
Then again if it did happen in the real world the rightwing supporting population of the US would contain a very large collection of Lord Voldermort look-a-likes!!
3 letters:
C
Y
A
D,
I'm really getting the feeling in you last few posts that you don't like this pick. What... no party unity? No partisan support of your nominee? Not defense of your nominee's judgement?
Come on, man! In a parody of Lyndon Johnson & Walter Cronkite: If they've lost Dawuss, they've long since lost middle america!
;)
Isn't it time that the Republicans look for change within thier own power ranks. Those that seem to be in lofty positions are getting old and cranky. And the Conservatives who control the party are past their primes. They are too mean and old. They forget their lies. They forget their direction. Kristol should be put out to pasture but it seems that the Republican Glass Ceiling didn't get any cracks. The only thing they have is wise-cracks from Limbaugh, Kristol and the ugly guy Kornblat???
Let's be honest, Elaine isn't qualified. And once again, the Republican Party looks foolish because the Power Brokers forced McCain into this selection. Actually, she makes Obama look good when it comes to foreign policy.
So you wanna' say hello to my generation's Jeff Christie?
I know Hannity and Beck will still be around for a while, but as for the rest... the Conservative icons are all getting up in age.
Prince, I think thats right. The country needs to realize how bankrupt the GOP leadership is of ideas and virtue. The current crop came into power with a blaze of glory in the Contract with America. Yet after all these years where are we?
Most of the conservative pundits want to rehash Reagan for all his glories. Basically GOP leadership means having a government run by people who don't believe in government and having a media that puts ideology and market share over the truth. The ideas of the conservatives are dazzlingly stale. In fact I suspect them of being stuck in the 60's with the culture war and the 80's with their economics.
Thats why this campaign trends toward the absurd. We are to focus on Obama's questionable background over such things as abortion or his pastor's non politically correct comments rather than on what type of national we want to live in during these troubling times. When the conservatives want to talk substance, the closest they get is a vision of a country that is dominated by corporate power with a government focused on military geopolitical conflict.
I suspect Crystal and his ilk assume that anyone up there with Mccain will ultimately be obedient. Experience? That was just another talking point bomb
I think Kristol has a good take on it.
Palin is weak on foreign policy experience. The trade off is that she is strong on reform, is a political outsider, understands energy policy, and has executive experience. She is a classic conservative but has shown she has bipartisan appeal enough to beat one incumbent Governor and one former Governor to win the top spot in Alaska.
What seems to be forgetten around here is that Obama is also weak on foreign policy. The general concensus is that is why he picked Biden.
I think it is this simple, if Palin can hold her own on Sundays and in the debates, she could help propel McCain to the top spot by drawing the independents and dissafected Hillary supporters. If not, hello Prez Obama.
I thought mccain was already a reformer/maveric whatever? He already had that on the ticket. If anything Mccain should have picked someone strong on economics (and using the internet) since he has confessed to being weak there.
If Obama is weak on experience, at least he picked someone with experience.
Also if Mccain wanted to promote reform, it is very sad that he had to look under so many rocks to find someone in the GOP that could fit the bill. It is as if he is saying that the GOP is devoid of reformers. He could only find one up there in Alaska with next to no experience.
Also the elephant in the room is the demographic appeal, pandering to identity politics. What are we to assume other than that Mccain wants to win and throwing wedges in the election is more important than leading the country.
I heard some pundit say that Palin had foriegn policy experience because Alaska is next to Russia.
McCain's theme will be to reform. Palin shows he means it as opposed to Obama's false claim for a new politics when he picks insider Biden.
Yes, I would agree that McCain/Palin are weak on economics.
We agree that Obama picked Biden because he is weak on experience. McCain is not weak on experience, so doesn't need to shore up that perception.
You make a good point about the GOP and reform. I agree.
I don't understand your identity politics comment with regards to McCain is pandering. Obama and Hillary were classic identity politicians. I don't see how selecting Palin is any more of wedge than anyone else.
Hillary and Obama did not pick their identities. They are who they are, running for president.
Mccain picked an outsider, except when it came to what she stands for which is represented in her great conservative cultural war credentials --which are nothing more than the flush the country down the toilet agenda that is nothing new: abortion obsession, creationism etc...
So what made her desireable to Mccain as a selection? Like I said above, her record on reform should not be that unusual unless you consider that she belongs to the party that has been running the show for a number of years and therefor is a big part of what needs to be reformed. Other than that her other strength is her identity.
Again, why was she the pick? Aren't there other reformers in the party who actually have experience at the national level? If there is nothing much there, all we have is a young pretty face wedging into the demographic.
If Mccain would have picked a GOP reformer who wan't a completely unknown entity that happened to be a women/young it would be different.
The GOP seems to be about following a conservative version of political correctness that desires image over substance. It goes all the way back to Reagan the actor. Then we have W. Bush who was the great decider, steadfast, patriotic, made a lot of us feel good in troubled times. The fact that his decisions and policies were a disaster was irrelevent. Mccain picked someone to make certain segments of the electorate feel good first. Any other considerations seem secondary.
"McCain is not weak on experience, so doesn't need to shore up that perception."
He does if wants to keep playing the experience card against Obama, one of the few cards he had left in his deck.
"and she is only the V.P. pick."
Looks like you take the VP position about as seriously as Palin herself does:
“As for that VP talk all the time, I’ll tell you, I still can’t answer that question until somebody answers for me what is it exactly that the VP does every day?..."
How reassuring it must be to have someone poised to be the vice president of the United States who has no concept of what the position entails.
I love how conservatives and Republicans love to make so much of 'executive experience', forgetting that our current and worst president had 6 years worth in Texas, and we're in the mess we are now because of him.
They also love to ignore Obama's legislative experience, which is more that her time as mayor and governor. 11 years in the state house, 3 1/2 in Washington, which is three and a half in Washington more than Palin. And Foreign policy? Palin got her passport in 2007, and a stop over in Ireland is on her resume'.
Well, looks like Obama has a lead, but wait, he has been running for President for majority of that time, so again advantage Palin. Obama has voted absent majority of the time, and Palin has been showing up for her job, which means she has more actual hands on experience in her job. Sorry, your candidate has less experience the Palin whom is seeking the V.P. role not President.
Sorry, MARKBFOOT but your 'fact' that Jimmy Carter was 'The worst President in US history' is merely your opinion, and an opinion that most do not share.
GW Bush is ranked highly among the worst, and he may ultimately go down as THE worst. Only time will tell.
While it may be argued that Carter was 'ineffectual' as a US President, he is certainly not the worst. Carter is also one of only 3 US Presidents to become a Nobel Laureate (Wilson & FDR were the other 2).
These are 'facts' you can rely on.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/01/AR2006120101509.html
http://hnn.us/articles/48916.html
I do not believe in all of G. W decisions, but I would not say he is the worst of even in the bottom half
Ok - name one good thing Bush has done. Just one that hasn't enriched the wealthy, corporations, or his cronies. We're not more safe, thousands of died, we're billions in debt and hated around the world. Mission Accomplished!
You're post kind of freaked me out that there are people out there that think like you.
McCain's theme will be to reform.
Gramps McCain's REAL theme will be to remember what he said five minutes ago.
forgetten=forgotten- anotheramerican
Barney, just to save you some time, it's not necessary to correct minor typos with an additional post.Most people reading the comments here can figure stuff like that out.I'd suggest redirecting that energy to fixing the factual and logical problems with your comments.Plenty of work to do there.
I think Kristol is just carrying the water he was told to carry, and I would imagine most non-brainwashed people would see it the same way.
"What seems to be forgetten around here is that Obama is also weak on foreign policy. The general concensus is that is why he picked Biden."--AA
Obama is strong on foreign policy. You are mistaken. He chose Biden merely to strengthen the image of his foreign policy to be more like the reality of it. This is the way politics are played.
Uh... okay. If you say so. :-)
It's not because he says so, it's because it's a fact. Obama has traveled to many foreign nations and has had contact with foreign leaders. He has worked on issued of foreign affairs while in government. When he has spoken on foreign affairs issues he has proven himself to be knowledgeable and displayed good common sense.
He is head and shoulders above Palin. I think he stacks up well against McCain, for that matter. He definitely shows himself to be more knowledgeable about current world circumstances than McCain. I have absolutely zero concerns with regard to Obama in that area.
what are you talking . hardly a word of what you say is true, in fact it is all a pack of lies
now i was thinking today that if the messiah gets elected, this would be really good for my investments. putin would lose no time in projecting russian power even more than he has in georgia. this would throw energy, read oil, and i believe gold markets into a turmoil. prices would increase dramatically. how would we respond. probably not at all.
as it is, there is little we can do about this little invasion of georgia. but who knows where it could lead.
maybe it doesn't make any difference who is elected, with regard to this issue. but i think the russians would be less likely to act broadly if mccain was in the whitehouse. but obama they could beat like a rented mule. he would do nothing to stop them, or protect us.
now while i feel that obama would be great for my investments, i don't recommend it.
SSSands, When will you learn that using the messiah line is just plain puke from Limbaugh. As soon as you regurgitate his crap, all reading of your posts stop.
Are you that dim?
what are you talking . hardly a word of what you say is true, in fact it is all a pack of lies - sandss981580
Perhaps you'd like to mention one single thing I stated that's a lie.
Was it Obama's travels? He's been to Europe, Africa, Indonesia, Russia and the Middle East among other places.
It's indisputable he's met and spoken with foreign leaders.
Is it the part about working on foreign affairs issues in the Senate? He's contributed to legislation dealing with foreign affairs and has served on the Senate Foreign Relations committee.
He has shown himself to be more knowledgeable than McCain on matters of foreign affairs. McCain's displays of ignorance are becoming legendary. Obama's positions are reasonable and sensible.
So, where are the lies? Do they, as I suspect, reside blissfully separate from reality in your fevered imagination? You know, the same region occupied by your fanciful predictions of the future.
what are you talking . hardly a word of what you say is true, in fact it is all a pack of lies
Says someone who has never posted a true word.
I don't believe Obama has looked into Putin's eye and gotten a sense of his soul... So he might be able to handle it better than how it's being handled already
Look in eyes of enemy and determine soul...base policy on what I see. (bush notes on f. policy)
(Reminder....set optometrist appointment for glasses)
AA, you must be racking up points on the "McCain spread whatever lie we need game".
You excel at repeating the "glowing qualifications" Palin is suppose while totally and completely ignoring the facts.
Palin isn't merely weak on foreign policy, SHE HAS NO EXPERIENCE, PERIOD! Weak would imply she has some, she has NONE! She got her FIRST passport in July 07.
She's so strong on "reform" she's continuing the "abuse of power" theme from the current administration. She FIRED the Public Safety commissioner because he wouldn't FIRE he ex-brother-in-law and then LIED about it! And that was not the first time either. While she was mayor she FIRED the city’s police chief, Irl Stambaugh, and the library director, Mary Ellen Emmons, without warning. She accused them in a letter saying: “I do not feel I have your full support in my efforts to govern the city of Wasilla. Therefore I intend to terminate your employment". She was almost fired for that shinning example of leadership! Yeah, that's some "reformer".
She was such a "political outsider" that she just happened to be the director of the "Ted Stevens Excellence in Public Service, Inc., a 527 group that could raise UNLIMITED funds from corporate donors. Yeah, she's an outsider.
Apparently she was pretty smart on the Iraq war because she said In a BusinessWeek interview, Gov. Sarah Palin (R-AK) admitted that she believes "We are a nation at war and in many [ways] the reasons for war are fights over energy sources"
As far as "bipartisanship" goes. The last time Alaska voted for a Democratic president was Johnson, back in 1964! Alaska even voted for Nixon over Kennedy, so bipartisanship doesn't really count in Alaska.
Frank Lutz, Republican pollster conducted a focus group of undecided voters opinion of the Palin VP pick and found all except one thought the Palin pick was a gimmick and 2 to 1 had negative opinions of her.
McCain cannot and will not get independent women or former Hillary supporters to vote for Palin with stuff like this: November 2006, then gubernatorial candidate Sarah Palin declared that she would not support an abortion for her own daughter even if she had been raped. At the time, her daughter was 14 years old. Reminds you of the Michael Dukakis moment.
Getting to President Obama won't be easy, but thanks to McCain's VP choice, showing the world that McCain is owned by the religious right, the same religious right that runs the GOP just became easier.
do you have facts on anything you wrote about, other than opinions, just like the water-carrier-Kristol?
you - she is string on reform. What is 'reform' in Alaska?
you - she is political outsider. does that mean no polictical experience?
you - understands energy policy. Proof of her understanding the energy policy? I will claim that she is in the Big Oil pocket more than Cheney.
you - bipartisan appeal. did she beat a Democratic Governor?
you - "she could help propel McCain to the top spot by drawing the independents and dissafected Hillary supporters.? independents? hillary supporters?
Please provide proof.
AA
the only female voters palin will pull out of the Hillary squad are the ones that would vote for Hillary just because she is a woman. The other ones are in a coma or right wing coolaid drinkers. Mark my words: palin will prove to be as much a joke as bush McC stepped into a big "PILE" on this one. Sit down and buckle up 'cause this is going to be a fun ride to election day. Listening to the right lie their way out of this mess is going to be nauseating.
AA, you say "Palin is weak on foreign policy experience. The trade off is that she is strong on reform, is a political outsider, understands energy policy, and has executive experience. She is a classic conservative but has shown she has bipartisan appeal enough to beat one incumbent Governor and one former Governor to win the top spot in Alaska"
Actually, her foreign experience is zip, zero, zilch, nada (saying it is weak is a stretch). She is strong on reform ... but only from that particular school of reform that grasps power from the corrupt ... and once gained, applies it corruptly to matters she is interested in rather than matters of interest to her predecessor (she's no better than those she supplanted, she's just ... a different corrupt politician: google troopergate ... it's all about her today). She may be a classic conservative ... I dunno so you tell me: how does being a secessionista put her into that category? Oh, right, the confederacy: defeated but never surrendered. Does she have bipartisan appeal, or tripartisan (AIP) appeal? Will her heart be with the Union?
Inquiring minds need to know.
Oh, I suppose if you consider her AK secessionista leanings, any dealings between her (in her position as CEO of Alaska) and the federal govt of the USofA might be considered "foreign policy experience". I do beg your pardon, I see in this capacity you've made your point.
Oh, and AA? Can you please post links to photos of Palin wearing her flag pin? (I'm sure she's never without one, might be in her hair not her parka) and Oh! some YOUTUBE clips of her with hand on heart while saying the PoA? Those trivial little items will be such a help to both YOU and ME and HANDYSEAN in the weeks ahead...
The trade off is that she is strong on reform.
Baloney Sausage. She's under investigation for ethics violations and abuse of power. She's embodies the worst properties of both McCain and Bush, and she hasn't even been to Washington yet. She's more of the same in a more attarctive package.
and she hasn't even been to washington yet......
har har har har and har 8-)
That is just it, the average american does not pick up foriegn policy experience.
It helps if you have been out of the country and at minimum know some geography and the names of world leaders.
The GOP however banks on voters being impressed with their candidates average joe credentials because nascar attendance is more important than passport dependence. Forget about how damaging their policies are to average joes, keeping up with appearances is the most important thing.
A down's syndrome child could indicate further problems, possibly genetic, with following children.
If she's consistent in her position then she's probably not going to seek the help of a scientifically trained geneticist. Evolutionarily based you know.
If you really want to see something that sums up this entire Mongolian Cluster F then go to TalkingPointsMemo and watch Campbell Brown COMPLETELY evicerate Tucker Bounds (my god, what are these people thinking with the name Tucker? Don't they realise these kids have to go to school?) when see asks him about Palin's foreign policy experience. TPM called it a livev vivisection. It's hard to disagree when you watch it. One of the funniest things l have seen since Paxman/Blair 2.
talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/212194.php
Oh My God!!!
Just found one funnier than the above!!
Watch Buchanan/Scarborough mock Palin on friday morning!! You could use that as part of a campaign video "Even conservative commentators think she's not ready".
www.dailykos.com/story/2008/9/1/115013/6486/664/582087
Kristol seems to have known better than he opined:
Crystol is a pistol - shoots from the hit and shoots off his big mouth that is not connected to a brain (at least not his).
If he were brighter and most honest he would have to admit that falling in love with someone hardly qualifies the person to ve the vp of the US presuming that McDork is elected.
Not a chance!