Right-wing birthers now pushing town hall disruptions
Conservative media figures who have promoted conspiracy theories about President Obama's birth certificate have recently used their platforms to promote the anti-health care reform disruptions of congressional town hall events. Indeed, the disruptions resemble similar efforts by birthers to disrupt town halls.
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Media figures promoting town hall disruptions also have promoted birther theories
Lou Dobbs on town hall disruptions: "I asked you to make certain to make your voices were heard when our representatives got home ... and that has begun." On August 3, Dobbs said: "I've said it before, and I'll say it again: I love it when the audience of this broadcast is engaged and making their voices heard. And you're getting louder by the day. It's an amazing thing to watch. What started at the April 15 and July 4 tea parties continuing this weekend as congressmen left town for the August recess, at least." He added, discussing the town hall disruptions: "Every time I ask each and every one of you to call into your congressman, to your senators, to this broadcast, I beg you to make your voice heard. And you're not only making it heard on this broadcast, you're making it heard by the people you elected to represent you. And that is a new concept. Our so-called leaders are beginning to listen to the people who put them in office. Friday, I asked you to make certain to make your voices were heard when our representatives got home from their just overwhelming duties on Capitol Hill, and that has begun. What happened over the weekend -- when Congressman Lloyd Doggett faced an angry but respectful audience at a town hall meeting in Austin -- in fact, at a Randalls grocery store -- he got an earful. Listen to what happens when Congressman Doggett starts talking about health care legislation." [United Stations Radio Networks' Lou Dobbs Show, 8/3/09]
Dobbs has
repeatedly promoted birth certificate conspiracy
theories.
- DOBBS: "What's really crazy about this is all the president of the United States has to do is produce a birth certificate. That's all that has to be done, and it would be over." [The Lou Dobbs Show, 7/15/09]
- DOBBS: "Is President Obama -- should he produce his birth certificate -- the long form, the real deal? Should he be a little more forthcoming?" [The Lou Dobbs Show, 7/15/09]
Sean Hannity: Recess "creates the best opportunity for people to go like they did to Claire McCaskill's town hall meeting." On July 29, Hannity said: "There's going to be no floor vote immediately" on health care reform "so members have time to go home and read the bill, which, by the way, creates the best opportunity for people to go like they did to Claire McCaskill's town hall meeting or go to [Rep. Russ] Carnahan's town hall meeting or go show up wherever there's any representative. That -- this is your moment, your opportunity to stop this thing." [ABC Radio Networks and Premiere Radio Networks' The Sean Hannity Show, 7/29/09]
Hannity: "Now, so far at these town hall meetings, you're doing terrific." Following reports of several town hall disruptions occurring nationwide, Hannity declared on August 3: "This is what's going to stop this. You are. You're gonna make it happen." He went on to say: "Now, so far at these town hall meetings, you're doing terrific. You're standing up to these bureaucrats. You're standing up to their phony platitudes, talking points, and bumper stickers. The polls are now turning against Obama, [House Speaker Nancy] Pelosi, and [Senate Majority Leader Harry] Reid, so now they're bringing out their own pollster to lie to you and find out a way how they can win the PR battle, and they're telling them that they've got to attack the insurance companies." [The Sean Hannity Show, 8/3/09]
Hannity has
questioned Obama's birth certificate.
- HANNITY: "Let me ask you a question: Have you ever seen the birth certificate?" [The Sean Hannity Show, 7/22/09]
Rush Limbaugh: If town hall disruptions are "an orchestrated event," it's "about damn time." On August 3, Limbaugh offered his "reaction" to a caller who noted that media outlets have reported the town hall protests are coordinated: "About damn time. We have had groups like ACORN and Democrat rent-a-mobs making up excuses and lying about things they oppose to affect public policy for years, while people like me haven't had time because we work. We do not protest for a living. We do not rent ourselves out to be part of mobs. So, if this is actually an orchestrated event, then I'm glad somebody on our side's getting in gear." Limbaugh later added: "It doesn't matter to me one way or the other [if the protests are coordinated]. The people who are showing up are genuinely angry. And if their transportation is being facilitated -- about damn time. You've got to take these people on the way they play the game. The aggressor sets the rules in a conflict." [Premiere Radio Networks' The Rush Limbaugh Show, 8/3/09]
Limbaugh: Town hall protests "not ginned up; it's genuine. It's real." Limbaugh defended the town hall protesters as being "orderly people," not the "unruly mobs" he claims Democrats are describing them as. Limbaugh continued: "These are genuine voting American citizens. It is -- what these Democrats are accusing you of doing, who go to these town hall meetings, is exactly what Obama taught people to do. He's the community agitator. He's the community organizer. Obama is the guy who taught people how to show up at events like this over and over again and rip 'em apart and tear 'em down, disrupt 'em, and make sure they don't happen. And now the tables have been turned. It's happening to him, only this time, it's not ginned up; it's genuine. It's real." [The Rush Limbaugh Show, 8/4/09]
Limbaugh has suggested Obama hasn't produced a valid birth certificate.
- LIMBAUGH: "God does not have a birth certificate. Neither does Obama. Not that we've seen." [The Rush Limbaugh Show, 6/10/09]
Quinn & Rose on town halls: "You still have time to scare them to death." On August 3, co-hosts Jim Quinn and Rose Tennent repeatedly aired audio of a female protester at a town hall event. After airing audio, Tennent cheered the woman on, saying, "Woohoo! Go girl! Yeah! Owwooo!" She continued: "Listen, we feel very, very strongly about this. This is visceral. This is -- this comes from inside, and we're speaking it out. And all of you, be encouraged by this woman. We need to get out there and do the same thing. This is their recess, OK? You cannot have a recess. There is no rest for us. You must get out there, find out where they're meeting, and show up. And be prepared to ask questions. Be prepared to show you are rejecting yet another government program. And I'll tell you what: Talking points? Yeah, there's nothing wrong with them. In fact, if you go to WarRoom.com and click on marching orders, there is a mock email that you can take and you can look over and read and digest and put it into your own words when you want to go out and speak to those people like [Sen. Arlen] Specter and [Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen] Sebelius. ... [W]e still have time to do this." Quinn added: "You still have time to scare them to death." [Clear Channel's The War Room with Quinn & Rose, 8/3/09]
Quinn & Rose has promoted birth certificate conspiracy theories.
- QUINN: "Well, where's his birth certificate? We could have two illegitimate leaders." [The War Room with Quinn & Rose, 6/15/09]
The Fox Nation: "Malkin Points You to Where the Town Halls Are": From Fox News' website The Fox Nation on August 4:
The Fox Nation has asked readers: "Should Obama Release Birth Certificate?" A May 28 headline on TheFoxNation.com asked: "Should Obama Release Birth Certificate? Or Is This Old News?" The Fox Nation's birth certificate headline linked to a video of WorldNetDaily correspondent Les Kinsolving asking White House press secretary Robert Gibbs to "releas[e] a certified copy of his long-form birth certificate."
Anti-health care reform protesters using same disruption tactics as birthers
Birthers disrupted a congressional town hall. "At a town hall meeting in Georgetown [Delaware], a woman demanded to know why [Rep. Mike] Castle and his colleagues were 'ignoring' questions about Obama's birth certificate -- questions that have been put to rest repeatedly by state officials in Hawaii, where the birth certificate and all other credible evidence show that Obama was born in Honolulu on Aug. 4, 1961. When Castle countered that Obama is, in fact, 'a citizen of the United States,' the crowd erupted in boos, the woman seized control of the gathering and led a recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance." [Politico, 7/27/09]
Birther "ringleader" Orly Taitz called on people to "demand action" on birth certificate at town halls. "Moments after speaking with POLITICO Saturday, Taitz posted a call to arms on her blog: 'I believe it is a serious concern and I hope that each and every decent American comes to town hall meetings with a video camera and demands action,' she wrote." [Politico, 7/27/09]
Beck's crazy, but he's not stupid. I think he aired his recent "turning violent will ruin everything" statement as a preemptive self-absolving element, just in case.
Beck's crazy, but he's not stupid. I think he aired his recent "turning violent will ruin everything" statement as a preemptive self-absolving element, just in case.
Oh no of courses he couldn’t possibly be sincere.
Read through that book, and you will get more than a few shocks. (take special note of the references/recommendations to the Family unit, and to Public Education) Everyone tries to remember Wells for his science fiction, but he was deeply involved in much, much more than that. Truth is he was a fabian socialist, a Utopian, and one of the movers-and-shakers on the British side of the League of Nations which later led to the U.N. He was very committed to the idea of world government. He studied under Thomas Henry Huxley (Darwin's Bulldog) and was a staunch proponent of eugenics. He did not believe that the common people could ever understand or be trusted to manage their own affairs and wrote;
Additionally, if you really want a wake-up call, another 'instruction manual' would have to be Phillip Dru; Administrator by Col. Edward Mandell House. Its terribly written, but it does quite favorably detail a complete overthrow of the United States and the imposition of a Marxist dictatorship.
A work of utopian fiction on those lines is not all that disturbing, when taken alone, however it takes on an entirely different flavor when you realize that Col. House was the chief advisor to Woodrow Wilson (Federal Reserve created during his Administration), who gave House the responsibility of drafting the Armistice, The Treaty of Versailles AND the League of Nations, and he even participated in the meeting in Paris that outlined the establishment of the Council of Foreign Relations...
(Col. House was also a Texan, educated in New England and was involved in banking. The surname House does appear in the Bush family pedigree, not far removed from Prescott, but I am not sure if there is any direct connection)
Take what you want from all of that, but its well established history, it sheds a harsh light on the world we live in today, and illuminates the path that brought us here, and where that path leads.
Feel free to call it a 'conspiracy' theory if you like, some of its chief designers had no problem with such a label. Read it for yourself, in their own published words then look around you and witness their vision, their legacy.
I have been blogging on another blog about this health care reform. I got called everything but a white woman. These GOP people are wondering why their fellow republicans were not re-elected. Their attitudes stink. Its pretty bad when they talk about how many rights people have only if it pertains to them only. Yet, when someone else wants to voice their opinion, then they call us SOBS, and other bad names. In addition, these people are yelling, screaming, making threatening poses as if to strike you with their Demonstration signs. Its as if they will do anything to anyone even if means hurting another person physically. I am glad none of these so called entities know where me and my children live. If they did, I would feel that me and my childrens lives would be in dangerous peril.
Fringe?
And while 93 percent of Democrats say he was born in the country and 83 percent of Independents, the figure is only 42 percent for Republicans. A majority of Republicans either believe he was born abroad (28 percent) or don't know (30 percent). Poll on Birthers: Most Southerners, Republicans Question Obama Citizenship...
Recess Rally...
Many of the original groups behind TaxDayTeaParty.com are joining together for the Nationwide Recess Rally. This is a collaborative effort to make it known that we will not stand for socialized, government controlled healthcare.
National Coalition Sponsors:
1. Michelle Malkin
2. RedState
3. Smart Girl Politics
4. American Marjority: Ned Ryun is the President of American Majority and HE was a former presidential writer for George W. Bush. Lonny Leitner is the Minnesota Regional Director for American Majority and HE was the regional directo for Bush/Cheney 04. Republican Shari Weber served as a member of the Kansas House of Representatives for the 68th District for 10 years, including serving as Majority Leader during the 2001 and 2002 legislative sessions. Matt Pinnell served, during the 2008 election cycle as the "Oklahoma Victory" Director for the McCain-Palin ticket. Pinnell is a former campaign aide to U.S. Congressman Steve Largent, State Senator Scott Pruitt, and U.S. Senator Tom Coburn, M.D.
5. The Sam Adams Allience: John Tsarpalas is the president of Team Sam. Tsarpalas was also the Executive Director of the Illinois Republican Party. Joseph G. Lehman is president of the Mackinac Center for Public Policy, which is the largest conservative state-level policy think-tank in the nation.
6. Let Freedom Ring: John Templeton Jr., is the chairman of Let Freedom Ring. He also was a co-chair of the faith and values steering committee of unsuccessful Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney. A born-again Christian, he's also one of the biggest donors to a ballot initiative in California this year that would ban same-sex marriage; he and his wife gave $1.2 million.
7. American for Prosperty: David Koch founded & funds Americans For Prosperity. Koch is also THE 19TH RICHESS MAN IN THE WORLD.
Art Pope, a North Carolina state representative and executive and founder of the conservative think tank, the John Locke Foundation.
Yeah right, this REALLY looks like grassroots organization of every day folks expressing their views!
There is no equivalence between those circumstances and the guerilla theater we're seeing today.
Today's antics are nothing more than ill informed people who are being used by lobbyists to derail legislation that benefits their own economic interests.
A better comparison could be made between the birthers/anti-healthcare advocates and the anarchists who disrupt various worldwide, economic summits. Or going back to another time, the yippies and their anti-Vietnam antics.
18,000 deaths every year due to lack of health care coverage. That's the rush.
Why are you pro-death?
And in case you forgot, the government IS the people. Your disdain for it is quite un-patriotic.
I do remember 186,000/yr being given as an estimate of deaths due to prevenatabe medical mistakes, and that is far beyond any excuse.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/jul/30/bill-pascrell/pascrell-says-22000-americans-die-yearly-because-t/
Wheras, something in the neighborhood of 186,000 die yearly,,, because they do.
Got it ;)
However, there is nothing frutiful being done and even being attempted when these "protesters" are shouting down the speakers and chanting some craziness just to keep any information from being disseminated. This is purposeful obsstruction of the process which shows me that they know they are wrong or ill-informed and don't care. They just want to follow the order of their radio and TV entertainers disguised as political leaders.
I don't think anyone has a problem with someone airing their concerns. It is when those certain people feel their right to yell and scream trumps the rights of the others who are there to become informed or air their own grievances that it becomes downright un-American.
as for being "pro-death", hello... this thing wouldn't go into effect tomorrow. pg 14, line 10 defines year 1 of the legislation as 2013. that means by using your estimate, (even if they already approved the bill) approximately 72,000 people could die before it begins providing coverage. 2013. Urgent huh?
Perhaps I am not familiar with the concept of it you are peddling.
I will say I find it particularly delicious that some on here who demanded that Gates should have been arrested are defending these protesters. The cognitive dissonance it must take to argue that a man should be arrested for shouting and being rude on his own property but protesters who are shouting and chanting just to disrupt something as American as a town-hall meeting should be defended at all costs? Amazing partisanship.
The AFTER-BIRTHERS have come out and are spreading all over the place. Maybe we can invent a new flavored TEA to be called AFTER-BIRTH DELIGHT.
Very flavorful with a nutty fragrance and a beet red color. I'm sure that the ABers will gladly purchase this TEA and make it the official drink of the movement.
Picture the ad-campaign.....
Orly Taint hold a mug and saying "AFTER-BIRTH, now that's my cup of TEA".
Long Live the Movement....
At this meeting, local folks aren't able to ask questions, speak up about issues that concern them, or even listen to THEIR rep. speak because of shipped-in carpetbaggers and their faux "concerns" over a bill THAT I GUARANTEE THEY HAVEN'T READ! I think there will be growing resentment of these interlopers, and it will hurt the Republicans. Nobody likes a bully!
get busy extoling its virtues and lay off the tactic of attacking
the people who oppose it personally. The attacks on Rush Limbaugh and
Lou Dobbs do nothing to advance their cause, only to weary the voters and make them cynical about the nastiness of politics.
"weary the voters" - Sorry, I cannot follow that. Care to explain?
Isn't this about a national (not local) issue? Do you believe these meetings are actually suppossed to be choir practice? Are the disruptions by this vocal minority hindering the intended groupthink and consensus fabrication?
Seriously, some of the opinions expressed here by the 'left' remind me a lot of the ultra-right...
But, seriously, the only issue is when these bussed-in "protesters" do not allow the rest of the citizenry to have their say. The tapes I see of them shouting down the speakers as well as the rest of the audience and maintaining some kind of creepy, loud chant in order to keep the meeting from actually even happening is downright un-American. Have your say, express you views, then have the balls to let the politican you are attacking say their piece as well as the rest of the citizens who are from that district and have some questions or concerns of their own. It's common decency. The question is, does the far right led by TV and radio entertainers posing as political leaders still have common decency or have they chosen party over even decency.
I can already envision someone still blurting the ad hominem "birther!" at someone else a decade from now, on a completely different issue.
Its the way of things.
I can already envision someone still blurting the ad hominem "birther!" at someone else a decade from now, on a completely different issue.
Its the way of things.
And in the end, I believe you are correct that all you do is remove yourself from the adult conversation and ultimately relegate yourself to the children's table when you show an inability to hear contrasting views or even answers to your questions or concerns. You do not have to agree with the answers the politician gives you and you do not have to agree with every piece of legislation he votes for, but you do owe him at least the chance to respond when he is putting himself out there in a townhall meeting. It is just common decency and civility on some level.
I can already envision someone still blurting the ad hominem "birther!" at someone else a decade from now, on a completely different issue.
Its the way of things.
Please delete the triple post above. My Browser hung up.
Sincerest Apologies
1) Ask about single payer, and what it would take to get it back on the table.
2) Ask the most disruptive and aggressive teabagger I can find where he or she -actually- lives. If they aren't a resident, they can go on home and protest to their heart's content.
If conservatives/traditionalists truly want to support the claim universal healthcare would deleteriously affect the healthcare system, they need to prove it would ration healthcare for significantly MORE people than are already being excluded from the system TODAY. (42% of adults, aged 19-64, are uninsured/underinsured.) And that's not something they can do.
They all-too-conveniently ignore perhaps the most tragic repercussion of the current system -- 18,000 to 20,000 Americans DIE every year because they lack health insurance. Countless others lead tortured lives due to untreated chronic ailments. (Needless to say, neither conservatives/traditionalists nor their television advertisement campaigns ever mention these inconvenient little facts.)
How can anyone believe 46M uninsured + 25M underinsured don't ALREADY represent de facto large-scale rationing? It doesn't take a Ph.D. in economics to grasp. To suggest the current system doesn't already involve considerable rationing is simply deplorable.
It's sickening to observe these people from the middle-middle (sometimes even lower-middle) to upper-upper classes act so reprehensibly against the vital interests of the less fortunate. The majority of them have never had to -- and probably never will -- experience the kind of economic insecurity the majority of the uninsured/underinsured have to confront virtually every day. They are just SPOILED beyond belief -- naive and sheltered from so much, for most of their lives.
Most of the middle and upper classes -- and virtually all of the conservative/traditionalist ones among them -- don't even BEGIN to appreciate what it means to endure real, chronic economic insecurity and privation. REAL privation, that is: endless worrying about paying the rent, food, energy costs, etc.
Worse still: you hope against hope that you don't get seriously sick -- because if you do that's just the end of the line in a long-godforsaken country, for far too many people.
This is the greatest country in the world, but people like you are trying very hard to destroy it. You like to champion the cause of the "poor" because it makes you feel like a good person. Here are some facts to consider before disparaging conservatives for not willingly giving up their hard-earned prosperity: The poorest populations in every continent on the planet reproduce at the highest rates (look it up on the U.N. site). This means that any program anywhere that seeks to feed, house, educate, provide health care and economic subsidies to the poor must continue to grow at geometric rates just to keep up with these exploding populations. It never ends! It costs more and more money! The problems never go away! It doesn't take a genious to realize that taking away from the shrinking population of producers and give to the growing population of consumers is a dead end path. One that will destroy everything for everyone - even the poor.
Do these 'protesters not see the hypocracy?
With regards to the birth certificate issue, I will just say this: a "certificate of live birth," is not an official birth certificate. Obama could end everything by just producing it. Why is that so hard to do? Until the, I, and every American, has a right to ask where his birth certificate is. And no, I do not trust a Hawaiian state official to say he/she has seen it and all is valid. That is a cop out. Just release the birth certificate, and we can move on.
With regards to the town hall meetings, why is this site, and the supporting commentators, so sure it's right-wing people infiltrating the meetings? Is it suddenly a crime to be against a health care bill and voice anger? Is there some form of restriction now on the First Amendment that I am unaware of? When did it become a "right-wing" thing to tell your representatives how you feel? Especially when, as many Congressmen and Congresswomen, reported one-sided opposition to the bailout of last fall, and it still passed? The American people have a right to be angry and say something about it. If anyone feels otherwise, it's too bad. Because you don't understand what the Republic (yes we are a Republic, not a democracy--read your history) is about.
If Media Matters and all the supporters want to show some real strength, call out Obama on his failure to bring the troops home, his hiring of lobbyists for his administration after he said he wouldn't, and his increase in taxes on cigarettes, which disproportionately affects those making under $250,000--the very group he said would not face one tax increase. But I doubt we'll see that anytime soon. This site and its readers worship Obama as if he were Jesus reincarnated.
Bottom line: Bush, Obama. It's all the same. Both have subverted the Constitution. Both have bled the country dry of money and put future generations in a tax burden hole that amounts to indentured servitude. And both are nothing more than puppets. Until Media Matters and its readers get that, this site is now nothing more than site for Democrats to get together and fawn over how great they are and how evil Obama bashers are. It's just like Fox News. Except you replace Democrats for Republicans and Obama for Bush.
God help us all.
Ken D.
Pssst - read the mission statement.
Umm no - MM4A replaces lies with truth.
As for the rest of your nonsense, you may feel more at home over in freeperville.
I'm sure that's his regular hangout...
As far as "balanced reporting". I believe MM is all about "point out conservative disinformation", which is what I believe they do. I believe there are other sites, like factcheck.org, that work on pointing out truths or untruths on both sides of the political coin.
Personally, I don't think anyone at MM cares that people are voicing their opinions at Town Hall meetings (that is what they are for, after all). I believe the issue is that people (and organizations) are running an active campaign to "disrupt" the Town Hall meetings. These tactics aren't about someone voicing their opinion as much as it is keeping others from voicing theirs.
BTW, yes we are a Democratically controlled Republic. Meaning that there are controls in place to help protect the minority. In a true Democracy there is no protection for the minority, whatever the majority wants is what happens, regardless of consequences.
As far as calling out Obama on his "failures", again, that is not the sites purpose. Besides there are plenty of people "calling him out" already. That includes Democrats as well as Republicans.
Let's see: Bush or Obama. They both are/were president. Bush did lead the country while turning surplus to deficit,etc. I think it is way too early to convict Obama of bankrupting America, especially during a recession when most economist will tell you that deficits are not bad, if they help stop/slow the recession. As far as the puppet part, that all depends on how you define it. Are they puppets if they follow their parties policies,etc. As far as the Fox News comparison, I think comparing a network that pretends to be "Fair and Balanced" to a web site that is dedicated to "exposing conservative misinformation" is pushing it, not the same thing.
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2009/08/05/birther_faq/?source=newsletter
And I still don't see any proof of this alleged conspiracy to disrupt town hall meetings. All the idiot conservative talk show hosts have done is try to latch onto a growing movement in America that something is wrong.
But perish the thought that maybe Americans are waking up and seeing that having trillions stolen from us is wrong. Or maybe, just maybe, Americans, contrary to what Obama is trying to ram through, don't want the government to be the answer for everything. If that were the case, we'd be a socialist country. Sorry, but I'm all for disruptions. Dissent is American. Opposing government intervention in everything is American. Not blindly following a president is American.
It'd be nice if more people woke up and got out of this "Democrats" versus "Republicans" mind set. Once you do, you see how you're being played by both sides. Otherwise, it's nothing but a bunch of sheep with no individual thoughts. How far we have fallen.
Here is some help from the dictionary...
–noun 1. a state in which the supreme power rests in the body of citizens entitled to vote and is exercised by representatives chosen directly or indirectly by them.
2. any body of persons viewed as a commonwealth.
3. a state in which the head of government is not a monarch or other hereditary head of state.
And finally - you do realize that China refers to itself as the People's REPUBLIC of China?
Now you said previously...
And then you dispute my dictionary defenition of "republic" with...
Now off you go for your basket weaving.
First, look to the proper definition of the Central Government, and see where the power and scope of that is suppossed to begin and end, then see how far it has strayed from its intents and purposes.
When the government itself is out-of-whack, all the definitions that may be applied to its form & operation are as off-kilter well.
Maybe it's because your eyes are closed and you've got fingers in your ears.
And the stolen trillions were by Bush though tax cuts for the rich and unnecessary wars. What did we get out of that? The rich got richer and soldiers ended up dead.
Obama's spending is an attempt to avert a depression and help people like you, mr. average American. Too bad blind partisanship keeps you from recognizing reality.
As for the stolen trillions, that's because Obama keeps having the Federal Reserve crank out dollars that become more worthless every day. Once those dollars are printed, somehow, the American people become responsible for debt they didn't ask for.
Mr. Obama's spending does nothing to help this economy. It doesn't create permanent jobs. It puts long-term tax burdens on all citizens. It's not capitalism.
And your economics degree is from where?
OR
You could cite some evidence that we're in a depression.
But you provided neither. No surprise here.
If not, I will not see your post as sincere.
no offense meant.
Why are you not asking to see John McCains or Sarah Palins birth certificate? Republicans pushing the bill to require presidents or presidential candidates to show their birth certificates should be carefull. It might backfire on them someday.
You may want to look elsewhere for help, Ken. He clearly has not done enough to help you.
The Public option appears to be SO simple. Yet it is emminently
deceptive.
Single payer is the path to even greater corruption and incompetence.
Just visit any country where the government runs the healthcare system.
You fuss about war killing and Wine about medically extending your life and how many people die form being under insured, Yet you support Abortions. So much for your beleif in The Right To LIFE.
You complain about the people who make money, but won't go out and make it yourself. You want Government to take over how much every one makes and how they live to spend it. Do you even know what LIBERTY means? Because your about to loose it.
If your Pursuit of Happiness is selective killing and being Government controlled, Then there are many other countries that you could go to live that kind of lifestyle.