About us Login Get email updates
Research
Print

Rove advances "glaring misstatements" and "distortions" in criticizing Obama speech

September 10, 2009 12:14 am ET — 32 Comments

Purporting to examine President Obama's health care speech, Karl Rove claimed that while discussing "the so-called lies and misstatements about his proposal," Obama "made a series of very glaring misstatements or distortions." In fact, it was Rove who was advancing falsehoods and distortions.

Please upgrade your flash player. The video for this item requires a newer version of Flash Player. If you are unable to install flash you can download a QuickTime version of the video.

EMBED

Rove: Obama advanced "a series of very glaring misstatements or distortions" during "gratuitously and bitterly partisan" speech

From the September 9 edition of Fox News' The O'Reilly Factor:

ROVE: This was not an exceptionally good speech. It was gratuitously and bitterly partisan. But I think the biggest problem was the section in which he talked about the so-called lies and misstatements about his proposal. He dealt with five of them, and in each one of them he made a series of very glaring misstatements or distortions.

Rove distorts "what people were concerned about" regarding "panels to kill off senior citizens"

Rove claims idea that bill "was setting up panels to kill off senior citizens" is "not what people were concerned about." Rove stated:

ROVE: He said -- he talked, first of all, about peoples' concern that this was setting up panels to kill off senior citizens, and he said that's false. Well, that's not what people were concerned about. What they were concerned about was the proposal that basically says we are going to incentivize doctors to sit down with you and go over end-of-life decisions. We have typically left that to a doctor, a lawyer -- the family lawyer, the family, your family faith giver, your family faith figure to help you arrive at that decision. Here we're going to pay doctors to sit down and go over your end of life decisions with you. [The O'Reilly Factor, 9/9/09]

In fact, conservative media figures falsely suggested health reforms would lead to denial of care for elderly. For example, Fox News' Peter Johnson Jr. claimed on Fox & Friends that health care reform is "the government deciding who will live, who will die." He later went on to ask: "Is that what this plan is about? To save money by killing old people? That's frightening. That's absolutely frightening." Similarly, on her radio show, regular O'Reilly Factor guest host Laura Ingraham asserted that Obama's "approach to health care reform" is "making sure people don't live as long."

Fox News personalities parroted Palin's end-of-life care "death panel" claim based on end-of-life counseling provision. Sarah Palin claimed that under Democratic health care reform, "Obama's 'death panel' " would "decide" whether her parents or her son Trig, who has Down syndrome, were "worthy of health care." Palin subsequently clarified that she had been referring to the House bill's end-of-life counseling provision. Several Fox News anchors, hosts, and contributors subsequently adopted Palin's "death panel" term or advanced or expressed support for her assertion. Media Matters for America subsequently documented more than 40 media reports debunking right-wing claims that the House health care reform bill would encourage euthanasia of the elderly.

Contradicting CBO, Rove suggests "most companies" will "dump the coverage" under House bill

Rove claims employer costs for health insurance exceed 8% fine for not providing it, so companies will "dump" coverage. Rove and O'Reilly had the following exchange:

ROVE: And he repeated -- he repeated the thing of no one's going to be -- tonight he had a different iteration. Earlier he said no one's going to be forced to give up your coverage. Nobody's going to force you into the government program. The fact of the matter is the program as it's designed in the House of Representatives bill, HR 3200, says if you're a business you can either continue to provide health care to your employees or you can pay a fine equal to 8 percent of your payroll costs. Well, for most companies, what they're now paying for health insurance is in excess of 8 percent of their payroll costs.

BILL O'REILLY (host): So they pay the fine -- so they pay the fine and you lose your health care.

ROVE: So they pay the fine, dump the coverage, and you're in the government program.

But according to the Congressional Budget Office, net employer coverage will increase under House bill. According to a July 26 CBO analysis of the House draft bill, a total of 162 million people would be covered through employer based policies in 2019, 2 million more than would be covered under current law.

According to CBO, only "about 3 million people" who would otherwise be covered under employer plans "would not have an offer of coverage under" HR 3200. In its July 26 analysis, CBO wrote:

Taking those considerations into account, some firms would probably decide not to offer coverage, CBO and the JCT staff estimate. That option would be most attractive to firms with lower-wage workers -- both because the play-or-pay penalty for not offering coverage would be smaller in dollar terms and because their workers would be eligible for larger subsidies in the insurance exchanges (or through Medicaid). An additional factor is that smaller firms (those with an annual payroll of less than $400,000) would either be exempt from the play-or-pay penalty or would pay a lower tax rate. However, an offsetting consideration is that small employers with low-wage workers would be eligible for a tax credit covering up to 50 percent of the employer's contribution toward health insurance premiums. On balance, CBO and the JCT staff estimate that, in 2016, about 3 million people (including spouses and dependents of workers) who would be covered by an employment-based plan under current law would not have an offer of coverage under the proposal.

Contrary to Rove's suggestion, those not offered employer coverage would not be forced into "the government program." Under the bill, those not offered coverage by their employers would be able to choose from the public and private insurance options available through the exchanges. CBO's "overall estimate" is that about one-third of people in the exchanges would choose the public option. Under the bill, eligible individuals would receive government subsidies regardless of whether they chose private or public insurance through the exchange.

Rove distorts Obama statement to claim he is "not shooting straight" on deficit

Rove says Obama "not shooting straight" on deficit claim because CBO says House bill "will add to the deficit." Rove stated:

ROVE: Well, he said it would not add to the deficit. The Congressional Budget Office says it will add to the deficit in the first 10 years because, remember, under his proposal, you have 10 years of tax increases and benefit cuts in Medicare to fund eight years or less of the program. So by the eighth and ninth year, you've run through the surplus you've built up in the first two years where all you're doing is collecting the money and not spending it, so it is in deficit by the tenth year. The CBO says that, and the CBO also said in a letter that it will get worse in the second 10 years. He's not shooting straight with us. This program has 10 years' worth of revenue to cover eight years of costs, so it's running annual deficits by -- I think it's the eighth year.

But Obama did not say the House bill didn't add to the deficit -- he said he "will not sign" a bill that did so. From Obama's speech:

Finally, let me discuss an issue that is a great concern to me, to members of this chamber, and to the public -- and that's how we pay for this plan. 

And here's what you need to know. First, I will not sign a plan that adds one dime to our deficits -- either now or in the future. (Applause.) I will not sign it if it adds one dime to the deficit, now or in the future, period.

Expand All Expand 1st Level Collapse All Add Comment
    • Author by nativeofsf (September 10, 2009 12:53 am ET)
      3  
      That god-less goddess of the elephantine's goodness & purity, spews forth, once again...drivel.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by teabaggers ♥ [wing]NUTS (September 10, 2009 3:39 am ET)
      1  
      lets keep in mind that, according to o'reilly, this is his definition of "the best healthcare analysis anywhere"... that is mind-boggling.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by canaanxing9025 (September 10, 2009 5:33 am ET)
      3  
      The man is a termite.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by IRONY 101 (September 10, 2009 8:00 am ET)
      4  
      Why isn't Karl Rove in jail?
      Report Abuse
      • Author by wzwriter (September 10, 2009 8:28 am ET)
        3 1
        Why arent Bush, Cheney, Rice, Runsfeld, Ashcroft, and Gonzales in jail along with him?
        Report Abuse
    • Author by dab55555 (September 10, 2009 8:09 am ET)
      1 5
      Not a good speech. The mans deaf, dumb, and blind. He hears thing no one else does, does not under stand the public fears, and sees no need to follow the laws of the land.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by mk3872 (September 10, 2009 8:27 am ET)
      2 1
      Lifelong, forever Republican H - A - C - K
      Report Abuse
    • Author by LORISNJ (September 10, 2009 8:28 am ET)
      4  
      Rove is not an American. I have not seen his birth certificate and I have no proof but word has it that he isn't 100% human either. If Rove had nothing to hide, why doesn't he show us proof of his heritage and lineage, DNA tests, and brain scans would be enough proof. Why doesn't he provide this proof, what is he hiding?
      Report Abuse
    • Author by rdirkse (September 10, 2009 9:18 am ET)
      4  
      Why does ANYONE listen to Rove or O'Reilly?
      Report Abuse
      • Author by srtsljr (September 10, 2009 7:07 pm ET)
           
        Only the ones that fail the "are you smarter than a fifth grader" audition.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by western_bronco (September 10, 2009 9:22 am ET)
        3
      Why didn't MMFA address the second point that Rove made about illegal aliens being covered under the President's plan? Why does the President keep using the 46 million-without-insurance number when everyone knows that includes 9 million illegal aliens (I believe it was the CBO that addressed that)?
      Report Abuse
      • Author by boohooliberals (September 10, 2009 3:15 pm ET)
          2
        I agree. This whole site is about selective quoting. Glenn Beck makes a multitude of accusations about Government corruption on his television show and yet we maybe see one a day make it here. Like always, the best spinsters excel at accusing others of spinning the news.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by my4cents (September 10, 2009 9:42 pm ET)
          1  
          Sure you do.
          You need to be registered on this web site before you can post. You go through the trouble of registering and choosing a very revealing posting handle.
          You then make a post that basically accuses this web site of sticking to its stated mission.
          What gives?
          PS: If you can prove selective quoting, in context, I will apologize for assuming you are a typical Tea Party guy (heard the term first time today from FoxNews's Greta), essentially a Rushbot.
          Report Abuse
      • Author by DellDolly (September 10, 2009 3:27 pm ET)
        3  
        http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/

        Politifact has determined that it was the Congressman from Carolina who lied, not Obama.

        Educate yourself.

        In spite of their claims, it was they themselves who were lying, not Obama.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by boohooliberals (September 10, 2009 5:21 pm ET)
             
          Funny I didnt see him at the podium last night.

          Besides Western_bronco was pointing out the use of the term 46 million includes illegal immigrants in the number of uninsured.

          Either he is including the illegals in this plan or he is using the padded number to prove that we NEED DRASTIC REFORM.

          The CBO also states that 20 million Americans can afford Health Insurance but choose to obtain it. Therefore the real number on unisured Americans that cannot afford it is actually 18 million. Typical politician using the numbers that fit his needs.
          Report Abuse
      • Author by pearlene_scott1602 (September 11, 2009 1:21 am ET)
        1  
        Why didn't MMFA address the second point that Rove made about illegal aliens being covered under the President's plan? Why does the President keep using the 46 million-without-insurance number when everyone knows that includes 9 million illegal aliens (I believe it was the CBO that addressed that)?


        IN ENGLISH!

        H.R. 3200 includes a provision that specifically says that there will be no federal funds spent to cover illegal immigrants:

        H.R. 3200: Sec 246 — NO FEDERAL PAYMENT FOR UNDOCUMENTED ALIENS

        Nothing in this subtitle shall allow Federal payments for affordability credits on behalf of individuals who are not lawfully present in the United States.

        The preceding section reiterates this, stating that “the term ‘affordable credit eligible individual’ means … an individual who is lawfully present in a State in the United States.” In other words, no federal subsidies for you if you’re in the country illegally. Besides, illegal immigrants aren’t eligible for federal health programs under current law. (Tax dollars do, however, cover emergency care.)

        Misleading GOP Health Care Claims...

        About half of illegal immigrants in the U.S. have health care coverage now.

        As the CBO itself said in a December 2008 report: “studies indicate that of the roughly 12 million unauthorized immigrants in this country [now], about half have health insurance and half are uninsured.” Those studies were done by the nonpartisan Pew Hispanic Center. Its oft-cited work on the numbers of unauthorized immigrants said that illegal immigrants were more likely to be uninsured principally because “the occupations and industries in which the unauthorized work tend to be those where employers do not provide insurance.”


        CBO...
        Report Abuse
      • Author by National_Insecurity (September 11, 2009 2:20 am ET)
           
        western_bronco wrote
        everyone knows that includes 9 million illegal aliens (I believe it was the CBO that addressed that)?

        WRONG!
        "The CBO doesn't include undocumented immigrants in its scoring."


        The fact is:
        RAND estimates 6-8 million undocumented immigrants without insurance. RAND is an outside consulting and research firm, not a part of US government.

        Let's look at it more realistically: 46-8= 38 million American citizens don't have health insurance. Many are traditional middle class families. For example the National Association of Realtors reports 24% of Realtors didn't have any health insurance in 2008. We should be ashamed.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by western_bronco (September 10, 2009 9:29 am ET)
        1
      Whoops, I was wrong. It wasn't the CBO, it was the Census Bureau that determined the 46-million-without-insurance includes nearly 10 million illegal aliens.

      Your text to link here...
      Report Abuse
      • Author by DellDolly (September 10, 2009 3:32 pm ET)
        1  
        The numbers are problematic in the context of health care reform, though, because they reflect U.S. citizens and non- citizens. The Census Bureau reported that 9.7 million of the 45.7 million uninsured were non-citizens.

        There's no evidence that there are nearly 10 million illegal immigrants. There are 9.7 million non-citizens that aren't insured.

        But the relevant number is how many uninsured there are. And FactCheck, who I trust more than the WSJ, says that no one knows how many illegal immigrants are included in that number.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by National_Insecurity (September 11, 2009 2:30 am ET)
          1  
          horse,
          F*** illegals. The problem is over 38 million American citizens are at risk going broke and dying due to rescission, pre-existing conditions, and private insurers that literally steal 25% of every dollar you give them.

          All this pointing at illegals and talking about tort reform is designed to distract us from the $350 billion that is being stolen in front of our eyes by private insurers and we don't see it.

          Do you see it?
          Report Abuse
    • Author by highliter (September 10, 2009 10:26 am ET)
        3
      The fact is that illegals will qualify simply because there is nothing in place to check citizenship. Illegals are not supposed to get drivers licenses, unemployment, welfare, ect and yet they do! The same thing will happen with health care. Obama is going require by law all citizens have health care coverage. Ok fine then what happens when an illegal shows up at the ER for treatment do we get to turn them away? No we wont and everyone else will have to pay for their continued abuse of our ERs. Also can someone please point me to where I can find Obama’s plan. He keeps talking about his plan but I have yet to see it in writing. I would like to read it so I can actually see some details. Does he support any of the current versions? I dont think he can because none of the current bill meet what he set forward in his speech last night.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by foghornleghorn (September 10, 2009 11:19 am ET)
        1  
        Check citizenship. Now who's the Nazi/communist/fascist?

        I betcha with the public option, you'll receive an insurance card. You know, with your name, SSN, etc. And then you'll have to present that before you can see your doctor.

        Illegals will probably still use the emergency room. Why not make them pay for it?

        And I've heard here many examples of Americans getting sick abroad and using that country's health system at a greatly reduced cost.
        Report Abuse
      • Author by congero6189599 (September 10, 2009 11:36 am ET)
        1  
        illegals don't get welfare or unemployment, they don't get DL from state agencies thats just your made up fantasies. No we won't turn a person in need away from our ER that would be inhumane,they will be treated and charged. What kind of callous person are you? Do you think the swine flu just spreads based on nationality and ability to pay? Can you erect a wall to protect you from the spread of a virus? Undocumented workers are not a drain on our economy and pay taxes both federal and state that they don't file for. Everytime they purchase goods they pay taxes and promote business locally. They do the back breaking work that supplies our stores with fresh food and meats and many jobs we take for granted that make life easier,with little gratitude or pay in return only to be scapegoated by skillful politicians and demogouges who know how to whip less thinking peoples fear of the "other" into a frenzy when times are tight. Here's a version :
        http://edlabor.house.gov/documents/111/pdf/publications/AAHCA-BillText-071409.pdf
        also you might benefit from going over this MMFA article "Myths and falsehoods about healthcare reform":
        http://mediamatters.org/research/200909080001
        Report Abuse
        • Author by boohooliberals (September 10, 2009 4:52 pm ET)
             
          You have to be kidding. Illegal immigrants cost American Tax payers Billions a year. According to FAIR (Federation for American Immigration Reform) they estimate that the "annual costs of illegal immigration from just three program areas — educating the children in public primary and secondary schools, providing medical services in emergency rooms, and incarceration — amount to about $36 billion."

          Further they state "Our estimate is that the annual fiscal costs in 2010 would increase by nearly 70 percent to $61.5 billion for just these same three program areas. The amount would swell by an additional nearly 73 percent to $106.3 billion by 2020."

          This is just for those three key areas. If you are so jaded that you dont believe that they will be overwhelming our Healthcare benefits with illegally obtained SSN's like they do with welfare and drivers licenses then you are severely disillusioned.

          Obama said last night that this program would exist without tax payers fitting the bill but instead would rely on Medicare cuts and removing waste and fraud. If that is so easy then no matter if this passes I think we should demand to see these changes implemented. I wont hold my breath.


          Report Abuse
          • Author by elric13 (September 11, 2009 7:14 pm ET)
               
            Regarding "FAIR"

            John Tanton founded FAIR in 1979. Between 1982 and 1994, it received more than $1.2 million from the Pioneer Fund. A little-known foundation created in 1937, the Pioneer Fund likes to benignly describe its origins in “the Darwinian-Galtonian evolutionary tradition, and the eugenics movement.” In the late 1930s, though, it frankly admired Hitler. Today, it still bankrolls groups such as the aforementioned American Renaissance and the American Immigration Control Foundation (AICF) in Virginia. As FAIR has attempted to develop a more mainstream persona, it has dropped the Pioneer Fund as a funding source. FAIR's executive director, Dan Stein, has repeatedly denied that any racial animus motivates its activities. But the federation has kept Tanton on its corporate board of directors.

            So they've taken money from a known neo-nazi group to spread their "message." Yep, I trust them.
            Report Abuse
      • Author by mikehuck1976 (September 11, 2009 12:33 pm ET)
           
        "The fact is that illegals will qualify simply because there is nothing in place to check citizenship." - hi

        So, hi, I have to ask. Are you now admitting that you really have no problem with fascism. In fact, you advocate it when it suits you. It's just Obama that you don't like, right?
        Report Abuse
    • Author by royman1 (September 10, 2009 6:02 pm ET)
      2  
      Good old Kreepy Karl! Gotta love a party whose spokesmen arrange themselves in circular firing squads with guns aimed at each other's feet.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by nematodeking (September 10, 2009 7:13 pm ET)
         
      This letter to the editor that follows was printed in The Austin Chronicle in March of 2005.

      The Beast Is Coming |

      Editor,

      Roky Erickson performed for the first time in almost a century, and I have been saying for years that once he gets the taste of performing there would be no stopping him. Saturday, that time came at Threadgill's World Headquarters' Ice Cream Social. He did the planned "Starry Eyes" and then typically unexpected launched into "The Beast,” I think most would have expected "You're Gonna Miss Me" if there were to be a miraculous second song. "The Beast" was followed by "Two-Headed Dog" and he was clearly going to do more, maybe several more songs, when the two mics went dead, the mics not the power. Grammy-winning sound engineer Chet Himes and his crew could not get the mics back on, so the set was over. Roky told Freddie Krc who had provided the backup, "Let's do some more!" Roky is back. I was hanging out near the front door to the restaurant when someone wearing a "Faux News" T-shirt (the one Fox failed to get suppressed) was approached by someone who suggested he go inside and show the shirt to Karl Rove, who was inside having dinner! Karl Rove! Having dinner in Threadgill's? I went in to see for myself and sure enough it was him! I took a photo! "The Beast is coming to your world ... the Beast is coming to your town ... the Beast is coming to your house!" sang Roky with intense urgency. The Beast was indeed in the house! When the Beast entered the building the mics went dead! Coincidence? I don't believe in gods or ghosts but I know the Beast when I see him.

      Jim Franklin
      Report Abuse
    • Author by lloydlevy (September 10, 2009 7:49 pm ET)
         
      Here's an insight as to why people might choose "the government program" for reasons other than necessity.

      Reflecting on the President’s speech, an editor at the Consumer Reports Health Blog related this personal experience. This is more than just a “war story” because it's a comparison based on a repeated test with natural controls. Sort of a micro-experiment.

      The subjects are the US and UK health care insurance and delivery systems. In the middle is our participant observer, who faced the same medical condition twice and was treated by the two health care regimes. With "price" out the the picture, the outcome is worth reflecting on for what it says about relative access, quality and overall satisfaction when private and public go head to head.

      The blog entry is titled:
      “A tale of two lumps: U.K. vs. U.S.” by Trisha Brandon, online editor, Consumer Reports Health Blog (September 10, 2009)

      Here’s the link:
      http://blogs.consumerreports.org/health/2009/09/a-tale-of-two-lumps-us-health-care-system-versus-uk-health-care-system-health-reform-stories-.html
      Report Abuse

my.MediaMatters.org

Login  Sign Up

Push Back

Phone calls, emails and letters from the public do make a difference. Remember that to be effective you must be polite, and professional. Express your specific concerns regarding that particular news report or commentary, and indicate what you would like the media outlet to do differently in the future.