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CNN's King falsely equates Obama calling "death panel" claims a "lie" with Wilson's outburst

September 13, 2009 3:21 pm ET — 23 Comments

CNN State of the Union host John King falsely equated President Obama's statement during his September 9 speech before a joint session of Congress that it's "a lie" that health reform proposals would "set up panels of bureaucrats with the power to kill off senior citizens" with Rep. Joe Wilson (R-SC) yelling "you lie" after Obama stated that reform "would not apply" to undocumented immigrants. But King ignored a crucial difference between Obama's statement about "death panels" and Wilson's interjection -- their accuracy: CNN reporters repeatedly debunked former Gov. Sarah Palin's "death panel" claim but concluded that Obama was "basically correct" in his statement regarding health care reform's coverage of undocumented immigrants.

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From the September 13 edition of CNN's State of the Union:

KING: As you know, some conservatives say there's a double standard. They say in his speech the president didn't name anybody, but he mentioned the so-called death panels and the controversy about that. And he said prominent politicians -- and we all know Governor Palin has been the leader in this effort -- have talked about these so-called death panels, and the president said that's a lie. He didn't name anybody, but he said that's a lie. I tried to ask the White House press secretary Robert Gibbs this morning, if that's a lie, and Governor Palin said it, does that make her a liar?

[begin video clip]

GIBBS: I think that for whatever reason, despite many media outlets saying that what Governor -- former Governor Palin was saying wasn't true, she continued to say it. I'll let Webster define how one -- what one calls her. I think in the absence of fact what happens --

KING: If it's not the truth, is she lying?

GIBBS: Well, in the absence of noble fact, sometimes what happens is we fill the void with stuff that quite frankly isn't true.

[end video clip]

KING: So if it's a lie from the floor is out of -- "you lie" from the floor is out of bounds, what about what the president said?

King: "So if ... 'you lie' from the floor is out of bounds, what about what the president said?"

King advances conservative claims of "double standard." Following a discussion of Wilson's interjection, King asserted that "some conservatives say there's a double standard" because Obama "mentioned the so-called death panels and the controversy about that. And he said prominent politicians -- and we all know Governor Palin has been the leader in this effort -- have talked about these so-called death panels, and the president said that's a lie." King later asked, "So if it's a lie from the floor is out of -- 'you lie' from the floor is out of bounds, what about what the president said?"

But according to CNN reporters, "death panel" claims are "not true," while Obama's statement on undocumented immigrants is "basically correct"

CNN's Levs reported Obama "basically correct" on undocumented immigrants claim. During a CNN "Truth Squad" segment, correspondent Josh Levs cited a PolitiFact.com article that called Wilson's claim "[f]alse." Levs reported: "This is PolitiFact.com right here, a reality-checking website. They take a look at it. They say that Joe Wilson was flat-out wrong. They give him a false on their ruling." Levs also reported, "You do have President Obama basically correct when he says the package of reforms that he is putting out there are not designed to apply to illegal immigrants." [CNN Newsroom, 9/10/09]

CNN reporters repeatedly debunked death panel falsehood. Numerous CNN figures debunked Palin's claim -- forwarded by the conservative media -- that the House health reform bill would create a "death panel." Correspondent Jessica Yellin said Palin's claim was "not true"; correspondent Jim Acosta referred to it as a "false claim"; and host Rick Sanchez said the assertion was "obviously not true."

Transcripts

From the September 13 edition of CNN's State of the Union:

KING: As you know, some conservatives say there's a double standard. They say in his speech the president didn't name anybody, but he mentioned the so-called death panels and the controversy about that. And he said prominent politicians -- and we all know Governor Palin has been the leader in this effort -- have talked about these so-called death panels, and the president said that's a lie. He didn't name anybody, but he said that's a lie. I tried to ask the White House press secretary Robert Gibbs this morning, if that's a lie, and Governor Palin said it, does that make her a liar?

[begin video clip]

GIBBS: I think that for whatever reason, despite many media outlets saying that what Governor -- former Governor Palin was saying wasn't true, she continued to say it. I'll let Webster define how one -- what one calls her. I think in the absence of fact what happens --

KING: If it's not the truth, is she lying?

GIBBS: Well, in the absence of noble fact, sometimes what happens is we fill the void with stuff that quite frankly isn't true.

[end video clip]

KING: So if it's a lie from the floor is out of -- "you lie" from the floor is out of bounds, what about what the president said?

From the September 10 edition of CNN Newsroom:

HEIDI COLLINS (host): It's the outburst that has people talking today. A Republican congressman calls the president a liar. The reason: President Obama in his speech last night said health care reforms would not cover illegal immigrants.

We've talked about the issue on our show here. So who's right?

Let's call in the "Truth Squad," and CNN's Josh Levs.

Good morning, Josh.

LEVS: Good morning to you, Heidi.

Yes, it was interesting to see that happen last night. And what I want to do now is talk to you through some of the basics of what everyone is taking a look at today.

This is PolitiFact.com right here, a reality-checking website. They take a look at it. They say that Joe Wilson was flat-out wrong. They give him a false on their ruling.

Now at the "Truth Squad," we have looked at this issue in the past as well. And what I need to do here is kind of dig in to the weeds with you. Keep in mind there is no final bill. I can't say that enough. But a lot of people concerned about this issue are pointing to this bill here in the House.

Now I want everyone to see something it says right here. It talks about subsidies to help people buy health insurance, and it specifically says nothing here shall allow federal payments for affordability credits on behalf of individuals who are not lawfully present in the United States.

So when it comes to those subsidies, it specifically says, you know what? No, illegal immigrants cannot get that. But here's something on the other side. Check this out.

The Congressional Research Service, which is nonpartisan, they did their own study, and they said, wait a second, this bill does not contain any restrictions on noncitizens participating in the exchange, whether they're here legally or illegally.

Now, I want everyone to understand what I'm talking about here. So we have a pretty simple graphic. Let's go to it.

The health insurance exchange is part of what President Obama is suggesting. It would be there for consumers to look at different plans and choose one. Illegal immigrants, the Congressional Research Service is saying, would be able to buy a plan under that exchange. However, millions already do. Millions of illegal immigrants are already buying plans out there, Heidi.

So what we're not talking about it is the government coming along and insuring them. So put all that together. You do have President Obama basically correct when he says the package of reforms that he is putting out there are not designed to apply to illegal immigrants -- Heidi.

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    • Author by jwcoop715110 (September 13, 2009 4:01 pm ET)
      9  
      Equating a lie with the truth is what stuck us shrub in the first place.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by eb (September 13, 2009 4:16 pm ET)
      7  
      The teabaggers need the president to play the role of the devil. Therefor he must be for death panels that remove healthcare for the old and weak. This dovetails well with his policy of giving illegal immigrants world class healthcare at the expense of hard working law abiding citizens. Also, in spite of the fact that single payer plans are off the table, Obama must be a foreign born islamic socialist who will indoctinate your children instantly with his sinister charisma.

      Report Abuse
    • Author by borealis (September 13, 2009 5:23 pm ET)
         
      I always expect John King to use false equivalence and he did it repeatedly and obnoxiously. My disgust would have been wasted on him. I saved my disgust for people like Robert Gibbs and Donna Brazile because they played silly word games with King instead of telling him to cut it out and re-framing his stupid questions into a real discussion of lies, liars, and their impact on our democratic process.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by ReasonAndResolve (September 13, 2009 5:26 pm ET)
      8  
      Not to put too fine a point on it, but President Obama had the floor when he called death panels a lie. Rep. Wilson did not have the floor.

      It is perfectly acceptable to call opposition politicians liars when one has the floor.

      Call a meeting, Joe, but don't interrupt the president.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by mustardman (September 13, 2009 5:43 pm ET)
      9  
      King is just like Hannity except he has a bit more savy in twisting and spinning the lies.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by Don Hussein Fabuloso (September 13, 2009 7:32 pm ET)
        10  
        And once again, truth and fiction are simply two equal, opposing viewpoints.

        ... Governor Palin ...[has] talked about these so-called death panels, and the president said that's a lie... if that's a lie, and Governor Palin said it, does that make her a liar?


        No need for the "if" in there, King. It is a lie, as anybody with a functioning brain and at least a mild interest in current events should know, and any member of the media should be embarrassed to not know.

        And using the word "if", framing it as a "possibility" rather than established fact, is inexcusable.

        It is a lie, Sarah Palin repeated that lie, she is a liar. This isn't "name-calling" or a personal attack, it's reality.

        This should be noted by the teabagger posters here who cry bloody murder about the mean name-calling every time they're called liars in response to their lies. You have the power to stop justified legitimate name calling in this case. Like Obama, you may not be able to prevent the type of unjustified, dishonest name-calling that Joe Wilson did, but if that happens, you'll have the high road.



        Report Abuse
        • Author by bobklahn (September 14, 2009 3:03 am ET)
          3  
          Do not jump to the conclusion that Palin is a liar. You have to allow for the possibility that she is just a fool.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by Easy to refute wingnuts (September 14, 2009 8:25 am ET)
            4  
            Palin the fool and Palin the liar are not two mutually exclusive concepts. I'm willing to give her the benefit of the doubt and say that both are true.
            Report Abuse
        • Author by Conchobhar (September 14, 2009 1:06 pm ET)
          3  
          Interesting, isn't it, Colonal, that the Right finds an equivalence between falsehood and fact, but loves to accuse the Left of "moral relativism"?
          Report Abuse
          • Author by Don Hussein Fabuloso (September 14, 2009 4:51 pm ET)
            2  
            Exactly what I've been thinking, Con. They seem to be very good at black & white thinking, except in the most black & white areas.
            Report Abuse
        • Author by steeve (September 14, 2009 7:01 pm ET)
             
          Obviously she isn't a liar, because one of our spongey pansy democrats didn't say so.

          If Gibbs would have agreed that Palin is a liar, he'd later have to apologize for being a meany. And that matters more than the health of millions.

          If republicans get power again, I won't blame the media this time. They're now a permanently known quantity, as are the republicans. Known quantities are easy for sentient people to deal with.
          Report Abuse
    • Author by NiceguyEddie (September 14, 2009 9:09 am ET)
      1  
      Nice liberla media we've got here, huh?

      Obama's truth is the same as Wilson's lie and yet somehow the press is in the tank for Obama, in LOVE with him in fact!

      But OMG, try getting a conservtive otherwise!

      ----------------------------------------------------------------
      These people so p!ss me off!
      Report Abuse
      • Author by wookie (September 14, 2009 10:07 am ET)
        4  
        I would love to see them explain to a judge why it doesn't matter which witness is telling the truth because each side thinks the other is lying.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by SMTDL (September 14, 2009 10:30 am ET)
      1  
      King shows both Bias and Stupidity for ignoring context to equate these issues.The President didn't name one person (and there have been many )claiming "Death Panels" which has been well debunked many times.It is a fact that what the president said is in the bill regarding no coverage for illegals..so Wilson is wrong to say it is a lie.Obvious there will be differences in interpretation of what happens during actual implementation which is different than refuting a statement as an untruth!!!For Wilson to say it while the President has the floor and to bascically be at least somewhat wrong on what are facts is far different than saying in general the Death Panel notion is a Lie!!! Sarah Palin is hiding on Twitter and never gets challenged in an interview on her outrageous claims..how does she deserve to even be in this conversation!??
      Report Abuse
    • Author by epkklk851 (September 14, 2009 11:22 am ET)
      1  
      Actually, I was a bit surprised the President was willing to address the lies point blank. Yes, he did call them lies (they are) and by implication, he called everyone who spread them liars (a liar spreads a lie, whether they know it to be a lie or not). This would include former Governor Palin. The difference between what President Obama did and what Representative Wilson did is a matter of time and place. To just shout out a scurilous exclamation in the middle of a speech is rude to the speaker and the audience. This was not a town hall, these were not your buddies in the rec room, this was a nationally (internationally) telecast speech by the President to a joint session of Congress. He was rude and there is no other polite description for what he did, even if the President had been lying (which he wasn't.) Wilson is a boor! And Governor Palin is either a liar or a fool spreading someone else's lies, but in either case, she is not serving the people because she should know better.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by Conchobhar (September 14, 2009 1:18 pm ET)
        2  
        "(a liar spreads a lie, whether they know it to be a lie or not)."

        Not in all cases. If a person, believing him/herself to be speaking the truth, utters misinformation, that person is not lying. Lying is deceiving with the intent to deceive. Now if a person takes someone like Beck or Limbaugh at their word, refuses to look at primary sources, and repeats that drivel, you could make a strong case for culpability.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by epkklk851 (September 14, 2009 1:39 pm ET)
          3  
          You did a much better job of expressing what I meant. Fools repeat things without checking them out. I remember the first time I heard the $250 Chocolate Chip recipe story. I was taken in, and I have never figured out if the person who told me was being foolish, or lying. I would like to think she was fooled, too. I love Snopes.com.
          Report Abuse
    • Author by congero6189599 (September 14, 2009 1:24 pm ET)
      1  
      This is the state of journalism today. Does King have any responsibility to inform his viewers of the truth? Did he investigate or research the bills? It's exactly as Col. succintly put, to them truth and fiction are just two opposing points of view. I'am not a trained reporter but if someone made a claim like Sarah Palin has I would investigate it and report what I found. What would you call someone Mr. King that says something that is not true? If reporters were doing their jobs liars would not be able to get away with their lies,but they know they will not suffer any consequences from the MSM. Can anyone say Pat Buchanan!
      Report Abuse
      • Author by Conchobhar (September 14, 2009 1:42 pm ET)
        1  
        I think this is the highly predictible result of corporate consolidation of news outlets, and the change in mission of TV news from public service to profit center. The leashes are much shorter than they used to be, and the "suits" make more editorial decisions than the "ink-stained wretches."
        Report Abuse
    • Author by jcalton (September 14, 2009 2:06 pm ET)
         
      Wouldn't "CNN's King" be...Larry King?
      Report Abuse
    • Author by jcalton (September 14, 2009 2:06 pm ET)
         
      Wouldn't "CNN's King" be...Larry King?
      Report Abuse

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