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Nothing to see here: Right-wing media dismiss notion of nationwide "Islamophobia"

August 26, 2010 12:16 pm ET — 88 Comments

In recent days, right-wing media have dismissed the idea of a nationwide "Islamophobia." In fact, there has been a well-documented trend of "Islamophobia" throughout the country in the wake of the right wing's extreme anti-Muslim rhetoric over the planned Islamic community center in Manhattan.

Ignoring recent anti-Muslim incidents, right-wing media dismiss nationwide trend of "Islamophobia"

Jonah Goldberg: "There isn't an anti-Muslim climate." In an August 26 column, titled, "The Islamophobia myth," Jonah Goldberg addressed a recent attack on a Muslim cab driver in New York City and wrote: "It's unavoidable that many will cite this as proof of the national wave of 'Islamophobia,' touted by Time magazine and other media outlets. We'll have to wait for the facts, but even if the allegations prove true, one assault doesn't a national trend make." Goldberg further asserted, "There isn't an anti-Muslim climate."

NY Post: "Certainly, there is no cresting wave of bigotry about to roll over Muslims in America." In an August 26 editorial, the New York Post also addressed the attack and stated, "[S]o far there is scant evidence of broad, anti-Islamic attacks." The Post later added: "Certainly, there is no cresting wave of bigotry about to roll over Muslims in America: There are now slightly more than 100 such attacks each year -- this in a nation of 310-plus million people."

However, mosques throughout U.S. have recently suffered vandalism

Vandalism at California mosque reportedly investigated as a hate crime; vandalism made reference to "Temple for the God of terrorism at Ground Zero." An August 25 Fresno Bee article reported that "[v]andalism to a Madera Islamic center and signs found on the property are being investigated as a hate crime." The article stated that a brick was thrown through a window and that signs reading, "No Temple for the God of terrorism at Ground Zero. ANB"; "Wake up America, the Enemy is here. ANB"; and "American Nationalist Brotherhood" were found at the mosque.

AP: "Foes of proposed mosques have deployed dogs to intimidate Muslims holding prayer." On August 8, The Associated Press reported on incidents of anti-Muslim vandalism in Tennessee and California, noting that "[f]oes of proposed mosques have deployed dogs to intimidate Muslims holding prayer services and spray painted 'Not Welcome' on a construction sign, then later ripped it apart." The AP further reported:

The 13-story, $100 million Islamic center that could soon rise two blocks from the site of the Sept. 11 attacks would dwarf the proposals elsewhere, yet the smaller projects in local communities are stoking a sharper kind of fear and anger than has showed up in New York.

In the Nashville suburb of Murfreesboro, opponents of a new Islamic center say they believe the mosque will be more than a place of prayer. They are afraid the 15-acre site that was once farmland will be turned into a terrorist training ground for Muslim militants bent on overthrowing the U.S. government.

"They are not a religion. They are a political, militaristic group," said Bob Shelton, a 76-year-old retiree who lives in the area.

Shelton was among several hundred demonstrators recently who wore "Vote for Jesus" T-shirts and carried signs that said: "No Sharia law for USA!," referring to the Islamic code of law. Others took their opposition further, spray painting the sign announcing the "Future site of the Islamic Center of Murfreesboro" and tearing it up.

In Temecula, Calif., opponents brought dogs to protest a proposed 25,000-square-foot mosque that would sit on four acres next to a Baptist church. Opponents worry it will turn the town into haven for Islamic extremists, but mosque leaders say they are peaceful and just need more room to serve members.

Anti-Islam graffiti found at Texas mosque, and is reportedly thought to be related to Park51 protests. According to a local WFAA News 8 report, vandals spray-painted "[s]tick-figure graffiti ... depicting Uncle Sam sexually assaulting Allah" on the parking lot of a mosque in Arlington, Texas. The report also noted that a playground behind the mosque was set on fire, and quoted the mosque's president, Jamal Qaddura, as saying that "whoever did this might also have tried to burn the mosque itself by pulling apart old gas lines." Qaddura also said "that he believes the damage may be linked to resentment over a planned Islamic community center near Ground Zero in Manhattan."

Islamic Center of Northeast Florida was firebombed. Jacksonville, Florida's, First Coast News reported that on May 10, a man attempted to firebomb the Islamic Center of Northeast Florida "shortly before evening prayers." The Florida Times-Union later reported that "[a]uthorities found remnants of a crude pipe bomb in the explosion" and that "at the time of the blast about 60 people were inside." The article quoted FBI Special Agent-in-Charge Jim Casey as discussing the potential destruction and death the blast could have caused were it not for "the strength of the mosque building." The article also reported that "law enforcement officials" were surprised that "they had not gotten nearly as many calls as they expected" regarding the identity of the bomber after they released security video of the man. From The Florida Times-Union:

A day after releasing security video of the man suspected of firebombing a Jacksonville mosque, law enforcement officials acknowledged they had not gotten nearly as many calls as they expected.

"Someone out there knows who this person is," said FBI Special Agent-in-Charge Jim Casey of Jacksonville office. "Anyone who recognizes this individual needs to contact us."

[...]

This was not a harmless prank," Casey said. "We found shrapnel from the blast a hundred yards away close to [Florida] 9A."

At the time of the blast about 60 people were inside. The firebomb caused minor damage to the building. There were no injuries.

Casey said the minor damage was primarily due to the strength of the mosque building. If anyone had been closer to the blast, they would have been injured or killed, he said.

Florida church plans to burn copies of the Quran on 9-11. The Gainesvlle Sun reported on August 18 that the Dove World Outreach Center in Gainesville, Florida, plans to "set fire to copies of the Quran on Sept. 11." The New York Times reported that Terry Jones, a pastor at the church, posted a sign at the church last year that stated, "Islam is of the devil."

In wake of Park51 controversy, protests of local mosques have occurred nationwide

Staten Island, NY: "Muslim groups have encountered unexpectedly intense opposition to their plans for opening mosques in Lower Manhattan, in Brooklyn and most recently in an empty convent on Staten Island." A June 10 New York Times article reported on opposition to a proposed mosque in Staten Island, New York, that "have focused overwhelmingly on more intangible and volatile issues: fear of terrorism, distrust of Islam and a linkage of the two in opponents' minds." From The New York Times article:

Some opponents have cited traffic and parking concerns. But the objections have focused overwhelmingly on more intangible and volatile issues: fear of terrorism, distrust of Islam and a linkage of the two in opponents' minds.

''Wouldn't you agree that every terrorist, past and present, has come out of a mosque?'' asked one woman who stood up Wednesday night during a civic association meeting on Staten Island to address representatives of a group that wants to convert a Roman Catholic convent into a mosque in the Midland Beach neighborhood.

''No,'' began Ayman Hammous, president of the Staten Island branch of the group, the Muslim American Society -- though the rest of his answer was drowned out by catcalls and boos from among the 400 people who packed the gymnasium of a community center.

[...]

''We are newcomers, and newcomers in America have always had to prove their loyalty,'' said Mahdi Bray, the society's executive director. ''It's an old story. You have to have thick skin.''

That admonition was tested on Wednesday, as irate residents took turns at the microphone, demanding answers from the three Muslim men who had accepted the get-acquainted invitation of the civic association.

''I was on the phone this morning with the F.B.I., and all I want to know from you is why MAS is on the terrorist watch list,'' said Joan Moriello, using the acronym for the Muslim American Society. Her question produced a loud, angry noise from the audience.

Mr. Hammous, a physical therapist who lives on Staten Island, exchanged a puzzled look with two other Muslim men who had joined him on the podium, both officers of the society's Brooklyn branch, which operates a mosque in Bensonhurst and faces opposition to opening another in Sheepshead Bay.

''Your information is incorrect, madam,'' he replied. ''We are not on any watch list.'' The other men, Mohamed Sadeia and Abdel Hafid Djamil, shook their heads in agreement.

The State Department maintains a terrorist watch list for foreign organizations, and the Justice Department has identified domestic groups it considers unindicted co-conspirators in various terror-related prosecutions. The American Muslim Society is on neither of those lists.

Murfreesboro, TN: Mosque opponents are afraid the mosque "will be turned into a terrorist training ground." An August 8 AP article reported on the protests surrounding a proposed Islamic center in Murfreesboro, Tennessee, by noting that "opponents of a new Islamic center say they believe the mosque will be more than a place of prayer. They are afraid the 15-acre site that was once farmland will be turned into a terrorist training ground for Muslim militants bent on overthrowing the U.S. government." From the AP:

In the Nashville suburb of Murfreesboro, opponents of a new Islamic center say they believe the mosque will be more than a place of prayer. They are afraid the 15-acre site that was once farmland will be turned into a terrorist training ground for Muslim militants bent on overthrowing the U.S. government.

"They are not a religion. They are a political, militaristic group," said Bob Shelton, a 76-year-old retiree who lives in the area.

Shelton was among several hundred demonstrators recently who wore "Vote for Jesus" T-shirts and carried signs that said: "No Sharia law for USA!," referring to the Islamic code of law. Others took their opposition further, spray painting the sign announcing the "Future site of the Islamic Center of Murfreesboro" and tearing it up.

Temecula, CA: "Foes of proposed mosques have deployed dogs to intimidate Muslims holding prayer services and spray painted 'Not Welcome' on a construction sign." The AP also reported, "In Temecula, Calif., opponents brought dogs to protest a proposed 25,000-square-foot mosque that would sit on four acres next to a Baptist church. Opponents worry it will turn the town into haven for Islamic extremists, but mosque leaders say they are peaceful and just need more room to serve members." An August 19 Christian Science Monitor article further reported:

Protesters with bullhorns have shown up during afternoon prayers at the Islamic Center of Temecula Valley in California.

The Muslim group there hopes to erect a 24,000 square foot mosque and Islamic center on some vacant land it owns.

The protesters were mainly concerned about Islam, carrying such signs as "No Allah Law Here."

The mosque has also been criticized by Bill Rench, pastor of Calvary Baptist Church, which would be the mosque's neighbor. Mr. Rench has told the Monitor in the past, "We don't want to do anything that encourages Islam."

But the imam of the mosque, who has the support of a local interfaith council, has tried to mend fences with Rench, offering to explain Islam. "I would like to have a meeting with the pastor," Imam Mahmoud Harmoush told the Monitor earlier.

So far, mosque officials say that effort has not been successful.

Officials hope to complete the mosque at the end of next year.

Florence, KY: "Stop the Mosque," and "the takeover of our country." The Courier-Journal (Louisville, Kentucky) reported in an August 16 article that a planned mosque in Florence, Kentucky, has drawn protests. From the article:

Florence city officials say they have gotten several calls about the proposed worship center and a flier is being distributed in the city's neighborhoods.

There is also a website run by a Boone County resident that posts anti-Islamic messages and encourages people to "Stop the Mosque."

[...]

"Cayton Road is in your neighborhood," the flier states. "Everyone needs to contact Florence City Council to have this stopped. Americans need to stop the takeover of our country."

Protesters at Connecticut mosque reportedly chanted "hate-filled slogans." An August 9 New Haven Register article reported that "Connecticut Muslim leaders are urging public officials and police to assure they can worship without being harassed after members of a Dallas-based group showed up outside a Bridgeport mosque Friday chanting what have been described as hate-filled slogans." The article further reported:

The organization involved in the Bridgeport incident, Operation Save America, is primarily an anti-abortion group that was once known as Operation Rescue.

But members of the group stood outside the mosque as worshippers prepared for the upcoming observance of Ramadan, according to Mongi Dhaouadi, executive director of Connecticut office of the Council on American-Islamic Relations, and chanted hate-filled slogans. Dhaouadi said the protesters said things like, "Islam is a lie" and "Jesus hates Muslims."

Anti-Park51 protests have been full of right-wing hate

Anti-Park51 protesters harass African-American man at Park51 protest. The Huffington Post noted on August 23 that "opponents of a proposed Islamic center near Ground Zero accosted a black man who tried to navigate through a crowd of anti-mosque protesters." The Huffington Post included video of the incident.

AP reports on anti-Muslim rhetoric at Park51 protest, including protesters who believe Sharia law to be based in violence and that the organizers behind Park51 are "the same people who took down the twin towers." An August 23 Associated Press article on an anti-Park51 which occurred that day, reported:

Signs hoisted by dozens of protesters standing behind police barricades read "SHARIA" -- using dripping, blood-red letters to describe Islam's Shariah law, which governs the behavior of Muslims.

Steve Ayling, a 40-year-old Brooklyn plumber who carried his sign to a dry spot by an office building, said the people behind the mosque project are "the same people who took down the twin towers."

[...]

On a nearby sidewalk, police chased away a group that unfurled a banner with images of beating, stoning and other torture they said was committed by those who followed Islamic law.

A mannequin wearing a keffiyeh, a traditional Arab headdress, was mounted on one of two mock missiles that were part of an anti-mosque installation. One missile was inscribed with the words: "Again? Freedom Targeted by Religion"; the other with "Obama: With a middle name Hussein. We understand. Bloomberg: What is your excuse?"

[...]

"This is sacred ground and it's where my son was buried," the native Israeli from Queens said. She said the mosque would be "like a knife in our hearts."

She was joined by a close friend, Kobi Mor, who flew from San Francisco to participate in the rally.

If the mosque gets built, "we will bombard it," Mor said. He would not elaborate but added that he believes the project "will never happen."

Reuters: One sign read: "Everything I Ever Needed to Know about Islam I Learned on 9/11." According to a Reuters report on the August 22 protest, "One sign read: 'Everything I Ever Needed to Know about Islam I Learned on 9/11.'" From Reuters:

Many in the crowd opposing the center were firefighters and construction workers, who carried signs reading: "This is Sacred Ground to New Yorkers."

One sign read: "Everything I Ever Needed to Know about Islam I Learned on 9/11."

Protest sign: "Islam + Shariah Law = Barborism (sic)." Fox news aired footage of the August 22 protest showing a sign which read, "Islam + Shariah law = Barborism [sic]." From the August 23 broadcast of Fox News' Fox & Friends:

protestsign1

Numerous signs depict "Sharia" written in blood: As the AP reported, during the August 22 protest, "Signs hoisted by dozens of protesters standing behind police barricades read 'SHARIA' -- using dripping, blood-red letters to describe Islam's Shariah law, which governs the behavior of Muslims."

protestsign2

Installation featured Muslim in keffiyeh riding a missile that said "Again? Freedom Targeted by Religion." The AP reported that at the August 22 protest, "A mannequin wearing a keffiyeh, a traditional Arab headdress, was mounted on one of two mock missiles that were part of an anti-mosque installation. One missile was inscribed with the words: 'Again? Freedom Targeted by Religion.'" The AP added that the second missile said, "Obama: With a middle name Hussein. We understand. Bloomberg: What is your excuse?"

protestsign3

protestsign4

Sign: "No clubhouse for terrorists." A Reuters photograph of the August 22 protest shows a man holding a sign, saying, "No Clubhouse for Terrorists."

protestsign5

Protest sign: "We don't need a monument to those who attacked our country at ground zero." A different Reuters photograph of the August 22 protest shows a man holding the following sign:

protestsign6

Protest sign: "Islam is no longer a legitimate religion." From the New York Post:

protestsign7

Previous Park51 protests also featured inflammatory imagery and rhetoric

Protest sign: "Building a Mosque at Ground Zero is Like Building a memorial to Hitler at Auschwitz." The August 2 broadcast of Fox News' Happening Now featured footage of a recent protest against Park51, which included a sign that read, "Building a Mosque at Ground Zero is Like Building a memorial to Hitler at Auschwitz." From Happening Now:

protestsign8

Protest sign: "Proud to be an Islamophobe." Happening Now  also showed footage of an anti-Park 51 protester which read, "Jesus died to save you Allah wants you to kill for him! Proud to be an Islamophobe." From Happening Now:

protestsign9

Protest sign: "Islam = Hate"; "Islam = terrorist"; "Islam = Killing." Eye on the World blog posted a "photo report" from Pam Geller's June 6 Park51 protest. Geller linked to the "photo report" in a blog post touting her protest. From Eye on the World:

protestsign10

Protest sign invokes Nazis, calls Islam "the Enemy." From Eye on the World's "photo report":

protestsign11

Protest sign: "Mosques Breed Radical Islam ... Radical Islam Breeds Terrorists." From Eye of the World:

protestsign12

Protest sign compares mosque to a toilet, asks, "Do you want this built on Ground Zero? I don't!!!!!" From Eye of the World's complete "anti-mosque protest" photo gallery:

protestsign13

Protest sign: "Islam Kills." From Eye of the World's complete "anti-mosque protest" photo gallery:

protestsign14

Right-wing media have relentlessly attacked Park 51 and Islam, often with extreme rhetoric

Gingrich compares Islamic center to Nazis erecting sign near Holocaust museum, Japanese site near Pearl Harbor. On the August 16 edition of Fox & Friends, Newt Gingrich said: "Nazis don't have the right to put up a sign next to the Holocaust museum in Washington. We would never accept the Japanese putting up a site next to Pearl Harbor. There's no reason for us to accept a mosque next to the World Trade Center."

Nugent: "The mosque will attract extremists and radicals who will try to harm America." In an August 19 Washington Times op-ed attacking Park51, Ted Nugent wrote that "[t]he mosque will attract extremists and radicals who will try to harm America." Nugent repeatedly referred to Islam as a "voodoo religion" and concluded, "If additional American blood is spilled in the Big Apple, the politicians who supported this mosque will be as guilty as the Muslim voodoo kooks who love death and destruction in the name of Allah."

Cal Thomas repeatedly suggests Park51 would be a terrorist front. In an August 3 column, conservative commentator Cal Thomas wrote: "Ask yourself: if you wanted to infiltrate a country, wouldn't a grand strategy be to rapidly build mosques from Ground Zero in New York, to Temecula, Calif., and establish beachheads so fanatics could plan and advance their strategies under the cover of religious freedom and that great American virtue known as 'tolerance,' which is being used against us?" In a July 21 post on The Washington Post's On Faith blog, Thomas wrote:

A mosque near Ground Zero is not about tolerance, but triumphalism. It isn't about honoring the dead, but celebrating their deaths.

[...]

Don't we know why our enemies desire a beachhead in America? They wish to launch new terror attacks and forcibly convert Americans to their way of thinking and believing. What will we gain by allowing this to happen?

Morris: Park 51 will be used to "train and recruit Sharia law advocates who become terrorists." On the August 19 edition of Fox & Friends, Fox News contributor Dick Morris cited a study that he claimed said "80 percent of the mosques ... teach Sharia law as the main event." Morris later claimed that Park 51 will be used to "study and promote and train and recruit Sharia law advocates, which, who become terrorists."

Morris: "[T]hese Sharia mosques ... have become the command center for terrorists" and Park51 "would be, too." On the August 18 edition of Fox News' The O'Reilly Factor, during a discussion of Park51, Morris claimed "these Sharia mosques ... have become the command centers for terrorists," adding, "so this one would be, too."

Bolling: Park51 "may be a meeting place for some of the scariest minds -- some of the biggest terrorist minds." On the August 19 edition of Fox & Friends, Fox Business host Eric Bolling claimed that Park51 "may be a meeting place for some of the scariest minds -- some of the biggest terrorist minds."

Kilmeade: "The next Hamburg cell could be right downtown." During the discussion with Bolling on the August 19 Fox & Friends, co-host Brian Kilmeade said of Park51, "The next Hamburg cell could be right downtown." A terrorist cell in Hamburg, Germany, whose members would later become the 9-11 hijackers, is believed to be the origin of the 9-11 plot.

Limbaugh suggests Park51 would be a "recruiting tool for domestic extremists." On the August 3 edition of his nationally syndicated radio show, Rush Limbaugh stated that if the Guantanamo Bay detention center "is a recruiting tool for foreign extremists, what about a World Trade Center mosque being a recruiting tool for domestic extremists?"

Fox guest suggests Islamic cultural center is intended to "trumpet" Muslim conquest. On the August 16 edition of Fox & Friends, guest Jeanine Pirro -- former Republican candidate for New York state attorney general -- said, "I think the whole idea of the mosque is outrageous, and if you're a student of history, you know that mosques are often built to trumpet their victories."

Franklin Graham: "True Islam" can't be practiced in U.S. because "you cannot beat your wife, you cannot do honor killings." On the August 19 broadcast of CNN's John King USA, Franklin Graham repeated his frequent attacks on Islam, claiming that "remember true Islam cannot be practiced here in this country. You cannot beat your wife. You cannot do honor killing if you think your daughter has been misbehaved. You cannot kill her. And they're protected by the laws of this country. We're not under Sharia law. We're under the Constitution of the United States. And so we're protected."

Beck asks, "[A]fter you've killed 3,000 people, you're going to now build your mosque?" On his August 18 radio show, Glenn Beck said of Park51, "You look for things that are uniting, I'm sorry, but the Cordoba Project is not uniting. If you wanted to unite people, you don't spit in their face. You don't spit in their face. On the 10th anniversary, after you've killed 3,000 people, you're going to now build your mosque on there, really?" Beck has repeatedly falsely claimed that Park51 was scheduled to open on September 11, 2011. He has also referred to the Islamic center as "the 9-11 mosque" and has wondered if it is "a possibility" that Park51's location is about "inoculation."

Limbaugh calls Islamic center "a victory monument at Ground Zero." On August 17, Limbaugh called Park51 "a victory monument at Ground Zero, which is what this mosque is." He added: "The real question is why do people who don't like this country want that mosque there? What is so important about having it there?"

Palin calls Park 51 a "stab in the heart" for Americans and a "slap" to 9-11 victims. During the August 16 edition of Fox News' On the Record, Fox News contributor Sarah Palin claimed that it was "an insensitive move on the part of those Muslims who want to build that mosque in this location. It feels like a stab in the heart to, collectively, Americans who still have that lingering pain from 9-11." Palin later said, "[T]his is a slap to those innocent victims who were murdered that day on 9-11."

Hoft dubs Park 51 the "Ground Zero Victory Mosque." In an August 16 Gateway Pundit post, Jim Hoft touted Fox News' Bill O'Reilly's criticism of Obama's comments about Park 51 and described the Islamic community center as the "Ground Zero Victory Mosque."

Washington Times: "If the mosque is constructed, the terrorists win." In an August 19 editorial, The Washington Times stated of the planned Islamic community center in New York City: "The Ground Zero Mosque is not healing a rift but deepening a wound. If the mosque is constructed, the terrorists win."

Beck on Park51: "Why don't we build it on the graves of people that lost their lives?" On his August 16 radio show, Beck asked, "Why don't we build it on the graves of people that lost their lives?" Beck added, "Where are the American Muslims" speaking out against the Islamic community center?"

BigPeace.com: Violence against women is "taking place almost exclusively from within Islamic communities." An August 9 post on Andrew Brietbart's BigPeace.com claims that "previously unimagined assaults on women and girls are taking place almost exclusively from within Islamic communities." In fact, the problem of violence against women is widespread and not exclusive to any one community.

Geller absurdly compared NYC mosque to building a KKK "shrine" near black Alabama church. On the August 11 edition of Fox & Friends, Geller absurdly compared building an Islamic cultural center two blocks away from Ground Zero in New York to building a Ku Klux Klan "shrine" near a black church in Alabama.

Texas right-wing radio host on Park51: "I hope somebody blows it up." While discussing Park51 on his May 26 radio show, as Think Progress reported, right-wing Houston radio host Michael Berry said, "I'll tell you this: If you do build a mosque, I hope somebody blows it up."

Geller launches "Leaving Islam" campaign, attacks Park51 as "stab[bing] Americans in the eye." On May 27, Fox & Friends hosted Geller to discuss her "Leaving Islam" campaign, in which she targets people who want to "leave Islam" because it is a "danger" for them to do so. Geller denied that she was encouraging people to "leave Islam." She also touted her "effort" to protest Park51 and wondered why "they would want to stab Americans in the eye" by building the center near the site of the World Trade Center.

Kilmeade asks if the "Islamic community" is "gloating" by building Park51 near Ground Zero. On May 26, Fox & Friends co-host Brian Kilmeade said: "Six-hundred feet from World Tower 1, World Trade Center 1 stood, is this gloating on the part of the Islamic community?" Guest Andrew McCarthy said that this was "Islamist supremacism" and that "well-meaning people would know that this is an affront to common sense." Kilmeade had previously described the Islamic center plans as "an outrage" and accused Muslims of "taunting" 9-11 victims.

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    • Author by progressivevoicedaily (August 26, 2010 12:25 pm ET)
      13 2
      Would we expect anything different? The right wing or conservative media is responsible for it!
      Report Abuse
      • Author by rkcomments (August 26, 2010 4:35 pm ET)
        7  
        And these idiots wonder why America is not respected by the rest of the world. With morons like these within our population who needs enemies abroad.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by Floyd (August 28, 2010 8:45 am ET)
            3
          Factually, rkcomments, it is the liberal theology that is causing the Muslim world to dis-respect America. You are the ones who want abortion. You are the ones who want gay rights. You are the ones who want drug use legalized. ECT ... ECT ... ECT ...

          If you start examining your own positions and the positions that Islam is against, perhaps you would stop blaming others for problems YOU cause. Ahhh, but that is another liberal specialty ... blame others for problems caused by themselves.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by Johaely (August 28, 2010 10:15 pm ET)
            3  
            How about you shut up about liberals not claiming responsability and go tell that to Limbaugh and Palin. Maybe they will follow their own advice on personal responsability.
            Report Abuse
      • Author by peebs755 (August 26, 2010 5:33 pm ET)
        4  
        The idiocy and lunacy is staggering.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by southerngal (August 26, 2010 12:37 pm ET)
      13 4
      The label is irrelevant. And usually pushed by those with agendas. Fact is this mosque issue has fanned the flames of irrational hatred of Muslims by those with agendas, some in the right wing that have stoked the fear factor and now want to distance themselves from what they slyly have peddled.

      Perhaps if they put their moral responsibility above stupid political take-downs for just once, they wouldn't have to rush to keep these enraged nuts on the streets at arm's length.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by nerzog (August 26, 2010 1:02 pm ET)
      8 3
      Jonah Goldberg? What an ignorant son of a b*tch (literally). He's pretending that the attack on the cab driver is the only incident. Maybe that guy was just drunk... but he can't so easily explain away the protests against Mosques all over the country, or the hysteria surrounding the Park51 project.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by Floyd (August 28, 2010 8:50 am ET)
        1 3
        Maybe YOU can explain which part of the liberal theology that Islam supports? Do they support abortion? Do they support gay rights? Do they support decriminalized drug use? Does Islam support socialism?

        Hmmm, seems to me that if Islam is upset with America, it is the LIBERAL's fault! They are the ones protesting for the creation of laws that violate the basic tenants of Islam. But, in true form, liberals will blame everyone (anyone) else for problems caused by them.
        Report Abuse
    • Author by wookie (August 26, 2010 1:17 pm ET)
      10 2
      We'll have to wait for the facts, but even if the allegations prove true, one assault doesn't a national trend make." Goldberg further asserted, "There isn't an anti-Muslim climate."


      Yet a guy with a billy club proves that black people will stop all whites from voting...
      Report Abuse
    • Author by jeter2 (August 26, 2010 2:33 pm ET)
      9 4
      I would suggest that "Islamophobia" in this nation began on 9/11 & likely continued to some extent with every act of terrorism carried out by radical Muslims worldwide.

      However, this controversy regarding the Islamic Community Center has certainly added fuel to fire.

      I'm not sure how anyone can dismiss or deny that anti-Muslim rhetoric regarding that center is behind Islamphobia peaking once again, just as it did on that September morning.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by all your eyes (August 26, 2010 2:52 pm ET)
        8 2
        There's a big difference between the GOP and its media messaging that followed 9/11 and what's happening today. After 9/11, Bush, the GOP, and their media accomplices were as responsible as could be reasonably expected of them in handling the issue of possible anti-Muslim bias. Today's "controversy," however, is totally manufactured by the GOP and its media lackeys. They have intentionally fanned these flames for their own political gain, be it with the Hispanic immigrants, blacks, or Muslims.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by DellDolly (August 26, 2010 3:23 pm ET)
          8 12
          Exactly.

          There was good reason to be angry with a certain group of people after 9/11.

          There's no reason to be angry with the group that wants to build this Islamic Community Center.

          After 9/11, the responsible Republicans warned us against being too broad in our anger. Today, they are fearmongering so that we'll be way too broad in our anger!

          The two behaviors couldn't be more different!
          Report Abuse
          • Author by YouDontMeanThat (August 26, 2010 3:59 pm ET)
            3 3
            If we just didn't have so much Muslim blood on our hands.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by Andy Kreiss (August 26, 2010 7:05 pm ET)
              8 1
              Good point, it would be much easier for the bigots to at least pretend to be on moral high ground if the U.S. didn't have such a nasty history in the middle east.
              Report Abuse
              • Author by Floyd (August 28, 2010 8:58 am ET)
                  4
                Nasty history?!? Are you crazy? Why don't you do a simple google search for killings in the middle east? What blood does the US have on it's hands? A few hundred here or there? We've been at war for 10 years with the fanatics of Islam, are you saying some innocent lives won't be lost? You have no clue (like sue/dell) to what you are talking about. You are a sheeple simple spouting what you are told to spout. Bahhhh
                Report Abuse
                • Author by mary59 (August 28, 2010 11:06 am ET)
                  4  
                  Use the google and try researching the overthrow by U.S. & British agents of a democratic government in Iran in the 1950s, and returning the shah to power, who murdered thousands of his own people.

                  Then the Iraqi invasion which led to the death, maiming and displacement of MILLIONS of Iraqi people.

                  We'll not go back to the Crusades. Your ignorance is distressing.
                  Report Abuse
                  • Author by Floyd (August 28, 2010 10:09 pm ET)
                      5
                    Oh? So, we're going to go back in history and make these comparisons? You'll still find Muslims are responsible for more "innocent Muslim" deaths than America.

                    And the Iraqi invasion? Wow. Ok, how many are dead? How many are maimed? How many are displaced. The discussion is about DEATHS. Let's try to keep the conversation in context when you do your rants.
                    Report Abuse
                    • Author by mary59 (August 29, 2010 11:43 am ET)
                      5  
                      Not much of a conversation. YOU: [discard any fact as irrelevant; change subject when needed; press on with insults and emotional opinions]

                      By the way "going back in history" is the only way to make comparisons as you want to. Or do you want to cite statistics only from August 29, 2010?
                      Report Abuse
      • Author by southerngal (August 26, 2010 4:35 pm ET)
        4 8
        jeter2,

        Your point is a good one. I know you aren't comparing the reactions, but rather the larger point about how fear and those stoking it permeate the overall debate.

        It's pretty clear to most of us, but apparently flew right over the head of a couple people here. No surprise from Sue.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by jeter2 (August 26, 2010 5:07 pm ET)
          4 8
          Exactly, RightOn.

          Ah silly me for thinking that was obvious to certain other folks here...

          And no surprise at all that it flew over DellDollySue's head. Ha!
          Report Abuse
        • Author by DellDolly (August 26, 2010 5:14 pm ET)
          4 9
          Yeah, the thing that flew over someone's head was the fact that I was replying to SOMEONE ELSE, doofus!

          And the POSTERS who had something fly over their heads? That would be you and Jeter.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by southerngal (August 26, 2010 5:40 pm ET)
            4 7
            But your cluelessness went directly to what jeter2 wrote. You own it Sue.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by DellDolly (August 27, 2010 1:25 am ET)
              4 1
              Nope, it didn't actually go directly to what Jeter said - it went directlly to the point that the person I was REPLYING to said.

              This is not rocket science.

              Now, I understand you think that it benefits you to twist my words, and try to make me look bad, but that doesn't make your assertion here true, of course!
              Report Abuse
              • Author by Floyd (August 28, 2010 9:44 am ET)
                  4
                sue-- This is not rocket science.

                Apparently, it IS. Since YOU can't figure it out, it must be harder than 1st grade level material.
                Report Abuse
          • Author by jeter2 (August 26, 2010 5:40 pm ET)
            4 8
            Nice try DoofusDellDollySue but I'll have to give ya a FAIL.

            You were replying directly to a poster who had responded to my post & you agreed with him. What I wrote flew over his head & yours.

            Now go try & play nice with the other posters ::eye roll::
            Report Abuse
            • Author by southerngal (August 26, 2010 5:45 pm ET)
              3 8
              She does herself a huge favor when she just responds, through paranoia, to those evil stealth knife-in-the-gut thumbs down attacks upon her. She can wrap her mind around blind persecution much better than what you did to her, which was make a salient clear point.

              Those always have her spinnin' her wheels.
              Report Abuse
              • Author by rumpleteasermom (August 27, 2010 12:32 am ET)
                6  
                Wow RO and Jeter,you two really ARE clueless.

                Jeter, you said, "I'm not sure how anyone can dismiss or deny that anti-Muslim rhetoric regarding that center is behind Islamphobia peaking once again, just as it did on that September morning."

                Dolly was absolutely correct in pointing out the fact that there is a big difference between the reaction now and the reaction in 2001. In 2001 Bush did one of the few goods things he ever did - he urged people to not paint with too big a brush when assigning blame. He very consistently urged people to remember that the attackers did not represent the whole of Islam.

                Compare that to the current crop of leading Republicans who do nothing but fan the flames.

                In other words, there was no anti-Muslim rhetoric in 2001. Bush kept it in check for the most part.
                Report Abuse
                • Author by DellDolly (August 27, 2010 1:31 am ET)
                  3 4
                  They aren't clueless, though.

                  Their SOLE motivation was their desperate attempt to make ME look bad.

                  They KNOW that what they said makes no sense at all - in fact, if what I said was so outrageous and ridiculous, they would have replied to the person I was replying to, since he was the one who first made the point!

                  But they didn't. Because it wasn't AT ALL about what I actually said. It was SOLELY a personal attack.

                  And HIDING that personal animus that they both hold towards me is an urgent and ongoing and everpresent concern for RightOn - and THAT'S why he made the point above that I am supposedly paranoid - that I think that people are out to get me when there's no evidence of that! But the EVIDENCE available, including on this thread, is that they clearly ARE out to get me!
                  Report Abuse
                  • Author by jeter2 (August 27, 2010 9:56 am ET)
                    1 5
                    Good Golly Miss Dolly you sure are paranoid.

                    Yes the whole world is out to get you. I'm not sure why that is since you are such a kind hearted soul who never indulges in unprovoked personal attacks...oh wait...you do.

                    You get what you give lady.

                    And none of us here need to make you look bad. You do a great job of that all by yourself.
                    Report Abuse
                    • Author by DellDolly (August 27, 2010 2:11 pm ET)
                      2 4
                      Nope, the whole world is NOT out to get me - see, I'm the sane, reasonable one in this interaction, and I acknowledge reality. It's YOU and RightON who failed to acknowledge reality, doofus!

                      And no, I don't EVER indulge in unprovoked personal attacks. You're a liar trying to cover up your bad behavior here.

                      I get attacked all the time without any provocation. I don't attack anyone. I attack nonsense and behavior, not people.

                      YOU attacked a person above - me. If you had been attacking the message, you would have addressed your comment to the person I was replying to! But you didn't.

                      Are you another one of the fools who post here who thinks we can't SEE your previous posts in this string? I swear, get a clue - we CAN.

                      I don't make myself look bad. But it's clear that you and posters like you are desperate to try to make me look bad. I document that on a regular basis, yet YOU guys fail on a regular basis in YOUR attempts to make me look bad, and you failed again in this effort, as Rumpleteasermom pointed out above.
                      Report Abuse
                      • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 2:17 pm ET)
                        1 4
                        Welcome Psych 101 students. For your first assignment of the day, please see the overhead monitor above and tell us how many different disorders "DellDolly" suffers from?

                        The first one to come up with 10 gets an A.

                        Now GO!...
                        Report Abuse
                        • Author by pongotwistleton (August 27, 2010 2:42 pm ET)
                            4
                          I'm not sure Psych 101 is that intense. I think case studies like Dolly are more likely reserved for PhD students. She suffers no run-of-the-mill derangements.
                          Report Abuse
                          • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 2:48 pm ET)
                              4
                            You know how some say if you to learn how to swim, get thrown in the deep end.

                            Same thing :)
                            Report Abuse
                            • Author by pongotwistleton (August 27, 2010 2:53 pm ET)
                                4
                              Good point. No sense coddling the students. Might as well expose them with full-blown cases of insanity -- e.g., Dippy -- from the outset.
                              Report Abuse
                      • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 2:28 pm ET)
                          5
                        "Nope, the whole world is NOT out to get me"

                        "But it's clear that you and posters like you are desperate to try to make me look bad."

                        Loooove that.

                        CLASSIC SUE!
                        Report Abuse
                      • Author by jeter2 (August 27, 2010 3:19 pm ET)
                          5
                        Sane & reasonable are among the last two words anyone would use describing you DoofusDellDollySue. You forget too many have witnessed your antics here.

                        Are you another one of the fools who post here who thinks we can't SEE your previous posts in this string?

                        Who is this "we"...You & your invisible friends? Or the psychiatric team of doctors & nurses that watch over you at the insane asylum you're posting from?

                        Sorry Queen Sue, but you stink out this joint all by yourself. You don't need our help, you do a fine job making yourself look bad.
                        Report Abuse
                        • Author by rumpleteasermom (August 27, 2010 6:10 pm ET)
                          5  
                          You know what? I have issues with Dolly too. But in this case, she is absolutely correct and you are just digging yourselves in deeper and deeper.
                          Report Abuse
                          • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 6:14 pm ET)
                              3
                            So you are saying Dolly knows more about what jeter2 meant than he did? Because that is crux of this disagreement.
                            Report Abuse
                            • Author by rumpleteasermom (August 28, 2010 12:15 am ET)
                              4  
                              No. I'm saying she pointed out how what he said was flawed. I'm saying that her claim about you (essentially that you would jump all over her if she said the sky was blue) was correct as well.

                              Prove me wrong and stop attacking her every post for once.
                              Report Abuse
                              • Author by Floyd (August 28, 2010 9:30 am ET)
                                  4
                                rump-- I'm saying that her claim about you (essentially that you would jump all over her if she said the sky was blue) was correct as well.

                                Sue/dell will call every poster, who doesn't agree with her, some kind of vial name. ANY time she does that, she denies she did it. Perhaps YOU can't read either, but as sue/dell pointed out, EVERY post is there to be read, so read them. After that, you can continue your blind faith in and admiration of sue/dell for whatever reasons you choose.

                                BTW, if sue/dell ever said the sky was blue, there would be world-wide earthquakes and floods, because she NEVER speaks the truth, unless she slips in one word of it mixed in with all the hateful comments she makes.
                                Report Abuse
                                • Author by rumpleteasermom (August 29, 2010 12:38 am ET)
                                  5  
                                  Did you miss this:
                                  You know what? I have issues with Dolly too.
                                  ????


                                  Yes, she has a tendency to say everyone is out to get her, but even the paranoid are right sometimes. This happens to be one of those times. RO is completely incapable of responding rationally to anything she says at this point. I don't know the reason for the animosity, it has been going on as long as I've been here, but I CAN see that in this case, she made a perfectly reasonable comment and they bashed her like they always do.
                                  Report Abuse
                • Author by jeter2 (August 27, 2010 9:51 am ET)
                    6
                  Good grief rumpleteasermom, how much simpler do I have to make this for ya?

                  What I said is that both 9/11 & the controversy surrounding the Islam Community Center sparked by the rhetoric of the Right had resulted in "Islamophobia" peaking again.

                  Can you deny that?

                  Both situations have had similar results. That's ALL.

                  I wasn't suggesting there weren't differences. One was a terrorist act. The other is the result of fear, anger & bigotry fueled in large part by those seeking to make it a political issue.

                  Now that's not to say that those who lost family & friends on 9/11 don't have their own personal reasons for opposing this Muslim Center, but my point & the one that you, Dell & AllYourEyes seem to remain clueless about is that whatever the reason....the result is the same....the peaking of Islamophobia.
                  Report Abuse
                  • Author by rumpleteasermom (August 27, 2010 6:36 pm ET)
                    4  
                    So, let me get this straight - you are saying that the reaction of the people and of members of the government to 9/11, the reaction which remained sane for the most part and focused on the segment of Islam that had gone off the deep end into extremism (well except for the administration's fixation on Iraq it stayed sane) instead of claim all of Islam was evil, is exactly the same as the vitriolic nonsense being spewed by the right and riling up a certain segment of the population to make them think all of Islam is evil incarnate?

                    Those are the two things you are equating? You are calling both of those reactions a peak in Islamophobia?
                    Report Abuse
                    • Author by Floyd (August 28, 2010 9:25 am ET)
                        5
                      That explains why YOU don't get it either. I fully expect sue/dell to not get it, but she is a total paranoid schizo.

                      It is obvious he is saying that both events caused an upswing in "islamophobia". You are arguing over the 'reasons' after he offered a known fact.

                      It's also obvious the right-wing media empire you liberals fear so much can't be at fault. Unless democratic senators are part of that empire. The nations TOP democrat, Harry Reid, is against the mosque. is HE part of the right-wing media? Newt Gingrich says the president is "pandering to radical islam".
                      Report Abuse
                      • Author by rumpleteasermom (August 29, 2010 12:44 am ET)
                        4  
                        And YOU seem to have missed the fact that the conversation went off on a tangent with all your eyes' comment - which is what Dolly was responding to.

                        As for Harry Reid - did you expect anything else in an election year with the right-wing media portraying the community center as a terrorist training ground/victory mosque?
                        Report Abuse
      • Author by RedChocobo (August 26, 2010 5:01 pm ET)
        7  
        I agree with what you are saying, Islamophobia never really ended. However, as a country that preaches tolerance and freedom, those who claim fervently that they are "real Americans" should practice what they preach.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by jeter2 (August 26, 2010 5:24 pm ET)
          4 5
          I've tried to view both sides of this controversy with an open-mind, trying to understand the obvious fear & anger of opponents of this Islamic Community Center being built within a certain distance of Ground Zero. Yes, they have the right to build there. But this is a very emotional & sensitive issue for many average New Yorkers as well as others around the country.

          Some on the Right have jumped in & tried to keep the rhetoric going which has resulted in keeping the anger & fear level high. If folks are truly against this Islamic Center for their own personal reasons, then you may have to accept that. You won't change their minds. What we shouldn't accept or tolerate is this situation being ratcheted up by politicians hoping to make it an election wedge issue.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by RedChocobo (August 26, 2010 6:24 pm ET)
            6 2
            I continue to agree with you. They do have the right and yes, a community center so close to ground zero when apparently a large majority of people blame all of Islam for the attacks of September 11 probably isn't the greatest idea in the world, but those who are protesting it are protesting against Islam itself and that protest is counter to American values. Islam did not attack us on 9/11, Bin Laden did. Whether he used religion as his justification for the attacks is irrelevant. I suppose that is my biggest gripe, their protest is okay, but the signs shown above and the quotes given from prominent Republicans are counter to American values. Bin Laden says the US wants war against Islam, do we want to prove him right?
            Report Abuse
          • Author by Andy Kreiss (August 26, 2010 11:34 pm ET)
            2  
            Hey Jeter, funny you should be here with your "can't we all get along" message. I saw a similar one today.

            [http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f262/Captain_Dick/panchito.jpg]
            Report Abuse
            • Author by jeter2 (August 27, 2010 10:00 am ET)
              2 4
              Ha! Now if you can find a photo with the Yanks & Red Sox on one vehicle I'll know for sure world peace is just around the corner ;-)
              Report Abuse
    • Author by RedChocobo (August 26, 2010 4:09 pm ET)
      7 1
      Land of the free...
      These guys must just love to prove Bin Laden right.
      Report Abuse
    • Author by seahawks123 (August 26, 2010 6:04 pm ET)
        13
      No one is saying they can't build the Mosque, (you can call it a community center but it's still a Mosque), if they truly wanted to fence mend they would respect the opinions of 70% of the country that oppose it. Don't throw out "religious freedom" every Christmas or Christian holiday you libs do everything you can to call it something else or silence it all together. You libs are just anti-American and anything against it is good by you. Do you honestly think that there is no politics in this? In the Muslim community they are one and the same.
      Report Abuse
      • Author by raddave43 (August 26, 2010 6:15 pm ET)
        9  
        So Islam is against America? You truely are an ignorant A$$
        Report Abuse
      • Author by southerngal (August 26, 2010 6:27 pm ET)
        4 4
        Seahawks,

        It's a private entity, it's none of the government's business though. That is where I come down on this. I understand there may be legitimate concerns over this mosque from some, but the owners are not obligated to cater to that. If they want too, that is their business. If they don't, also, their business.

        And I do agree with you, this is all about politics. This is far less about Islam than it is about politics.
        Report Abuse
        • Author by DellDolly (August 27, 2010 1:36 am ET)
          5 1
          Nope, there are no legitimate concerns over this.

          None. Not one.
          Report Abuse
          • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 11:16 am ET)
              5
            You have no business telling someone else how valid or invalid their feelings or their reactions are, so stop looking like a complete idiot.
            Report Abuse
            • Author by DellDolly (August 27, 2010 2:15 pm ET)
              3 1
              Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but not their own facts.

              There are NO legitimate concerns over the building of this Islamic Community Center. None. Not one.

              Those are the facts. There are no opinions that can be supported by those facts that would justify being upset by the building of this center. None. Not one.

              There are no legitimate reasons to believe that one will fall off the edge of a flat earth if one travels too far out into the ocean. There are no legitimate concerns about that danger!

              It's the same thing.

              The complete idiot, overcome by his personal animus, is YOU. You don't just LOOK like that, you continue to PROVE that you ARE a complete idiot.
              Report Abuse
              • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 2:21 pm ET)
                  5
                Baloney. If someone is bothered or uncomfortable because of the mosque's location, they are entitled to feel that way. That doesn't mean the owners have to cater to those feelings, but they are not invalid, and they are not facts, you moron. They are feelings, they are legitimate concerns over one's feelings.

                If you can't understand that, forget it.
                Report Abuse
                • Author by mary59 (August 27, 2010 2:53 pm ET)
                  5  
                  70% of those polled are irrational in their thinking about this. If you want to be consistent, you'd give it no life whatsoever.
                  Report Abuse
                  • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 2:58 pm ET)
                      5
                    That is not the point. If someone is uncomfortable, then they are uncomfortable. Their feelings are not invalid or illegitimate, or irrational. That also doesn't mean they may want the mosque moved, they just feel uncomfortable with it. DollySue has no right to crap on those feelings in her typical elitist condescending fashion, just as those who are building the mosque don't have to take those feelings into regard either.
                    Report Abuse
                    • Author by mary59 (August 27, 2010 3:03 pm ET)
                      6  
                      ? Don't bring anyone else into this. "Feelings" are suddenly important to you?

                      By the way, their FEELINGS are indeed irrational.
                      You are wrong. Bye and have a good day.
                      Report Abuse
                      • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 3:09 pm ET)
                          5
                        Well bye yourself, if you can't make your point any better than that, well, bye then.
                        Report Abuse
                        • Author by jeter2 (August 27, 2010 3:29 pm ET)
                            5
                          Ah RightOn you know how some here are...if you don't agree with them 100% they tell you..You're wrong.. then take their ball& bat & leave in a huff ;-)

                          Don't you know by now that only the Dem/Lib point of view is rational? Other opinions/feelings don't count for beans.
                          Report Abuse
                          • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 3:33 pm ET)
                              5
                            I know all too well. It's ridiculous though. Just because someone may have an uncomfortable feeling about the mosque either means they are irrational but most likely a bigot.

                            More irrational intolerance from supposed tolerant liberals.
                            Report Abuse
                            • Author by mary59 (August 27, 2010 4:41 pm ET)
                              6  
                              Tell me about rational vs irrational--from above article which you undoubtedly both read:

                              Some opponents have cited traffic and parking concerns. But the objections have focused overwhelmingly on more intangible and volatile issues: fear of terrorism, distrust of Islam and a linkage of the two in opponents' minds.

                              ''Wouldn't you agree that every terrorist, past and present, has come out of a mosque?'' asked one woman who stood up Wednesday night during a civic association meeting on Staten Island to address representatives of a group that wants to convert a Roman Catholic convent into a mosque in the Midland Beach neighborhood.

                              ''No,'' began Ayman Hammous, president of the Staten Island branch of the group, the Muslim American Society -- though the rest of his answer was drowned out by catcalls and boos from among the 400 people who packed the gymnasium of a community center.

                              [...]

                              ''We are newcomers, and newcomers in America have always had to prove their loyalty,'' said Mahdi Bray, the society's executive director. ''It's an old story. You have to have thick skin.''

                              That admonition was tested on Wednesday, as irate residents took turns at the microphone, demanding answers from the three Muslim men who had accepted the get-acquainted invitation of the civic association.

                              ''I was on the phone this morning with the F.B.I., and all I want to know from you is why MAS is on the terrorist watch list,'' said Joan Moriello, using the acronym for the Muslim American Society. Her question produced a loud, angry noise from the audience.

                              Mr. Hammous, a physical therapist who lives on Staten Island, exchanged a puzzled look with two other Muslim men who had joined him on the podium, both officers of the society's Brooklyn branch, which operates a mosque in Bensonhurst and faces opposition to opening another in Sheepshead Bay.

                              ''Your information is incorrect, madam,'' he replied. ''We are not on any watch list.'' The other men, Mohamed Sadeia and Abdel Hafid Djamil, shook their heads in agreement.
                              Report Abuse
                              • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 5:04 pm ET)
                                  4
                                You are confusing legitimate concerns over this mosque's location with illegitimate reasons to demand it be moved.

                                To say that some people have concerns over some of Rauf's comments is not illegitimate. He is the one spearheading this mosque, he is the face of it. You don't have to be irrational to have some general thoughtful concerns over this mosque. Not everyone that does is some Fox, tea party bigot who carries hideous signs like the ones this website looooves to display.

                                You apparently buy into it.



                                Report Abuse
                                • Author by mary59 (August 27, 2010 5:21 pm ET)
                                  6  
                                  There really aren't any legitimate concerns that I've noticed. "Some of his comments" ? Haven't seen any of his comments that were unreasonable or controversial really. Just stick a microphone in your face for a while & see what someone could do if they wanted to.

                                  For a Libertarian, you certainly seem invested in your "feelings" about this issue. It's a free country, it's an old coat factory, it's not at "ground zero", the man is a Sufi and a fine person. You confusing yourself.
                                  Report Abuse
                                  • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 5:28 pm ET)
                                      4
                                    Forget it. If you think that anyone who disagrees you with your position on this mosque is somehow irrational and illegitimate, then you are just naive, intolerant, pig headed and unfair. You have confused yourself into thinking that everyone unlike you is a sign wielding bigot, it makes it easier for you to argue your point I suppose if you can lump everyone who disagrees with you into the camp of illegitimacy.

                                    Liberals, they are never really sure of their positions or what they believe so it's much easier to categorize all other opposing opinions as just nutty and irrational.
                                    Report Abuse
                                    • Author by mary59 (August 27, 2010 6:21 pm ET)
                                      5  
                                      Good projection mr. right. However, I will give you credit. You're able to articulate a reasonable position on one thread and an entirely illogical one on this one.
                                      Report Abuse
                                      • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 6:24 pm ET)
                                          4
                                        No problem, glad to see the ones you agree with are reasonable and the ones you don't are illogical.

                                        That pretty much sums up what I have been saying.
                                        Report Abuse
                          • Author by pearlene_scott1602 (August 27, 2010 11:07 pm ET)
                            6  
                            Don't you know by now that only the Dem/Lib point of view is rational? Other opinions/feelings don't count for beans.

                            Jeter, that dig was beneath you!

                            I'll be the first to admit, I don't get the arguments against the community center.

                            I think many folks don't want to admit that their main objection is simply because it's a Muslim community center, for fear they will be labeled a bigot or a racist.

                            But I'm not sure what else to call them, if their only objection is because it's a Muslim community center.

                            There is a Mosque 4 blocks from ground zero and it's been there long BEFORE the twin towers were built. They have existed there peacefully and had had no objections or problems so why the hysteria over a community center?

                            For me, it's hard to how you can hate ALL Muslims, completely ignoring the fact that there were Muslims also killed on 9/11.

                            Does that fact escape the minds of those who objects to the center? Do folks think that only Americans were killed?

                            I've also heard that we should respect the families of those who were killed on 9/11, but do you just ignore the Muslims families of those who were killed?

                            ANYTIME, Americans allow racial prejudice, hysteria and ignorance to rule, the terrorists have won.

                            As a country, we made similar mistakes with Native Americans, African Americans and Japanese Americans and once again, we're doing it with Muslim Americans.

                            If not now, when will we learn?
                            Report Abuse
              • Author by jeter2 (August 27, 2010 3:22 pm ET)
                  5
                Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but not their own facts.

                Hey that was Sue's favorite catch phrase. Funny DellDolly uses it too, eh?

                HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
                Report Abuse
            • Author by mikehuck1976 (August 27, 2010 4:06 pm ET)
              4  
              We know, right on, we know. You right-wingers always relying on pure emotion and no facts. It is hard to debate someone arguing from that viewpoint.
              Report Abuse
              • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 4:11 pm ET)
                  4
                It's not about arguing. It's about telling someone who may have uncomfortable feelings about the mosque, for any number of reasons, that their feelings are irrational or illegitimate. That is absurd.
                Report Abuse
              • Author by southerngal (August 27, 2010 4:14 pm ET)
                  4
                Actually my original comments were legitimate concerns, which many people have over the mosque location. Those are not irrational, despite the intolerance of certain liberals who have responded.
                Report Abuse
      • Author by RedChocobo (August 26, 2010 6:32 pm ET)
        5  
        See, you started out pretty good there... Then you went Republican. Since ad hominem seems to be the theme of the day: you radical righties are un-American just want to silence everyone in his country who isn't Christian. Sound about right?
        Report Abuse
      • Author by watershed (August 26, 2010 6:56 pm ET)
        11 1
        Seahawks, not sure if you usually post and run like some of the other right wing trolls, but I wanna respond anyway.

        The Park 51? It's a JCC. It's a YMCA. It's a cultural outreach. And if it WAS literally a JCC or Y, NO-ONE would have this problem. You neither, I dare say.

        I'm an atheist. And as one, I admit freely that Islam is a HUGE worldwide problem, even in the scope of the huge worldwide problem all religions pose; with it's casual, lifelong brainwashing of otherwise rational minds. None of them are freely blowing themselves up. That is a big, big difference that needs serious attention.

        But this place is the very moderate middle ground everyone ostensibly wants. And we are taking the outreach, and we are F**KING IT UP.
        We are slapping the hand of reconciliation and giving back the middle finger. And this trend towards violence is only going to get worse. And with every act of violence, bit by bit, we become the same as the ones we supposedly protest.

        I am amazed more people can't see that. The WORLD is watching.

        Report Abuse
        • Author by Andy Kreiss (August 26, 2010 7:12 pm ET)
          9 1
          Good post, watershed, very reasonable and thought provoking.

          But you obviously don't know seahawks if you posted that in the hopes of repairing some of the damage exhibited in his incoherent posts. He doesn't seem to be capable of anything but hearing and repeating the most simplistic right wing propaganda.

          Good luck, anyway. :0)
          Report Abuse
          • Author by watershed (August 26, 2010 8:48 pm ET)
            8  
            Thanks, Andy. I don't know seahawks. I'm new. Or new again. I posted regularly back in the golden age of Tommy. These young trolls are all fresh meat to me. Just thought I'd chime in.

            You seem like you've got things under control here, anyway. Carry on. :)
            Report Abuse
            • Author by Andy Kreiss (August 26, 2010 11:59 pm ET)
              6  
              Don't get me wrong, nothing wrong with laying out a well-reasoned post to destroy the wingnuts pablum. There's always the chance that a potential seahawks is lurking and reading, sitting on the fence, thinking about going over to the wingnut side.

              Seeing the GOP talking points laughed out of the room might be a factor in saving a brain.

              I only meant that you shouldn't hold your breath waiting for seahawks to comprehend what you wrote, or to give an intelligent reply.
              Report Abuse
        • Author by DellDolly (August 27, 2010 1:40 am ET)
          6 1
          The head of the Jewish Community Center in NYC was actually on a talk show along with the wife (Daisy) of the Islamic Imam.

          She is fully in favor of this place, because she understands what's going on. Only people who distort the evidence we have about this peaceful Sufi sect, the Imam, or Islam in general have an issue with this community center.
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      • Author by DellDolly (August 27, 2010 1:35 am ET)
        4 1
        No, it's an Islamic Community Center that will have a mosque in it. If you just want to call it one thing, it's a community center. If you want to say that it's a community center with a mosque in it, that's fine, but it's NOT a mosque. You're a liar.

        We don't get to restrict a religious community's rights based upon majority rule, doofus. I don't care what percentage of the American public is either afraid of Muslims or hates them - it doesn't make them right or mean that we should condone their bigotry and/or lack of education and/or the disinformation campaign by rightwingers!
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      • Author by mikehuck1976 (August 27, 2010 4:04 pm ET)
        4  
        Don't throw out "religious freedom" every Christmas or Christian holiday you libs do everything you can to call it something else or silence it all together. - seahawks

        Wow. Just imagine how ignorant and sheltered from reality you have to be in order to believe that there are protests against Christmas every year. You must not make it out of your mom's basement very often, hawks. Next time, come out anytime after November 1st and you will find every store full of Christmas goods and nearly every block decorated with Christian symbols. I, not being religious, actually kind of like the season. For those of us that are grownups we know the true religion of Christmas is commerce. But please, carry on with your paranoid delusions.
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        • Author by rumpleteasermom (August 27, 2010 6:44 pm ET)
          4  
          I always find that argument gives me a bit of a chuckle. I joined an e-mail list for a reenactment group I'm in several years ago. The first three years I was there, people posted things like, "I don't care who complains, I'm wishing you all a merry Christmas!" Then they would go on to claim that the list was not accepting and people would trying to silence them. Funny thing, no one ever did. Those of us on the list who celebrated some other holiday simply thanked them and wished them a happy whatever we celebrated.

          One year, someone (not me) finally cracked and went off on them for accusing us of being intolerant when no one had said a bad word to or about them for years while they said nasty things about us. They haven't done it for the last few years, but I know it will start up again eventually. They seem only to be happy if they are claiming persecution.
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    • Author by chrisgodawgs (August 27, 2010 10:11 am ET)
      4 1
      Irony: "They attacked us because they hate our freedom." But the right doesn't want US Muslims to have freedom.

      Anyone who says there is no "Islamaphobia" rampant in this country is a moron.
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