“Not racist at all”: Rosen defends Owens and Lamm

Over the past two weeks, and most recently on the August 3 and 4 broadcasts of his radio show, Mike Rosen has repeatedly defended controversial statements by former Gov. Richard Lamm and current Gov. Bill Owens linking cultural values of various racial and ethnic groups to educational or economic achievement, remarks deemed “racist” by Colorado Republican Party chairman Bob Martinez.

Over the past two weeks, and most recently on the August 3 and 4 broadcasts of his Newsradio 850 KOA radio show, Rocky Mountain News columnist Mike Rosen has repeatedly defended controversial statements by former Reform Party presidential candidate and former Gov. Richard Lamm (D) and current Gov. Bill Owens (R) linking cultural values of various racial and ethnic groups to educational or economic achievement, remarks deemed “racist” by Colorado Republican Party chairman Bob Martinez.

On the August 3 broadcast of The Mike Rosen Show, during a discussion of the latest results of the Colorado Student Assessment Program (CSAP) scores, both Rosen and Owens defended Lamm, who suggested in his 2006 book, Two Wands, One Nation (Fulcrum Publishing, January 2006), that “underperformance” by African-Americans and Hispanic-Americans could be remedied by “infus[ing] the inhabitants [of 'the ghettos and barrios of America'] with Japanese or Jewish values, respect for learning and ambition.” The Vail Daily reported on July 25 that, in a July 24 speech, Lamm also stated: “I believe that there's elements of the Hispanic culture both here and in Mexico and Central America and South America that are simply not success-producing of the kind that other immigrant groups have had.”

Defending Lamm, Rosen said: “I support the essence of what he [Lamm] said ... about Jewish and Japanese culture being much more strongly oriented toward educational achievement, I think, are right on target. That's one measure of it. Asian kids: 71 percent proficient in reading. We see the much lower scores for Hispanic and black.” As reported by The Denver Post and the Rocky Mountain News on August 4, Owens, referring to his own children, said: “There are many days ... when I wish they'd have more aspects of Jewish and Asian culture. I wish they'd get up earlier in the morning. I wish they would work harder, and in many respects, that's what we do see out of many Asian and the Jewish culture.” Owens added: “So, I don't think Dick Lamm was being in any way racist and I think some of the response to him has been knee-jerk. I think that we need to have a debate on what it is about certain backgrounds that leads to more success.”

In its August 4 article on Owens's remarks, the Post noted that “Martinez called the remarks by Lamm and Owens racist. He said he was 'flabbergasted' by Owens' comments.” According to the Post, Martinez stated: “What he said is racist and bigotry. ... Even if it's a positive stereotyping, it's wrong.”

But on the August 4 broadcast of his show, Rosen defended Owens's remarks, calling the criticism Owens had received an “outrageous overreaction.” Rosen explained:

ROSEN: We were talking about CSAP scores and how they break down by gender and by race -- that information is reported -- and tying that to Governor Lamm's recent comments on immigration reform, where the governor said that if he had a magic wand to wave and could help infuse some traditional Japanese and Jewish cultures regarding commitment to education and related cultural values, if that could somehow be magically infused on blacks and Hispanics to a greater degree than it is, then it would produce a desirable outcome.

Rosen added: “I found those remarks well-intentioned, not racist at all.” Later, Rosen referred to “the benefits that would accrue if more Hispanic families and more black families were more like the bulk of Japanese and Jewish families that highly value education and do whatever they can to influence their kids to succeed in their educational career.”

Rosen also defended Lamm's statements in his August 4 Rocky Mountain News column, writing: “Japanese and Jewish kids just don't drop out of school. They're programmed from an early age by their parents and their racial-ethnic-religious culture to place a high value on education as the pathway to personal fulfillment and success.” He added: “Other minority groups lobby for racial preferences in college admissions when their academic qualifications fall below standards.”

Discussing criticism of Lamm, Rosen also wrote in his column:

Ironically, even Bruce DeBosky of the Jewish Anti-Defamation League piled on, declaring that Lamm's remarks “can lead to greater prejudice rather than to greater understanding.” Apparently unafflicted with the liberal, Jewish guilt-complex, Japanese-Americans have been modestly silent.

In their knee-jerk criticism of Lamm, all of these racially hypersensitive critics have failed to make the distinction between a valid generalization and a blanket condemnation of any and everyone pigeonholed by an accident of birth.

Lamm's remarks have been a frequent topic of conversation on Rosen's show. As Colorado Media Matters noted, while defending Lamm on his July 27 show, Rosen said that “there simply isn't any question that the Jewish culture and the Japanese culture highly value education. And, by comparison, in this society, the Hispanic subculture and the African-American subculture in general seem to value it less than the Japanese and Jewish subculture.” Rosen continued: “That doesn't mean that individual black or Hispanic families don't include people who highly value education. And if you're a black or Hispanic kid born to parents who value education, you've got a huge advantage over other people in your neighborhood born to parents who don't value it.” Rosen added, “I mean, this stuff is so obvious, it's beyond debate. And, in essence, this is what Dick Lamm is saying.”

In recent days, Rosen has also made other generalizations about Jews. On his August 1 show, Rosen stated: “From a personality standpoint, it's probably fair to say that Jews have a tendency toward pushiness and ostentatiousness.”

On August 4, the Anti-Defamation League's Mountain States Regional Director Bruce H. DeBoskey stated in a press release:

“The Anti-Defamation League is deeply concerned about the use of over generalizations and stereotypes about ethnic, racial and religious groups that have been expressed recently by prominent Coloradoans.

[...]

”ADL calls upon our community leaders in government, politics and media to recognize the power of their words, to refrain from assigning characteristics to whole groups of people, and to create a community environment where stereotypes are never left unchallenged."

From the August 3 broadcast of Newsradio 850 KOA's The Mike Rosen Show:

ROSEN: They have a chart here in the Rocky [Mountain News] special session -- excuse me, special section -- we'll talk about the special session later -- with ethnic breakdowns. Grade 10, for example, reading: white kids -- 77 percent proficient or advanced; Hispanic kids -- only 43 percent proficient or advanced; black: 49 percent proficient or advanced; Asian and Pacific Islanders -- 71 percent proficient or advanced. Governor Lamm's comments, for which he's been taking some heat lately -- although I support the essence of what he said --

OWENS: Hmm-uh.

ROSEN: -- about Jewish and Japanese culture being much more strongly oriented toward educational achievement, I think, are right on target. And that's one measure of it. Asian kids: 71 percent proficient in reading. We see the much lower scores for Hispanic and black.

OWENS: You know, I've known Dick Lamm for 25 or 30 years and there isn't a racist bone in his body. He, in fact, was commenting -- and this wasn't new to Dick Lamm, he's talked about this dichotomy for years, the way that different cultures value different things. There are many days -- and I'm the parent of three -- three, I don't want to call them children, our daughter's 22 -- many days, when I wish they'd have more aspects of Jewish and Asian culture. I wish they'd get up earlier in the morning. I wish they would work harder, and in many respects, that's what we do see out of many Asian and the Jewish culture. My kids are all Anglo; they're Irish-English, and they're wonderful kids, and I wish they worked a little harder sometimes. Sometimes, I wish that I had some more of those traits. So, I don't think Dick Lamm was being in any way racist, and I think some of the response to him has been knee-jerk. I think that we need to have a debate on what it is about certain backgrounds that leads to more success.

From the August 4 broadcast of The Mike Rosen Show:

ROSEN: We've got some juicy topics to kick around this morning, certainly including the outrageous overreaction to some comments that Governor Owens made when he was on our show yesterday for his regular monthly visit. We were talking about CSAP scores and how they break down by gender and by race -- that information is reported -- and tying that to Governor Lamm's recent comments on immigration reform, where the governor said that if he had a magic wand to wave and could help infuse some traditional Japanese and Jewish cultures regarding commitment to education and related cultural values, if that could somehow be magically infused on blacks and Hispanics to a greater degree than it is, then it would produce a desirable outcome. I found those remarks well-intentioned, not racist at all. And the government supported -- excuse me, the governor supported -- Governor Owens, that is -- supported Governor Lamm yesterday and some people have been trying to make a big deal out of that. My column this morning, coincidentally, was on the same topic. So, I'll be happy to discuss that with you.

And people who have gotten in a high dudgeon about this, I find that one common thread is so many of them fail to understand the definition of a generalization. A generalization doesn't have to apply to every case; that's why it's called a generalization. If it were an absolute fact that left no room for exceptions, it wouldn't be a generalization. A stereotype is something that conforms to a general pattern. The key word in there is “general.” So, if someone were to say, “You are Hispanic, therefore that means you must be a high school dropout,” that would be an idiotic thing to say. However, the statistics don't lie. And if the dropout rate in the Denver schools is about 50 percent for Hispanics, then you can make the general comment that Hispanics have a very high dropout rate. It certainly leaves plenty of room for exception for individual Hispanics.

Senator Ken Salazar [D-CO], for example, was one who took exception to Governor Lamm's remarks, citing his own family's personal history where his mother and father, Emma and Henry, were very dedicated to education and as a consequence, all eight of their children -- including Ken Salazar -- were college graduates. Wonderful. They're to be commended for that. It doesn't alter the validity of the generalization. And it doesn't alter the benefits that would accrue if more Hispanic families and more black families were more like the bulk of Japanese and Jewish families that highly value education and do whatever they can to influence their kids to succeed in their educational career. You can make every one of those statements without the risk of being called a racist by anybody who's fair-minded and reasonable. Of course, you can't protect yourself from being called a racist by people who are racist themselves and who aren't fair-minded or reasonable, but are looking for an opportunity to exploit honest, unbigoted statements in order to put themselves in a superior position, criticizing others. In any event, happy to talk about that this morning.