JOHN BERMAN (HOST): I don't think you [and Rudy Giuliani] can both be right or maybe you're both wrong and we’re just fair and we treat everyone pretty tough.
DAVID BROCK: I think everybody has their point to make on media bias. It surfaces from time to time, one side or another. We don't paint with a broad brush that the entire media is against Hillary Clinton, but I'll tell you, Giuliani tried to cite some surveys. If you really do look at the surveys and look at any objective, quantifiable evidence, she gets a harder time than Donald Trump.
BERMAN: That's not what Rudy Giuliani says.
BROCK: I know that. And I’m just saying, he has his facts wrong because there was a study out of Harvard that looked at 2015 and showed that she had by far more negative coverage. He had more volume and more positive coverage.
BERMAN: People complain about the media all the time. Do you guys think it's effective?
BROCK: I think when it’s the right thing to raise, it needs to be raised. And I do think it can work politically in certain contexts, sure. I don't think we're making allegations that aren't grounded in reality. I think the right wing has perfected this for 30 years and their base really does respond to this notion of liberal media bias.
BERMAN: In a way, you say you respect the argument?
BROCK: I think it was brilliant when they started doing this in the 1960s, sure. But our criticism is very different. Our criticism is very fact-based. We’re not making loose allegations of bias. And I think we've proven our case over time that there's a double standard when it comes to the Clintons with a lot of the media.
